U.S Pledge of Allegiance

h0rus · Post by **h0rus** » 2003-06-11 02:01pm

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/article ... 4040.shtml

"Judges can accept those results," Fernandez wrote. "But they do so at the price of removing a vestige of awe we all must feel at the immenseness of our universe and our own small place within it, as well as the wonder we must feel at the good fortune of our country."

"On Fox News Channel, even leftist Mara Liasson of National Public Radio called the ruling "outrageous," though she mocked the patriotic fervor swelling on Capitol Hill."

"Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Conn., called for a constitutional amendment to leave the pledge intact. "There may have been a more senseless, ridiculous decision issued by a court at some time, but I don't remember it," said the White House hopeful."

"Will He Sue to Rename 'Sacramento' and 'San Francisco'?

Sacramento atheist Michael A. Newdow, who said his second-grade daughter was required to recite the pledge at the Elk Grove Unified School District, brought the case."

"I'm an American citizen. I don't like my rights infringed upon by my government," he said. He called the pledge a "religious idea that certain people don't agree with."

"As for the majority of people who don't agree with him and don't like their rights being infringed, the attitude seems to be "Tough luck."

"Is it only a matter of time before some court claims the national motto, "In God We Trust," violates the Constitution?"

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-06-11 02:48pm

seperation of church and state. the universe is suitably inspiring without having an invisible god who hasnt shown himself lately.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2003-06-11 02:54pm

h0rus wrote:"Judges can accept those results," Fernandez wrote. "But they do so at the price of removing a vestige of awe we all must feel at the immenseness of our universe and our own small place within it, as well as the wonder we must feel at the good fortune of our country."

"On Fox News Channel, even leftist Mara Liasson of National Public Radio called the ruling "outrageous," though she mocked the patriotic fervor swelling on Capitol Hill."

Hey, let's belittle her reporting work because of her political view. I've listened to NPR for years, and I've never gotten the impression that Mara Liasson is a "leftist". I only hear about NPR political bias on "new" programs like the G. Gordon Liddy show, and they have no business attacking someone else's bias.

"Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Conn., called for a constitutional amendment to leave the pledge intact. "There may have been a more senseless, ridiculous decision issued by a court at some time, but I don't remember it," said the White House hopeful."

Senator Lieberman is well-known for flaunting his religious beliefs. It's depressing that wrapping yourself in religion is politically advantageous in this country.

"As for the majority of people who don't agree with him and don't like their rights being infringed, the attitude seems to be "Tough luck."

"Is it only a matter of time before some court claims the national motto, "In God We Trust," violates the Constitution?"

And it will be long overdue when they do. This nation's motto is "E Pluribus Unum".

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-06-11 03:09pm

The pledge was fine when it was first written. And 'E Pluribus Unum' describes the values of this country more accurately than anything else.

Long live the real pledge, and long live our real motto!

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2003-06-11 03:15pm

I don't care either way.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-06-11 03:41pm

It should be removed, as should "In God We Trust" on the currency. Neither were there to begin with, and neither should be there.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-06-11 04:15pm

"E Pluribus Unum" is the motto of the United States of America. "In God We Trust" only became quasi-official during the McCarthy era. And those nitwits missed the fact we ALREADY had another motto that mentioned a diety: "Annuit Coeptis" is on the back of the Great Seal, and means (loosely) "Providence has favored our undertakings." Also on the back of the seal is the motto "Novus ordo seclorum", "A new order for the ages". Either one of those would have been better than "In God We Trust".

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2003-06-11 04:16pm

It never bothered me. When I was in elementary school and we did it at the beginning of class, I was too busy making up new words to the pledge to notice it really.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-06-11 05:57pm

I thought Novus Ordo Seclorum meant "New Secular Order"?

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-06-11 05:58pm

Frank Hipper wrote:I thought Novus Ordo Seclorum meant "New Secular Order"?

"A New Secular Order", rather...

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-06-11 06:30pm

According to my dictionary, "secular" is "saecularis". Somebody find Hemlock or the Duchess--their Latin makes mine look like a sad joke.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-06-11 08:53pm

The conspiracy freaks will tell you that Novus Ordus Seclorum translates to "New World Order." But "a new order of the ages" seems to be the more likely translation.

Damn, I shouldn't have quit Latin...

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-11 09:22pm

seclorum - the world/universe; secular/temporal/earthly/worldly affairs/cares/temptation

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-11 09:23pm

Edit: Should have bolded "temporal" as well...

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2003-06-11 09:53pm

Durran Korr wrote:The conspiracy freaks will tell you that Novus Ordus Seclorum translates to "New World Order." But "a new order of the ages" seems to be the more likely translation.

Damn, I shouldn't have quit Latin...

Wouldn't "New World Order" be Novus Ordus Mundorum" (lit. "New Order of the World")?

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2003-06-11 09:54pm

StarshipTitanic wrote:seclorum - the world/universe; secular/temporal/earthly/worldly affairs/cares/temptation

I thought "mundus" was "world".

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2003-06-11 10:11pm

.....I don't like it there. It presumes every single American is a god person...grrrr
Doesn't really matter, during the period when we stand and say the pledge probably 1/4 of my class actually say it excluding myself.
~Jason

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-06-11 10:13pm

Gil Hamilton wrote:
Durran Korr wrote:The conspiracy freaks will tell you that Novus Ordus Seclorum translates to "New World Order." But "a new order of the ages" seems to be the more likely translation.

Damn, I shouldn't have quit Latin...
Wouldn't "New World Order" be Novus Ordus Mundorum" (lit. "New Order of the World")?

You are operating under the fallacious assumption that conspiracy nutjobs are swayed by things like logic, reason, and the realities of the Latin language.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-06-11 10:53pm

Even if it isn't unconstitutional, I find it quite unecessary: it was only added in the 1950's to slam the "Godless Communists", and although I really don't have a problem with saying "Under God", I don't see why it shouldn't be removed.

Nathan F · Post by **Nathan F** » 2003-06-11 11:48pm

Doesn't bother me any...

Ice · Post by **Ice** » 2003-06-12 01:34am

Y'know, normally, I wouldn't have cared. Except some dumbass who learned I'm an athiest tried to get me in trouble with it, because she said I couldn't say "Under God" in the pledge. How that's supposed to get me in trouble, I don't know, but it was some dumbass 9th grade NJROTC kid who didn't like the fact that I was enforcing rules, so I guess she figured she could get me in trouble by saying I can't say the pledge and that makes me less patriotic or whatever because I'm athiest.

Luckily, the MC didn't care, and was perfectly fine with my solution: say the rest, just skip "Under God" so it goes "One Nation, Indivisible" and so on.

Post by **Gandalf** » 2003-06-12 07:11am

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:Even if it isn't unconstitutional, I find it quite unecessary: it was only added in the 1950's to slam the "Godless Communists", and although I really don't have a problem with saying "Under God", I don't see why it shouldn't be removed.

Whoa, I did not know that, yet another reason to join the revolution, eh comrades?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-12 07:17am

"As for the majority of people who don't agree with him and don't like their rights being infringed, the attitude seems to be "Tough luck

I'm interested in how the fuck that can possibly be.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

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