Old-school infantry.

Mr. Mister · Post by **Mr. Mister** » 2002-09-23 02:50pm

So, of all the various sci-fi and fantasy infantries around, which is the most fearsome of the groups that fights, for cultural or technological reasons, primarily with hand-to-hand or close-range projectile weapons?

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2002-09-23 03:07pm

Warhammer Fantasy Battles: Chaos

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2002-09-23 03:21pm

Colonial Marines from Aliens. They have some tatical issues, such as leadership, and infill and exfill problems, but this could be with only the team sent to the colony. They do use decent tatics, multiple squads with ability to flank and fire and manuver as well as organic support weapons from rapid fire support weapons to gernade launchers. Other support is avalible from explosives, flamethrowers, and electroic sensors. It also seems that they have organic LAV support that doubles as comcon, and a dedicated internal aviation department for transport and logistics. Again the team sent to rescue the colonist made multiple errors but that seemed more of a leadership problem than mere ability.

greenmm · Post by **greenmm** » 2002-09-23 03:54pm

I have to say, the Fremen won out by a slight margin over the Aiel, IMHO...

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2002-09-23 04:18pm

In fantsy novels The Reavers from the Runelord series take it. Not much can stand up to thousands of 18 foot tall monsters with powerful magic. In Science fiction... the shard

Mr. Mister · Post by **Mr. Mister** » 2002-09-23 07:21pm

Yeah, although it's technically more of a calvary feature, riding the Sandworm's a pretty tough feature to beat. So I guess we can't count that.

But, the Fremen do live on Arrakis, which gets described as about the harshest place humans could adapt to. Not to mention their leadership is determined by knife fights, which is definitely more fearsome than most groups. Their treatment of the dead is also pretty severe: it's hard to say that people who purify drinking water from dead bodies aren't a hardy society.

Honestly, I think Colonial Marines are a bit too high tech to count in this poll, seeing as their preferred weapon is a gun, not a sword or spear or Bat'leh, or whatever those Klingon things are called. And if the fools hadn't started prefering them to disruptors, I wouldn't even have put them in the list.

Solid Snake · Post by **Solid Snake** » 2002-09-23 07:52pm

The Terrans in Starcraft. Pure Ass-Womp

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2002-09-23 07:59pm

The Mobile Infantry (the real ones from the book). They've got a tough militaristic society willing to back them. Kick ass weapons and armor. And tough realistic training. Very few can beat them.

Admiral Griffith · Post by **Admiral Griffith** » 2002-09-23 08:35pm

Total Annihilation. Arm Peewee, Core Storm, Arm Jethro, Arm Warrior, and Core Thud. Those things are over 2 stories tall, and are what passes for infantry.

Raptor 597 · Post by **Raptor 597** » 2002-09-23 08:58pm

The Terran Marines in SC those Redneck Crackers with Medics & Raynor in that Vulture could kick serious ass. Also the Mobile Ifantry is cool a close 2nd.

Lt. Nebfer · Post by **Lt. Nebfer** » 2002-09-23 09:07pm

starcraft starcraft tearrns

Post by **fgalkin** » 2002-09-23 09:33pm

Book MI, Book MI, Book MI....

paladin · Post by **paladin** » 2002-09-23 09:43pm

The Fremen then the Uruk-Hai. it's a toss up.

Post by **weemadando** » 2002-09-23 11:22pm

United States/Systems Colonial Marines. Too whup-arse for words.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2002-09-24 03:30am

5th Imperium Marines in battle armor from Mutineers Moon, or The Cadre from Path of the Fury

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2002-09-24 05:18am

Knife wrote:Colonial Marines from Aliens. They have some tatical issues, such as leadership, and infill and exfill problems, but this could be with only the team sent to the colony. They do use decent tatics, multiple squads with ability to flank and fire and manuver as well as organic support weapons from rapid fire support weapons to gernade launchers. Other support is avalible from explosives, flamethrowers, and electroic sensors. It also seems that they have organic LAV support that doubles as comcon, and a dedicated internal aviation department for transport and logistics. Again the team sent to rescue the colonist made multiple errors but that seemed more of a leadership problem than mere ability.

