A question regarding the gp4teens forum.

[Frank_Scenario]

It's been quite a while since I've posted here, so for those who don't know, I'm a Christian, which may or may not be relevant.

I try my best not to get involved in the regular attacks on Christianity in this group. There are three main reasons for this:

• It's not worth the effort.
• It won't exactly help win friends and influence people.
• I don't go out of my way to 'convert' others, esp. those who have expressed a (very understandable) desire to avoid such treatment.

The last one is important: since many of the members of this board have expressed a vehement dislike for Christianity and a perfectly reasonable desire to avoid conversation with so-called "fundies," I scrupulously refrain from engaging in this behavior.

I take the behavior in question to be this: initiating an argument about the beliefs of another with intent to change that belief to match your own. The gp4teens members have not done this. However, it would seem that some members of this board have, in staging an "invasion" of their forums. While the individuals in question are certainly unintelligent, I have to ask if they don't deserve the same respect that many members demand from others.

If a group of die-hard Creationists came here and started spewing out their crap, it would be perfectly acceptable to respond; however, this hasn't happened. Instead, the members of this board who are engaged in attacking the gp4teens forum are causing the problems.

My question is this: is it not blatant hypocrisy to engage in behavior that you insist others not take part in?

I may or may not make another post on this thread in the near future; my Internet connection is spotty and my time is limited. Please do not take any failure to respond to responses on my part as cowardice, arrogance, or anything other than a lack of ability to do so.

[fgalkin]

Well, technically, we did have a group of die-hard Creationists icome here and spew their crap, which gave rise to the practice of invasions of other forums in the first place.

But now, the whole "invasion" practice does sound kind of silly.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[DPDarkPrimus]

Michael Wong doesn`t condone invasions, and he didn`t condone any invasion of gp4teens.

But frankly, unlike where fundies come here and spout their "you`re all going to hell, believe in Christ or else" at us, people from here who are going to gp4teens are telling people scientific facts to open their eyes to more than what their Sunday school teacher tells them.

[HemlockGrey]

Any activity at other forums is undertaken independently.

[Frank_Scenario]

Michael Wong doesn`t condone invasions, and he didn`t condone any invasion of gp4teens.

But frankly, unlike where fundies come here and spout their "you`re all going to hell, believe in Christ or else" at us, people from here who are going to gp4teens are telling people scientific facts to open their eyes to more than what their Sunday school teacher tells them.

I know that Mr. Wong doesn't condone this sort of behavior. That's not really the point of my question. I understand and agree with your complaints against those who come here and push their beliefs, or who do the same in your personal lives. It would seem that the invasion of the other forum is exactly this sort of activity; the belief does not change the moral content of the activity. I've given a definition which I consider to be a fair and accurate account of the behavior which those I am questioning despise, and it remains to be demonstrated how the behavior of the SD.net members in question does not fit this definition (or why the definition is a bad one).

Any activity at other forums is undertaken independently.

Understood. However, there is a certain amount of organizational planning being done here, and it seems that people are coming here to revel in their tiny victories. I doubt that many of them would be engaging in discussion at the gp4teens forum at all if it weren't for this board.

This also doesn't address the main question; the potential hypocrisy of the act is independent of how many participate in it.

[Darth Wong]

This also doesn't address the main question; the potential hypocrisy of the act is independent of how many participate in it.

We have no problem with individuals coming here in order to debate us. Fuel for the engine, really. We just have a problem with large-scale "invasions", of which we've had a few and in which their behaviour is usually trollish.

Similarly, we do not condone or approve of any large-scale invasions from here to anywhere else, but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with a few individuals going to some webboard and debating people there.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

It's been quite a while since I've posted here, so for those who don't know, I'm a Christian, which may or may not be relevant.

You could be an Islamist, a Jew, or a headhunter from Borneo, and have the same relevancy. Religion isn't a factor here. The question here is the free exchange of ideas and philosophy.

I try my best not to get involved in the regular attacks on Christianity in this group. There are three main reasons for this:

• It's not worth the effort.
• It won't exactly help win friends and influence people.
• I don't go out of my way to 'convert' others, esp. those who have expressed a (very understandable) desire to avoid such treatment.

The last one is important: since many of the members of this board have expressed a vehement dislike for Christianity and a perfectly reasonable desire to avoid conversation with so-called "fundies," I scrupulously refrain from engaging in this behavior.

I take the behavior in question to be this: initiating an argument about the beliefs of another with intent to change that belief to match your own. The gp4teens members have not done this. However, it would seem that some members of this board have, in staging an "invasion" of their forums. While the individuals in question are certainly unintelligent, I have to ask if they don't deserve the same respect that many members demand from others.

The wrongness makes me want to curl up in a fetal position and whimper quietly to myself.

A) The act of debating over opposing points of view is a fundamental building block of free speech. You're entitled to your views and I'm entitled to mine. If I wish to disagree with you and wish to debate it in a civil and rational manner it's called free speech, not an "invasion." "Invasion" brings up mental images of trollish behavior.
B) Only a handful of individuals seek out other boards to debate. For the most part, they seem to engage in rational debate and free discourse of thought. People who wish to engage others in though should be praised, not reviled.

If a group of die-hard Creationists came here and started spewing out their crap, it would be perfectly acceptable to respond; however, this hasn't happened. Instead, the members of this board who are engaged in attacking the gp4teens forum are causing the problems.

My question is this: is it not blatant hypocrisy to engage in behavior that you insist others not take part in?

Names? Evidence? I want to see these "attacks" for myself. Are these really attacks, or people asking questions that you might not be capable of answering? The board staff and administration do not condone the large-scale invasion of other boards. If a handful of individuals decide to go out and "spread the word," that's their business. As long as it doesn't interfere with the board, or spark an invasion of trolls, there isn't a reason why people should go out and seek rational and civil debates.