George Lucas', and Matt Stover's Stupidity (Spoilers)

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Joe Momma
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Post by Joe Momma »

Kazuaki Shimazaki wrote:Personally, I don't think Lucas really checks the details that much. They might check the storyline, but the details... didn't Lucas once say something derogative about people like us, who love his show enough to analyze it in excruciating detail - "Most people won't really notice"? :D
He said it once regarding the astrodroid in the Jedi starfighter (which should have had its legs sticking out the bottom), though that was later fixed with the rational that the droid components had been directly integrated into the fighter rather than having a separate droid plugged into the fighter.

He's also said something along those lines in one of his interview, regarding the fact that R2 and C3PO didn't remember Tatooine in the OT even though they should be familiar with it from the prequel movies. He said they'd likely have a memory wipe between the trilogies, but added that this was the sort of detail people didn't need to worry about.

I'm not sure it's relevant to this, though. There may be a big difference between how stringently Lucas checks these things (from what I've read, he doesn't even look at most of the EU material) and how strictly Lucasbooks checks the material directly under their aegis.

Anyway, all I'm saying is before we start hanging the writers out to dry, it'd be useful to know how strictly the writers are asked to adhere to the 1.2 million number by their editors. They might have just taken what they were handed without question or they may have asked to change things and been refused.

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Illuminatus Primus
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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

Sounds like GL's just dismissing laziness and plotholes to me.
"You know what the problem with Hollywood is. They make shit. Unbelievable. Unremarkable. Shit." - Gabriel Shear, Swordfish

"This statement, in its utterly clueless hubristic stupidity, cannot be improved upon. I merely quote it in admiration of its perfection." - Garibaldi in reply to an incredibly stupid post.

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Joe Momma
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Post by Joe Momma »

Illuminatus Primus wrote:
Stravo wrote:Stover's figure is more correct than the numbers Illuminiatus just cited.
Impossible; there has to be a fix.
No, there doesn't. It would be great if there is one, but it might be more official minimalist bullshit.
Illuminatus Primus wrote:Inside the Worlds of Attack of the Clones is a higher-canonical source than Shatterpoint, A Clone Wars Novel. Unless we confirm Lucas said Stover is more right than Inside the Worlds..., Inside the Worlds... remains a higher authority.
Whether ItWoAotC is higher or not, they're not necessarily contradictory, if Stover's story takes place before the additional millions of troops or divisions are actually deployed.

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Post by Joe Momma »

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Sounds like GL's just dismissing laziness and plotholes to me.
Isn't that pretty much what we're looking at here? He pulled a number out of his ass and he's sticking with it whether we fan-boys howl or not.

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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

Joe Momma wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:Sounds like GL's just dismissing laziness and plotholes to me.
Isn't that pretty much what we're looking at here? He pulled a number out of his ass and he's sticking with it whether we fan-boys howl or not.

-- Joe Momma
Well since we give more of a shit about his universe's credability than he does:

What's your fix?
"You know what the problem with Hollywood is. They make shit. Unbelievable. Unremarkable. Shit." - Gabriel Shear, Swordfish

"This statement, in its utterly clueless hubristic stupidity, cannot be improved upon. I merely quote it in admiration of its perfection." - Garibaldi in reply to an incredibly stupid post.

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Joe Momma
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Post by Joe Momma »

Darth Wong wrote:I suspect Stover is being dishonest. I seriously doubt Lucas intervened to make him use a 1.2 million figure 6 months into the clone war, since other literature has been produced which indicated much higher numbers without interference from him.
I don't think he's saying there was a direct intervention so much as he took what he was given. Whether he bothered to argue it or not, who knows, though I suspect no one gave a throwaway background line much thought one way or the other.

Of course, it occurs to me that if he really disagreed with it he could have got around it by simply saying that all of the available troopers were occupied fighting CIS forces and not mentioned any number whatsoever.

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Post by Joe Momma »

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Well since we give more of a shit about his universe's credability than he does:

What's your fix?
I think you and some of the others in the thread have provided excellent creative interpretations of the quotes (the numbers only representing reserves available in the immediate area and/or only the top-line troops, the word units referring to groups rather than individual troopers, etc.).

It just seemed to me that in our zeal to patch this up that we shouldn't forget that:

a) there's as much official evidence to support the minimalist numbers as there is to support higher ones and

b)that the official word might well be that there's only a few million troops.

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Connor MacLeod
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Post by Connor MacLeod »

I thought that the AOTC novelization (the canon one) more or less indicated that "units" were individual soldiers?

"He also wanted me to remind you that if we require more - and they've another million well on the way to completion - it will take more time to grow them."

"A million clone warriors?" Mace Windu asked in disbelief.

"Yes, Master. They say Master Sifo-Dyas palced the order for the clone army almost ten years ago."

AOTC novelization page 236.

Thats probably where Stover got the idea, if anything. So the blame either rests on Salvatore, who wrote the novel, or whomever provided him the information.
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Post by Connor MacLeod »

Also: Mike, Wayne - my memory is kinda bad on this, but didnt Curtis also hint there were things he couldn't comment on because he too was a SW author? I seem to recall him suggesting there were factors and such he couldn't discuss (and didn't.)

And I dont find it inconceivable that GL (or someone in LFL) may have been to blame for this. Its not liek some of you haven't bitched out Lucas or LFL before for something you thought of as stupid.
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Prince-Admiral Krennel
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Post by Prince-Admiral Krennel »

Connor MacLeod wrote:
Thats probably where Stover got the idea, if anything. So the blame either rests on Salvatore, who wrote the novel, or whomever provided him the information.



Blame it on LFL and Lucas himself. I guess we'll see how it ends up in Episode 3, but if it's not explained there, I want to know how only a few million clones managed to take and hold at least 10,000 inhabited planets.


Remember their trying to keep the Republic togather, so I don't buy into the "They used WMD" idea. The troops of the Techno Union etc. aren't going to just wait out in some isolated field to get destroyed by a orbital bombardment, and 1.2 million sure as hell isn't enough to win fighting city by city on several thousand worlds.
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