Um... the Colonial Marine contingent of the Sulacco suffered nearly 100% casualties on LV426. They eschewed the use of their pulse-rifles for flame throwers going into an alien nest. They left their transport unguarded on the ground and easily accessible to one of the hostile creatures. Finally, they bottled themselves up in a hopelessly unsecurable position instead of picking a patch of high ground from which their longrange weapons would have afforded them advantages over the creatures. As Lord Wong pointed out once, nobody was left aboard the Sulacco to provide either tactical or rescue backup in the event of the mission going wrong, and the mission went totally FUBAR because the idiot in command never bothered to scope out the ground he was taking his troops into and took both platoons of his company down. Not even half the company would have survived the initial attack of the creatures within their nest in the reactor station were it not for two of them ignoring orders and reloading their clips when Lt. Idiot ordered them all collected, and Cpl. Hicks picked a very bad spot for the survivors to make their stand; left themselves with almost no way out.

That does not strike me as stirling testimony to their tactical abilities or adaptability under hostile conditions.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2002-09-24 03:47pm

Patrick Degan wrote:
Knife wrote:Colonial Marines from Aliens. They have some tatical issues, such as leadership, and infill and exfill problems, but this could be with only the team sent to the colony. They do use decent tatics, multiple squads with ability to flank and fire and manuver as well as organic support weapons from rapid fire support weapons to gernade launchers. Other support is avalible from explosives, flamethrowers, and electroic sensors. It also seems that they have organic LAV support that doubles as comcon, and a dedicated internal aviation department for transport and logistics. Again the team sent to rescue the colonist made multiple errors but that seemed more of a leadership problem than mere ability.
Um... the Colonial Marine contingent of the Sulacco suffered nearly 100% casualties on LV426. They eschewed the use of their pulse-rifles for flame throwers going into an alien nest. They left their transport unguarded on the ground and easily accessible to one of the hostile creatures. Finally, they bottled themselves up in a hopelessly unsecurable position instead of picking a patch of high ground from which their longrange weapons would have afforded them advantages over the creatures. As Lord Wong pointed out once, nobody was left aboard the Sulacco to provide either tactical or rescue backup in the event of the mission going wrong, and the mission went totally FUBAR because the idiot in command never bothered to scope out the ground he was taking his troops into and took both platoons of his company down. Not even half the company would have survived the initial attack of the creatures within their nest in the reactor station were it not for two of them ignoring orders and reloading their clips when Lt. Idiot ordered them all collected, and Cpl. Hicks picked a very bad spot for the survivors to make their stand; left themselves with almost no way out.

That does not strike me as stirling testimony to their tactical abilities or adaptability under hostile conditions.

And stormtroopers lost to a bunch of carebears and a wookie. That does not mean they are not bad ass. The CM displayed the basic weapons and tatics initialy that show they are a force to reckon with. Yes they were all but destroyed and I did say that they suffered from bad leadership, and insuffecient naval support. Some of the fuck ups can be explained as it being a low key mission, and some what expendable, so proper support was withdrawn. Would not be the first time troops were cut off and left for dead for stupid reasons. Some other problems were just really bad leadership, some LTs are good, some are bad. For the rest, plot devise.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2002-09-24 04:14pm

Actually, going to high ground would only work if they had sufficient ammunition to kill all attackers. It was pretty clear that even when the Aliens where packed wall to wall for maximum effect, they Marines did not have enough ammo to kill more then a fraction of them.

In the open the aliens speed would result in them being rapidly captured once they ran out of ammo since there would be no constraints to limit and slow the Aliens movement.

Holding out in the complex funnel the attackers into zones, which allowed for the maximum effect of their limited ammo, while keeping them close to the uplink. If they had gone out and gone to a hilltop they may never have been able to get to the uplink and all died as a result.

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2002-09-24 05:14pm

Chaos Marines from WH40K, especially the night lords. you don't know what fear is until your planets been blacked out (both communications and literally), your communications systems are repleying scenes of slaughter and there's 12ft. tall genetically engineered homicidal killing machines in advanced armour and with advanced weapons walking around slaughtering everyone. This is before you factor in deamons from the Warp that can drive men insane just by seeing them, various tanks with strange implements on them, and some of the afore mentioned homicidal manaics that are allready deceased but have had their brains hooked up inside killing machines for a few centuries just to give them that extra insanity that you need in 15 foot tall mechanical monstrosities!!!

