Wierd god question

[apocolypse]

Okay, I was thinking about this earlier today. I saw a bio on my roommates cousin. Make a long story short, it states that he had a malignant tumor in his brain. Now, he gives god credit for helping him to survive and recover, but what I don't get is where was god when the damn thing started growing?? Have any of you ever asked a fundie something along those lines? If so, what do they say, that it was the result of the Devil, or some unclean lifestyle? I seriously don't get it, how can everything that is great and wonderful be the result of god, yet everthing that is bad be someone else's fault?

[neoolong]

It was either a test of his faith ie put there by God to test his faith, or it was someone else's fault, ie Satan.

[Xenophobe3691]

I gave up on that shit a while ago, just let him believe.

[Traceroute]

Okay, I was thinking about this earlier today. I saw a bio on my roommates cousin. Make a long story short, it states that he had a malignant tumor in his brain. Now, he gives god credit for helping him to survive and recover, but what I don't get is where was god when the damn thing started growing?? Have any of you ever asked a fundie something along those lines? If so, what do they say, that it was the result of the Devil, or some unclean lifestyle? I seriously don't get it, how can everything that is great and wonderful be the result of god, yet everthing that is bad be someone else's fault?

I think you might find Mr. Wong's hate mail exchange with Michael Miller a source of enlightenment for this subject.

[Trytostaydead]

Mmmm.. a lot of people say "God miraculously did.." this or that. However, let me take another approach to the whole "Grace of God" concept.

Probably the best way to start would be with God's Will. If we're for just a moment to forget the whole argument of Free-will versus Predestination (the argument requiring SOME iota of faith to be acceptable), let us say that God already has a plan for us.

Granted, I've come to the realization that most of us in the scheme of history will amount to little but the cannon fodder that pushes us forward. So each of our paths in life fall into some piece of God's plan. Of course, it's not everyone's lot in life to have the fortune of Bill Gates and to each our own, we make the best with what we can achieve.

Of course here is where the free-will versus predestination comes to play, how can you strive for the best that you can achieve when what you're going to achieve has already been determined? Once again, I say it requires some faith to believe that the two do co-exist. God of course knows, but you don't and it's the actions that you take, that you CHOOSE to make that will take you to where you need to be. Of course there are those of you who are going to rip into that argument with gusto so go ahead.. as I said, it requires some faith to believe.

But where was I. Oh yes, the reason we say "It was because of God," can better be put as "it was the Grace of God." We give thanks that it was not yet our time to go and there's something more for us.

[CrimsonRaine]

Okay, I was thinking about this earlier today. I saw a bio on my roommates cousin. Make a long story short, it states that he had a malignant tumor in his brain. Now, he gives god credit for helping him to survive and recover, but what I don't get is where was god when the damn thing started growing?? Have any of you ever asked a fundie something along those lines? If so, what do they say, that it was the result of the Devil, or some unclean lifestyle? I seriously don't get it, how can everything that is great and wonderful be the result of god, yet everthing that is bad be someone else's fault?

There are many different ways to look at this one.

1. Coincidence and bad luck; i.e., God did nothing, neither causing it nor helping the case or simply, there is no God.

2. Test of faith.

3. Who the fuck knows? Shit happens.

I don't believe that God has horrible things happen to us. I believe that sometimes, truly, shit happens. But it's how we deal with it, it's what we believe in. Because something bad happens to us, it's not God shitting on our face and laughing at our downfall. God helps us along when we ask for the help. For all these individuals who believe that just because something bad happens to you, it's because you've offended God or that God hates you, I find it really ridiculous and the epitome of knee-jerk reactions. I find it very ironic that we seem to be perfectly aware when God damns us, but we often never see when he blesses us.

It's all a matter of perspective and belief. Horribly things, tragic things and even death happen to the best of people. If you think about it, perhaps God found a tragic death to be a way out to something horribly long term and too difficult to deal with that hasn't happened to a person yet. Who knows? It's not for us to question. Our job is to take our life in our own hands, tighten the reigns as best we can, and do our best to remain on course and turn just right over its jagged edges.

Crimson Raine

[Coyote]

God did not make a perfect world, God made a world that is natural and must operate according to laws of physics. That means that there are things that happen and cancer is one of them.

If God wanted to make a perfect world where no one ever suffered, he also would not have bothered to make humans. He'd have built robots that conform perfectly to worship him without doubt or question. But God gave us brains and the abilty to think, question, choose and rationalize.

Fundies woukd say it was a "test" or a "manifestation of evil by Satan", I think God would say, "It's cancer". How you deal with it is up to you. You can be noble about it and face it head on or give up on life and shrivel away. But the choice is yours, not God's.... unless you want to be a robot, that is.

Fundies tend to think in robot mode. They do whatever priests tell them, and I think they're in for a big surprise. Upon death they will go to face God who will look at them and say "I gave you a magnificent brain, and you turned the damned thing of and did what others told you to do. Idiot. Take the 'down' escalator."

The person who questions and challenges and confronts God with righteous complaints, without fear, is respected. This person used their head for seomthing besides a hatrack. They see the injustice and demand answers, tolerating no BS in the meantime.

The look on the face of Pat Robertson, as he gets flushed 'down' while Mike Wong gets admitted to Heaven (heeheeheee!!!!) will be classic.

[SPOOFE]

When something good happens, Fundies say that God "rewards those that have faith".

When something bad happens, Fundies say that God "works in mysterious ways".

In other words, they want to have their cake and eat it, too.

[Grand Moff Yenchin]

Mother Theresa: "The most beautiful gift for a person is that he can participate in the suffering of Christ, you are suffering, that means Jesus is kissing you."

Patient: "Then tell your Jesus to stop kissing me."

-1994 Lancet

[EmperorChrostas the Cruel]

Spoof.

And your point is?

This is called "lobster trap logic." (one way door)

Evidence can be used to "prove" your faith is right.
Contradidting evidence is "not relavant," a"test of faith," or "lies, with intent to decieve."

This is the NATURE of faith, sometimes refered to as BLIND faith.
It can not be reduced any further.
Emotional reasoning is an oxymoron.

We have made elabourate lies up to retrorationalise our desires, and give them the force of "logic," thus explaining our random animalist whims.


Feeding, Fucking, and Fighting, are the big 3 desires.
Much is made to try and overcomplicate the simplicity of our nature, because we hold a moral code that condems our very nature as "evil," or to be "risen above."
Solutions:

Get a new moral code.(more realistic, and humanistic)

Incorcorate the "forgiveness" into exsisting power structure.(repent, sinner!)

Adopt cognative dissonence. (Accepting 2 inherantly contradictory premises, and not ever looking too closely and the contradiction.)

Most opt into the last two, (a little here, a little there) rather than do the work of the first.

[Xenophobe3691]

Don't worry, it's just Satan planning for world domination! Remember, every death is one more soul for his army of the damned!