Space: The final frontier..?

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Space: The final frontier..?

Post by kojikun »

Formatted to be text-entry-field width because I find reading larger column widths to be annoying. :P

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Space: The final frontier..?
by Me. :)

On April 12th, 1981, the Space Shuttle Columbia lifted off from the
launch pad at Kennedy Space Center in central Florida. It was the first
launch of the new Space Shuttle, the STS-1 mission. It was the ushering in
ceremony of a new age of space travel, an age where men no longer travel
to other worlds or strive to go further then ever before. It was also the knell
of the golden days of space exploration, the days fo the Apollo program.

For a short half decade men were launched into space atop gigantic white
and black rockets, walked on the moons dry and lifeless grey surface, and
occasionally had the near fatal disaster of needing to use a sock as a
carbon dioxide filter. I doubt that our boys at NASA would have predicted
that socks would make for a good filter in place of their expensive filtering
systems. Inspirations for movies aside, the end of the Apollo program was
without question the darkest day in NASA history. Not even the tragic loss
of the old and venerable Columbia could compare to the devastating impact
that its own birth would have. And while each Shuttle launch awes and
inspires me, filling my heart with pride for the technological achievements
mankind has made in the past century, it also pains me to know that this
very craft was the reason noone has gone to the moon since 1972.

The Space Shuttle was dreamed up as a semi-reusable launch system
which could put satellites into orbit and if, necessary, return them to Earth
for repair. The Shuttle has not lived up to these dreams, and has never
once returned a satellite from orbit because to do so would cost too much
money. It costs just over half as much to launch the shuttle and repair the
satellite or launch a second satellite as it would to launch the shuttle twice,
once to retrieve the satellite and once to redploy it. What is worse is that
the same satellites can be launched by expendable launch vehicles which
cost less then a Shuttle main-tank, which is not retrieved at all. The space
shuttle has never been anything more then a reason to put people into
space as a way to keep public opinion of the National Aeronautics and
Space Administration.

On the other hand, the Saturn-class boosters were capable of launching
objects to the moon, or of lifting objects as bigger and almost 4 heavier as
the Space Shuttle's payload capacity into similar orbits, despite both having
similar launch costs. The entire Apollo program was undertaken using a
budget just barely larger then the current NASA budget. And yet it has been
31 years since the last man has stepped foot on the moon. Science fiction
author Jerry Pournelle once said that he always knew he would live to see
the first man walk on the moon, but never guessed he would see the last.

The Space Shuttle program has devestated America's launch capabilities,
using it gives the United States no advantage over our old Cold War rivals
in Russia, who are now left alone to tend to the International Space Station
while the Space Shuttle group is made safe again for humans to fly in.
Since the first Shuttle flight twenty years ago there have been two
malfunctions which destroyed the Shuttles Challenger and
Columbia
, and in that same time Russia's Soyuz booster has suffered
minor glitches. The most recent and urgent glitch that the Russian Space
Afency felt a need to inspect was a computational malfunction that left the
reentry capsule drifting a few hundred miles ofcourse to land in some poor
Kazakh mans farm or perhaps in the middle of the Central Asian steppe.
It's clear that a new and simpler launch vehicle is required for the American
space program, especially when an old Soviet system older then the Space
Shuttle can perform equally as well without the cost or danger.

But a new, capsule-based launch vehicle, perhaps best based on the Titan
vehicle class, does not change one fundemental issue, and that is that Low
Earth Orbit is a waste of money. There is no reason to put men and women
into Low Earth Orbit, as all the functions they serve are also served by
computers in other non-NASA research, such as that done by the European
Space Agency and the National Space Development Agency of Japan, who
coincidentally has some of the coolest agency-related jackets in space
history. Trendy Japanese fashion statements aside, what is clear is that LEO
is a useless place for humans to be, instead the United States must focus on
a Lunar base and establishing a local Lunar infrastructure for the
construction of larger bases and factories. These factories would serve as
processing facilities for Lunar Helium-3, which will fuel fusion reactors to
come in the next half century.

But the United States lacks a launching vehicle to put a man on the Moon
today. It's almost a legend that two fully built but unused Saturn V boosters
lay on NASA's lawns, rusting and in disrepair, while the paper schematics
for the vehicle are lost. Supposedly all that remains of the Saturn V
cosntruction schematics are a scant few microfiches. Digging up the old
schematics is likely to be the best choice for now, because developement
cost is zero, however if the United States are to progress into a fully
modern space agency, new vehicles must be used, vehicles utilising nuclear
thermal rockets. The technology is there, we tested and built them in the
1960's for possible use in the Saturn V's, and it might be wise to use them
so, but launching a moon base might not be within the Saturn V's range of
possibilities. What we need is a new heavy-lifter booster, using nuclear
rockets, that will put a manned base on the Moon. This is the only way
America will progress and enter space. What we need is to bold go where
man has gone before, and this time to STAY.
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Post by Gandalf »

Woo! Go Space!!!