Mr. Mister · Post by **Mr. Mister** » 2002-09-24 05:27pm

Err... Yeah. I don't dispute that several of these groups have extremely advanced weaponry and the like. But I was trying to figure out what sci-fi group's infantry would be strongest without advanced weaponry, or mechanical equipment, or powersuits (as with book MI) air-support. But whatever.

Come to think of it, I guess under the poll I was trying to ask, the Aliens themselves would be the ultimate force, since they don't use weapons at all.

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2002-09-24 05:52pm

OIC. Well spacemarines are still tough even without their gear .Considering that they are genetically altered human beings designed for warfare and nothing else.
They have additional normal organs as well as special organs which grant them such abilities as being immune to most poisons and toxins, the ability to spit concentrated acid, massively increased toughness in bonestructure (making their ribcage like a bullet proof vest and knife proof vest combined) and superfast reflexes just to name a few. On average they stand about 12 ft. tall and the shortest ever was about 8 ft. They also have superhuman strength, toughness and endurance.

Yes they are Badass indeed!!!

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2002-09-24 06:13pm

Say what you will, Terran Marines take the cake. I mean, would you have the balls to say "You wanna piece of me boy?" to your commanding officer the second you showed up? And lets be serious these are guys that sit in tiny doomed colonies and fight of millionsof oncoming Zerg like theres no tomarrow, it takes guts I'll tell you.

It takes even more guts to go in there when you know that the average life expectantcy of a marine on the battlefield is NINE SECONDS (from the blizzard/SC website).

Its not so much that they're super killers like Mr. 12ft tall geneticly altered super soldier, but that they've got the cahoonahs to do, well-what they do!

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-09-24 06:20pm

Say what you will, Terran Marines take the cake. I mean, would you have the balls to say "You wanna piece of me boy?" to your commanding officer the second you showed up? And lets be serious these are guys that sit in tiny doomed colonies and fight of millions of oncoming Zerg like theres no tomarrow, it takes guts I'll tell you.

For one brief, horrible second, I thought you meant the marines from Starship Troopers.

By the way, the Aiel suck ass as soldiers. Seriously. Give me ten thousand soldiers and I'll off forty to fifty thousand Aiel.

Emperor Norton II · Post by **Emperor Norton II** » 2002-09-25 01:50am

I’m unsure who the heck “Duke Phelen's Company” is but after seeing who the other contestants are, I nominate any of the nations currently fighting it out in Turtledove’s Darkness series. As far as weapons and tactics go they are far ahead of the Freemen (first Dune novel), Aiel, Urek-Hai.

Mr. Mister · Post by **Mr. Mister** » 2002-09-25 11:57am

Yeah, I just threw them in there to see if anyone would know who I was talking about, Norton. Anyone voting for them would be wrong. They might be able to take the Klingons, but I think most anyone else would whup them up.

I haven't read Turtledove's Darkness series. Could you describe it for me?

And I don't know that the Fremen are so primitive, even if we take them pre-Muad'Dib. They were clearly capable of strategic thinking, what with their sale of spice to smugglers to pay off the Spacing Guild to cover their movements. Design and manufacture of stillsuits suggests at least a certain degree of technical expertise: they are, after all, built along the same lines as a NBF protection suit, except for protecting instead against the ever-present threat of the weather. They make and use pistols. They also have the technology to turn a human body into drinking water. Yes, they're semi-nomadic and quasi-tribal. Still, they have more technological abilities than they get credit for, and in a universe where force fields have made hand-to-hand the only effective sort of combat, they are the best. (Remember, because they attract 400-meter long sandworms, the shields used everywhere else to block projectile weapons really can't be used on Arrakis). Plus, if we take them at their peak in Dune, after Muad'Dib has taught them Bene Gesserit fighting abilities, at least some of them have reflexes and movement abilities akin to a Jedi or Matrixian rebel.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Old-school infantry.

So, who'd whup up on everybody else?

Old-school infantry.

That's it man THAT'S IT! Game over, man! GAME OVER!

Re: That's it man THAT'S IT! Game over, man! GAME OVER!