She who must be obeyed (Female leaders in hisory)

SyntaxVorlon · Post by **SyntaxVorlon** » 2003-06-26 11:32am

Coyote wrote:Well, no monarch would be overly impressed by the concept of voting and democracy...

IIRC she was specific in the idea that Women should not be allowed to vote. She didn't care about men's right.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2003-06-26 07:20pm

Well, more that come to mind are the various queens of Sparta, like Leda. Now Sparta was an interesting town. Women drilled in fighting with the men, were unrivaled in athletics, and ran Sparta when the men were off at war, which was often enough that it was the majority of the time.

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-26 07:53pm

SyntaxVorlon wrote:IIRC she was specific in the idea that Women should not be allowed to vote. She didn't care about men's right.

She also believed that lesbians were an impossibility, so Victorian anti-homosexuality laws applied to men, not women

I don't think Victoria is as great a female figure as she is sometimes presented. Her great achievements were done by the Imperial administration which had been in place long before her reign, all she did was live for a very long time.

She doesn't stand up well in comparison to Yekaterina... but then again, no female head of state in history can. (except maybe Irene, the scheming Byzantine 'Emperor,' who had her own sons mutilated to secure the thrown, and was unseated just after Charlemagne proposed to marry her

)

Raoul Duke, Jr. · Post by **Raoul Duke, Jr.** » 2003-07-09 04:26pm

EmperorChrostas the Cruel wrote:Lucrezia Borga.
Want a drink?

For that matter, what about Lizzy Borden? Advancing the cause of juvenile emancipation and hand tools...

Darth Gojira · Post by **Darth Gojira** » 2003-07-09 08:12pm

Pablo Sanchez wrote:
SyntaxVorlon wrote:IIRC she was specific in the idea that Women should not be allowed to vote. She didn't care about men's right.
She also believed that lesbians were an impossibility, so Victorian anti-homosexuality laws applied to men, not women I don't think Victoria is as great a female figure as she is sometimes presented. Her great achievements were done by the Imperial administration which had been in place long before her reign, all she did was live for a very long time.

She doesn't stand up well in comparison to Yekaterina... but then again, no female head of state in history can. (except maybe Irene, the scheming Byzantine 'Emperor,' who had her own sons mutilated to secure the thrown, and was unseated just after Charlemagne proposed to marry her )

Who's Yekaterina?

SyntaxVorlon · Post by **SyntaxVorlon** » 2003-07-09 08:23pm

Cathrine the Great

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-07-10 12:45am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Ruth, a female prophet?
Didn't she do much except... well, being religious?

Sure. After she lost one husband, she quested long and hard to find another. To do this, she put on perfume and lay at her prospective husband's feet. That was pretty much everything that her book covered. I'm not kidding.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2003-07-10 12:48am

Joan of Arc. I realize that she's a religious figure, but frankly anyone who can get an entire army to follow her at that age deserves our respect. The fact that she actually won with a French army makes it all the more impressive.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-07-10 12:52am

Cathrine the Great

Yeah, I mean, oppressing the serfs, that's real original, no one's ever done that before.

How about Queen Elizabeth? Or Jane Grey?

Well, actually, all Jane Grey did was get executed. Soooooo maybe just Elizabeth.

Darth Gojira · Post by **Darth Gojira** » 2003-07-10 07:52am

Master of Ossus wrote:Joan of Arc. I realize that she's a religious figure, but frankly anyone who can get an entire army to follow her at that age deserves our respect. The fact that she actually won with a French army makes it all the more impressive.

On the other hand, she was captured and handed over to the Brits by Frenchmen. A rather interesting character, nonetheless.

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-10 11:11am

Pablo Sanchez wrote:
She also believed that lesbians were an impossibility, so Victorian anti-homosexuality laws applied to men, not women I don't think Victoria is as great a female figure as she is sometimes presented. Her great achievements were done by the Imperial administration which had been in place long before her reign, all she did was live for a very long time.

She doesn't stand up well in comparison to Yekaterina... but then again, no female head of state in history can. (except maybe Irene, the scheming Byzantine 'Emperor,' who had her own sons mutilated to secure the thrown, and was unseated just after Charlemagne proposed to marry her )

There's always Yekaterina I, too. Without her a lot of the respect for Russia in Yekaterina Velikiy's (That is correct usage, yes?) time would not have been there, and Prussia might have been even larger from the ambitions of Frederick der Grosse without the constancy of her opposition to him.