Good article.
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Post by Lonestar »

Screw Lunar bases...we have the ability to go to Mars, let's go!
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Post by Xenophobe3691 »

Just because we have the capability to go, doesn't mean we have to overextend ourselves and go there. If we have to wait a few decades at just (JUST!) the Moon to be able to go to Mars without the Space Program lapsing, then so be it. Just GET OUR FUCKING ASSES OFF THIS PLANET!
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Post by Traceroute »

Nuclear rockets might not be the best way to go, though. Hydrogen - Oxygen boosters don't attract any negative attention or protesters.

For instanct, the Cassini proble to Saturn was protested by thousands of "conecerned citizens" because of its Plutonium batteries. They generated power from the heat of Plutonium decay, it wasn't even a nuclear reaction in the way the public views it (fission/fusion). In fact, these batteries were designed to withstand re-entry, but there were still protests.

Hydrogen - Oxygen worked quite well for the Saturn V, and can still work for future launch vehicles. We'd be able to build it lighter now, though, I think.
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Post by Trytostaydead »

What are some of the reasons we should go into space?

Lack of resources left on Earth?
Overcrowding?
A place of last refuge once we fuck up the Earth too much?

But if space is the final frontier, how come we haven't looked towards the frontiers left here on Earth, such as the deep seas. There's plenty of untouched resources down there, but I suspect it's harder to travel downwards than shoot upwards.
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Post by Yuri Prime »

Traceroute wrote:Nuclear rockets might not be the best way to go, though. Hydrogen - Oxygen boosters don't attract any negative attention or protesters.

For instanct, the Cassini proble to Saturn was protested by thousands of "conecerned citizens" because of its Plutonium batteries. They generated power from the heat of Plutonium decay, it wasn't even a nuclear reaction in the way the public views it (fission/fusion). In fact, these batteries were designed to withstand re-entry, but there were still protests.

Hydrogen - Oxygen worked quite well for the Saturn V, and can still work for future launch vehicles. We'd be able to build it lighter now, though, I think.
Actually, I've heard that the coolant for nuclear reactors doesn't work properly without gravity. Does anyone know anything about the subject?
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Post by kojikun »

Lonestar: The moon is more relevant for two reasons. The first reason is that its easier to launch off of the moon then go elsewhere in the solar system then it is to launch from earth and go directly elsewhere. The second reason is that the moon has valuable Helium-3 which can be used in future fusion reactors, reactors which will also be fusion rockets to propel humanity further. These two factors make the Moon an ideal place to go to. A Mars base has all the gravitational concerns of earth (well, not all, you don't need exactly the same amount of fuel, but you need a lot) and it has no value other then as a colony, whereas the moon will be an ENABLING factor, allowing us to atleast begin to truly expand into space.

Traceroute: One thing that irked me is that MICHIO KAKU, notoriously brilliant theoretical physicist and the Einstein of our time was a key speaker at the protests. But regardless, nuclear rockets are superior because they have higher specific impulses and do not require an oxidizer, which reduces fuel erquirements drastically. Plain old water could be used, but water gives an Isp equal to that of LH-LOX combustion. Pure hydrogen can be used giving enormous Isps near 1000, as opposed to the very high Isps of our best LH-LOX engines ranging around 400. Trip time to Mars with a nuclear engine would be on the scale of weeks, not months of years.

Trytostaydead: There are two major reasons, the first is that no civilisation flourishes by staying where it is, and will eventually be destroyed because its too isolated. The second is that future energy demands will only permit the use of fossil fuels and nuclear reactors for so long, which is to say that by 2200 we will have used all fossil fuels and will have used all available Uranium. However, Helium-3 from the four Jovian planets will literally last us until the end of the solar system, even if there were a million earths and if each was entirely modernised like the US is not partially modernised with lots of less modern nations like Russia or Australia which don't have the enormous power demands that the US does.

Yuri: The coolant system in solid-core nuclear rockets work by passing liquid hydrogen over the fuel rods (which also flash boils the hydrogen and provides the working fluid of the rocket). Even if you did need some gravity, you can simply have the thing rotate like a centrifuge. Requiring gravity is nonsense, however.
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Post by Coyote »

Sigh... we need to explore space, and the best places to go nearby ar eclearly the Moon,Mars, and Europa. We can get valuable resources form asteroids and the gas giants, and use this as stepping-stones to further exploration as tech permits.

