Forced organ donations

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-23 11:40pm

The problem is, what sort of person would find it bearable to cut open living human beings and extract their organs on a regular basis?

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-23 11:45pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:The problem is, what sort of person would find it bearable to cut open living human beings and extract their organs on a regular basis?

The same people who perform organ transplants now?

kojikun · Post by **kojikun** » 2003-05-23 11:55pm

And Mengele, but he didn't do it for the nobler cause. Unless youre a fucking Nazi, in which case you can die.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-05-23 11:59pm

I read somewhere that Mengele commissioned a musical composition to be played for test subjects as they were killed. Sickening.

And on a somewhat off-topic binge, I also recall hearing from one of my history teachers that the experiments performed on German concentration camp victims advanced our medical science years in excession of what it would have been otherwise. True?

Newtonian Fury · Post by **Newtonian Fury** » 2003-05-24 12:26am

Sea Skimmer wrote:The PRC does that, though I believe they simply shoot them in the back of the head.

Yep.

Healthy and acceptable prisoners are first given a relaxent. Then the relevent organs are harvested. Occasionally, the organs might be sold to foreign buyers.

There was a piece in 60 Minutes on this Chinese government practice. It was suppose to make it look horrible and inhumane or something

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-05-24 02:32am

I think it HAS increased our knowledge of human biology...I remember hearing about how some Jews are bitching that we use that information for science.

Forceful taking of organs does seem a little creepy, though one can't really argue against it since we're talking about people who tear the fetuses out of late-term pregant women and whatnot.

Oh, by the way: My grandmother watched Oprah all the time now, and I'm usually forced to listen to it because I live here. Once she had on a Governor from Illonois(?) that pardoned almost all the death row inmates, even one who did just what I described. Fucking bleeding hearts make me want to vomit. Take them to the Colussium(sp?), I say!

Newtonian Fury · Post by **Newtonian Fury** » 2003-05-24 02:37pm

This isn't about using prisoners for experiments (Jews and WWII). This is about harvesting people who've been sentenced to execution. My point was, there shouldn't be such an uproar over harvesting organs of criminals sentenced to die. Other things, like whether they received a proper trial, isn't the issue.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-24 05:45pm

Durran Korr wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:The problem is, what sort of person would find it bearable to cut open living human beings and extract their organs on a regular basis?
The same people who perform organ transplants now?

The difference is that those people put other organs IN to replace them.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-05-24 05:52pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:The problem is, what sort of person would find it bearable to cut open living human beings and extract their organs on a regular basis?
The same people who perform organ transplants now?
The difference is that those people put other organs IN to replace them.

No they don't. People who perform organ transplants must harvest them from people who have died, such as people in car accidents or people who are brain-dead and whose relatives elect to pull the plug. They don't put anything in to replace them.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-05-24 11:05pm

Durran Korr wrote:I read somewhere that Mengele commissioned a musical composition to be played for test subjects as they were killed. Sickening.

And on a somewhat off-topic binge, I also recall hearing from one of my history teachers that the experiments performed on German concentration camp victims advanced our medical science years in excession of what it would have been otherwise. True?

It's some what sickening but true. Quite a bit of the data would be extremely difficult to obtain otherwise. I believe a lot was learned from the experiements about extreme conditions. Of course quite a bit of it was just sick curiosity type stuff too.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-05-24 11:07pm

I agree with the idea of force organ harvesting. Why not force the murderer the repay his debt to society that way? It'd certainly be appropriate and poetic justice. And if he's dead it's not like he'd need them.

Post by **Gandalf** » 2003-05-25 12:17am

Or, cheaper than a bullet, why not just behead them, if done rght, it's clean.

And another thing, couldn't we just nick organs out of dead folk anyway?, It's not like anyone's really gonna check.

Post by **Beowulf** » 2003-05-25 12:49am

I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2003-05-25 01:01am

Bootleggers during the depression.

I'm all for taking the organs of death-row inmates. Let'em do something useful for society.

ben · Post by **ben** » 2003-05-25 05:11am

Beowulf wrote:I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)

The Jigsaw Man by Larry Niven. Cookie?

Newtonian Fury · Post by **Newtonian Fury** » 2003-05-25 03:44pm

Beowulf wrote:I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)

I've read Niven's books, and using draconian laws to execute people for their organs could become a problem. But overpopulation was the main basis for such laws in Niven-verse. With sensible population growths, (I hope) this won't become a reality. Even China doesn't execute people who commit minor crimes, and it has the largest population in the world.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-05-25 03:54pm

Gandalf wrote:Or, cheaper than a bullet, why not just behead them, if done rght, it's clean.