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-10 11:12am

The Duchess of Zeon wrote: There's always Yekaterina I, too. Without her a lot of the respect for Russia in Yekaterina Velikiy's (That is correct usage, yes?) time would not have been there, and Prussia might have been even larger from the ambitions of Frederick der Grosse without the constancy of her opposition to him.

And, of course, Isabella of Castille and Maria Theresa, for that matter...

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-10 11:18am

There's also Queen Margaret of Denmark, who succeeded in unifying Denmark, Norway, and Sweden under her control in the Kalmar Union in 1397, and ruled it until 1412; the union lasted for a bit of time, until Sweden under the Gustavs broke away, and, technically, the unification of Denmark and Norway up until the early 19th century was an extension of it.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-07-10 11:37am

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:There's also Queen Margaret of Denmark, who succeeded in unifying Denmark, Norway, and Sweden under her control in the Kalamar Union in 1397, and ruled it until 1412; the union lasted for a bit of time, until Sweden under the Gustavs broke away, and, technically, the unification of Denmark and Norway up until the early 19th century was an extension of it.

It's the Kalmar union. Otherwise, I suppose you got it right.

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-10 11:48am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
It's the Kalmar union. Otherwise, I suppose you got it right.

Thank you, Simon. The occasional mistake does crop up..

Post by **Gandalf** » 2003-07-10 11:54am

I'd like to mention Agrippina the Younger.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-07-10 01:49pm

Hillary Clinton

*runs and hides*

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-07-10 01:59pm

Death, these are supposed to be famous women leaders.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-07-10 02:03pm

Sorry, I admit my post was a bad joke. But there are some folks who think she is a great female leader.... granted they are wrong but hey.

to get back on topic I would say Joan of Arc was pretty impressive, she led the French Army and won several battles IIRC.

Tom_Aurum · Post by **Tom_Aurum** » 2003-07-24 12:10pm

I got bored, so I decided to post on this one. Two of my favorites, something about being part frog or something.

The Papess: An interesting little legend that we'll never quite figure out the verity of. But the original Tarot decks had her as a counterbalance to the Pope. Apparently she was a woman who rose to the office of pope in the middle ages and rather quickly wound up dying in childbirth (!) during a particular procession.

Joan: You cannot forget that girl. Was she really a good little catholic? Unfortunately, and most probably, yes. Still can't totally banish the possibility in my head however that her psychotic "visions" were of Mary instead of a good little god and jesus thing. And I always had a thing for a woman in drag. <sigh>

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-24 12:21pm

Tom_Aurum wrote:
Joan: You cannot forget that girl. Was she really a good little catholic? Unfortunately, and most probably, yes. Still can't totally banish the possibility in my head however that her psychotic "visions" were of Mary instead of a good little god and jesus thing. And I always had a thing for a woman in drag. <sigh>

She was actually such a good Catholic that she sent a missive to the Hussites, who were revolting against the Church in Bohemia at the same time she was commanding the French Army, and had been declared heretics, and ordered them to repent and return to the Church, or else she promised to lead a Crusade against them as soon as she had defeated the English.

NapoleonGH · Post by **NapoleonGH** » 2003-07-25 02:03am

what about Livia, the First empress of rome. According to most sources augustus was whipped something aweful and livia was the real brains and power behind that union, she also had quite a bit of power during Tiberias' reign, at least the beggining

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-07-25 06:02am

Gandalf wrote:I'd like to mention Agrippina the Younger.

Nero's mom, ruled Rome after her husband's Stroke, until Nero killed him.

created a lot of reforms.

Of simular stature there was a Japanese Empress who took over after her much older husband got himself killed in the first year of their marraige, Took no shit from her generals, gave birth to her son on a battlefield, and refused to abdicate, until her grandchildren came of age, because her son wasn't smart enough.

Post by **LadyTevar** » 2003-07-25 10:29pm

The Yosemite Bear wrote: Of simular stature there was a Japanese Empress who took over after her much older husband got himself killed in the first year of their marraige, Took no shit from her generals, gave birth to her son on a battlefield, and refused to abdicate, until her grandchildren came of age, because her son wasn't smart enough.

We need more leaders like her...

Darth Gojira · Post by **Darth Gojira** » 2003-07-29 09:29pm

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
The Duchess of Zeon wrote:There's also Queen Margaret of Denmark, who succeeded in unifying Denmark, Norway, and Sweden under her control in the Kalamar Union in 1397, and ruled it until 1412; the union lasted for a bit of time, until Sweden under the Gustavs broke away, and, technically, the unification of Denmark and Norway up until the early 19th century was an extension of it.
It's the Kalmar union. Otherwise, I suppose you got it right.

The Squid league!