But it is all pipe dreams, for we lack not the tech now but the political will and the desire to invest in such ventures. I'm afraid to say it but in truth, no one will give a rat's ass about space-- until they can find a way to exploit it commercially in a cheap and reliable way.
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Post by Traceroute »

Coyote wrote:But it is all pipe dreams, for we lack not the tech now but the political will and the desire to invest in such ventures. I'm afraid to say it but in truth, no one will give a rat's ass about space-- until they can find a way to exploit it commercially in a cheap and reliable way.
Agreed. Until space exploration (not the shuttle program) becomes an international priority again, we're not going very far.
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Post by Xenophobe3691 »

Well, we now have the tech for a space elevator, why doesn't someone try generating a huge stink about that?
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Post by Traceroute »

It would take the same level of international commitment to generate enough carbon nanotubules and put together the support facilities for such an endeavor.

It would be awesome to have a space elevator up & running though.
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Post by kojikun »

wheres this material for a space elevator? we need lots of nanotube cable. we dont have much if any.
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Post by SyntaxVorlon »

Recently I heard about a new rocket fuel made out of a near wax like material that burns relatively clean, IIRC. In Pop Sci or Pop mech there was an article about the paraffin based fuel. This will at least make it cheaper to fly the program. And at the very least, put an ironic spin on the phrase "light the candle."
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Post by SirNitram »

Trytostaydead wrote:What are some of the reasons we should go into space?

Lack of resources left on Earth?
Overcrowding?
A place of last refuge once we fuck up the Earth too much?

But if space is the final frontier, how come we haven't looked towards the frontiers left here on Earth, such as the deep seas. There's plenty of untouched resources down there, but I suspect it's harder to travel downwards than shoot upwards.
What new frontiers on Earth?

Deep sea or, even worse, burrowing exploration is going to be much worse than space. Pressure decreases as you go up, and we can build to survive in space. Pressure increases as we go down.. And we're finding the limits of our technology in that respect.

We can buy ourselves time, as a species, by trying to reform alot of land on the Earth.. But it's just buying ourselves time. Humanity consumes alot more than it produces, and even at zero growth we'll eventually use up everything here.

Now, humanity can simply die out as every other species does. This is, as always, an option. But humanity doesn't want to. Unfortunately, there's very little work going towards the long term..

Oh yes. For those seeking info on current space elevator projects, look for the names Liftport and Highlift.
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Post by kojikun »

the wax fuel is paraffin. candle wax. only better.
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Post by Coyote »

Who'd'a thought? "Candle Drive". Imagine the look on the aliens' faces when we tell 'em how we got there....
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Post by Xenophobe3691 »

Coyote wrote:Who'd'a thought? "Candle Drive". Imagine the look on the aliens' faces when we tell 'em how we got there....
It'll probably look like :roll:

"What? Candle Wax? Primitives, we've conquered the galaxy with used toilet paper!"
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Post by Gandalf »

Vorlon1701 wrote:
Coyote wrote:Who'd'a thought? "Candle Drive". Imagine the look on the aliens' faces when we tell 'em how we got there....
It'll probably look like :roll:

"What? Candle Wax? Primitives, we've conquered the galaxy with used toilet paper!"
What a load of crap.
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Post by Vympel »

Screw space. We need Seaquest DSV! :roll:
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Post by Dark Hellion »

I think you are all forgetting the real reason to go to space.
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Post by kojikun »

zero-gee sex would suck, honestly. you'd need a harness or something.
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Post by Drewcifer »

kojikun wrote:...you'd need a harness or something.
You say that like it'd be a bad thing :twisted:

Interesting article though. Reminds me of the old story about while NASA spent millions developing an ink pen that would write in zero G, the Soviets used pencils...

RE alternates to LOX: I've read of people suggesting kerosene and gasolene as fuels as well.
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Post by kojikun »

Drewcifer wrote:Interesting article though. Reminds me of the old story about while NASA spent millions developing an ink pen that would write in zero G, the Soviets used pencils...
I loved that article. It goes to prove how backwards we can be in the US. How silly we are, a bit like the Asgard who "forgot" about hurling heavy pieces of metal.
RE alternates to LOX: I've read of people suggesting kerosene and gasolene as fuels as well.
you'll always need LOX or some other really dense oxidiser. Kerosene is the FUEL. The Soyuz uses kerosene, as did a few stages of the Saturn Vs. The Nazi V-2 used drinking alcohol, I believe.
Last edited by kojikun on 2003-07-05 02:16am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Drewcifer »

Whoops, forgot about needing Oxy for combustion :oops: :)
kojikun wrote:...The Nazi V-2 used drinking alcohol, I believe.
I remember reading somewhere they used hydrogen perioxide? Maybe it was a mixture? But yeah, I remember it being something suprisingly common.
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