Gillotine?

And another thing, couldn't we just nick organs out of dead folk anyway?, It's not like anyone's really gonna check.

Bristol Childrens Hospital springs to mind. They got caught doing something similar.

As I'm against the death penalty for most people (Absurdly bad serial killers, fundie terrorists and the like notwithstanding) anyway, it doesn't bother me.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-05-25 05:14pm

Darth Wong wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Durran Korr wrote: The same people who perform organ transplants now?
The difference is that those people put other organs IN to replace them.
No they don't. People who perform organ transplants must harvest them from people who have died, such as people in car accidents or people who are brain-dead and whose relatives elect to pull the plug. They don't put anything in to replace them.

Notice my original post. I said "cut open living human beings and extract their organs". Unless we take the route where the condemned get a bullet to the brain, and then they operate.

Post by **Beowulf** » 2003-05-25 06:25pm

*Hands cookie to Ben.*

Newtonian Fury wrote:I've read Niven's books, and using draconian laws to execute people for their organs could become a problem. But overpopulation was the main basis for such laws in Niven-verse. With sensible population growths, (I hope) this won't become a reality. Even China doesn't execute people who commit minor crimes, and it has the largest population in the world.

The problem wasn't overpopulation, it was citizens pushing to extend their own lives. Easiest way to do that, assuming that the chief cause of death is organ failure, is to extend the death penalty to more crimes.

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-05-25 08:43pm

i would really say that the default status should be manditory donation upon death for any useable organs in a person's body unless they specifically specify that they do not want them used in such a mannner, this applies to organs that are used for transplants same as for scientific research.

Grand Admiral Ancaris · Post by **Grand Admiral Ancaris** » 2003-05-29 06:48am

Darth Wong wrote:If they're going to execute murderers, why use firing squad, electric chairs, or lethal injection? Wouldn't it make more sense to put them under with a general anesthetic, harvest their organs, and then let them die?

Wouldn't that be poetic justice, to force a convicted murderer to give the gift of life?

Forced organ donation is a good idea. But I do have a question. A murder er is executed, and his organs harvested.... Who is going to want the heart of an individual who killed and ate 14 people beating in their chest??? Who would want the kidney of someone who raped and murdered 20 children? I certainly wouldn't.

Grand Admiral Ancaris · Post by **Grand Admiral Ancaris** » 2003-05-29 06:51am

Beowulf wrote:I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)

Frankly I think people should be executed for 3 strikes on any crimes. Pick pocket 3 times? Execute them. Vandalize, break and enter, and use illegal drugs? Execute them.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-05-29 06:55am

Grand Admiral Ancaris wrote:
Beowulf wrote:I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)
Frankly I think people should be executed for 3 strikes on any crimes. Pick pocket 3 times? Execute them. Vandalize, break and enter, and use illegal drugs? Execute them.

What The Fuck?

Shut the fuck up.

Grand Admiral Ancaris · Post by **Grand Admiral Ancaris** » 2003-05-29 06:59am

NecronLord wrote:
Grand Admiral Ancaris wrote:
Beowulf wrote:I wonder how long the death penalty would remain solely for murders and other crimes that are currently capital crimes... "You have been sentenced to death for repeated violations of the speed limit"

Organleggers anyone? (a cookie to the first person to figure out what I'm referring too)
Frankly I think people should be executed for 3 strikes on any crimes. Pick pocket 3 times? Execute them. Vandalize, break and enter, and use illegal drugs? Execute them.
What The Fuck?

Shut the fuck up.

Just speaking my mind. If you continue to break the law after being in jail and "rehabilitated', then clearly you don't have any intention of stopping. Just a "3 strikes, you're out" law.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-05-29 07:04am

Grand Admiral Ancaris wrote: Just speaking my mind. If you continue to break the law after being in jail and "rehabilitated', then clearly you don't have any intention of stopping. Just a "3 strikes, you're out" law.

The existing one is bad enough, example, there is a mentally handicapped guy in California serving 25 years to life for calling 911 three times while out of medication. What you propose is even more insane.

Question, have you got any pirated software/music/films on your PC? Do you have three. Congratulations... you're on death row.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

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