Was Corran Horn being Batman?

[Striderteen]

And about the duel thing, the point was Luke was losing cause he wasn'tt concentrating or trying at alll, he was "we doomed"-y at the time. Later in the book its clearly shown when luke easily takes down half-a-dozen jenasaari that hes clearly better than corran. Corran would have bin killed by his jenasari had mirax not shot her.

It was stupid to have luke in that situation to begin with (no thanks to KJA)

no matter how luke was feeling at the time though he should NEvEr have been bested by Corran, a Jedi with no formal training should never even hold a candle to a Jedi of Luke's caliber.

Er, Luke doesn't have any formal training either, and in the movies he's an utter klutz -- the only reason he's alive is that Vader went easy on him and then he went berserk.

[StimNeuro]

And about the duel thing, the point was Luke was losing cause he wasn'tt concentrating or trying at alll, he was "we doomed"-y at the time. Later in the book its clearly shown when luke easily takes down half-a-dozen jenasaari that hes clearly better than corran. Corran would have bin killed by his jenasari had mirax not shot her.

It was stupid to have luke in that situation to begin with (no thanks to KJA)

no matter how luke was feeling at the time though he should NEvEr have been bested by Corran, a Jedi with no formal training should never even hold a candle to a Jedi of Luke's caliber.

Er, Luke doesn't have any formal training either, and in the movies he's an utter klutz -- the only reason he's alive is that Vader went easy on him and then he went berserk.

Luke recieved very limited training from Obi-Wan and more extensive training from Yoda.

[Darth Fanboy]

And about the duel thing, the point was Luke was losing cause he wasn'tt concentrating or trying at alll, he was "we doomed"-y at the time. Later in the book its clearly shown when luke easily takes down half-a-dozen jenasaari that hes clearly better than corran. Corran would have bin killed by his jenasari had mirax not shot her.

It was stupid to have luke in that situation to begin with (no thanks to KJA)

no matter how luke was feeling at the time though he should NEvEr have been bested by Corran, a Jedi with no formal training should never even hold a candle to a Jedi of Luke's caliber.

Er, Luke doesn't have any formal training either, and in the movies he's an utter klutz -- the only reason he's alive is that Vader went easy on him and then he went berserk.

Luke had training from Obi and Yoda as the previous post has mentioned, plus his is from the bloodline of Vader AND has battled many opponents prior to Corran Horn that were way more powerful. Such as Vader, Palpatine, and Joruus C'baoth. Even if you discount the training you still cannot deny Lukes EXPERIENCE.

I wish you prats would try watching the movies for once before rattling off your little statements

[Kuja]

Luke had training from Obi and Yoda as the previous post has mentioned, plus his is from the bloodline of Vader AND has battled many opponents prior to Corran Horn that were way more powerful. Such as Vader, Palpatine, and Joruus C'baoth. Even if you discount the training you still cannot deny Lukes EXPERIENCE.

Experience won't count for shit if A. you're not motivated and B. you're not focused, both of which was why Corran challenged Luke to the duel in the first place.

[Kuja]

Read I, Jedi. Its damn entertaining, but when Corran is running around on that planet being the dark and mysterious Jedi, I couldn't help but get a definite "Terror of the Night" vibe from him.

Anyone else thing he was a "Dark Knight"?

*Corran runs into the squadron hangar wearing a cape*

I'm Batman! *turns to Ooryl* Come Robin! To the Batcave!

Tycho: He has finally cracked.

[Darth Yoshi]

*Corran runs into the squadron hangar wearing a cape*

I'm Batman! *turns to Ooryl* Come Robin! To the Batcave!

Tycho: He has finally cracked.

[quote"YT3000..."]Just a nitpick. Rebirth was Edge of Victory II. Enemy Lines had Rebel Dream (book 1) and Rebel Stand (book 2).[/quote]Yeah, that's the one. As long as you know what I'm talking about.

[Darth Fanboy]

Luke had training from Obi and Yoda as the previous post has mentioned, plus his is from the bloodline of Vader AND has battled many opponents prior to Corran Horn that were way more powerful. Such as Vader, Palpatine, and Joruus C'baoth. Even if you discount the training you still cannot deny Lukes EXPERIENCE.

Experience won't count for shit if A. you're not motivated and B. you're not focused, both of which was why Corran challenged Luke to the duel in the first place.

Experience would still count for shit, Luke had seen tougher times, You dont think the huge battles at Bespin, Endor, Mon Calamari, Byss (among many places) would have heped him out. Luke had seen darker times than any idiotic thing that came up during th KJA Tragedy (TRilogy is too good a word for him) and I, Stackpole.

This was just a way for getting the Corran Horn character some recognition by showing how not only was he a great fighter compared to Luke, but he was also suuuch a great person and he had soo many great things to tell luke.

FUck IT!

[Crazedwraith]

This was just a way for getting the Corran Horn character some recognition by showing how not only was he a great fighter compared to Luke, but he was also suuuch a great person and he had soo many great things to tell luke.

FUck IT!

I agree with the last two statements. But the point is Corran was not a match for luke when he was (as Kuja said) Focused or Motivated. Luke didn't care about the fight at all, then Corran gets through his guard and floors him, as he drives to follow through luke simply narrows his eyes and corran runs into a force barrier. klonk. This was the only point when luke took him serioulsy. After the luke goes off to think about all the wonderful things that amazong does-everything corran has told him.

[Darth Fanboy]

This was just a way for getting the Corran Horn character some recognition by showing how not only was he a great fighter compared to Luke, but he was also suuuch a great person and he had soo many great things to tell luke.

FUck IT!

I agree with the last two statements. But the point is Corran was not a match for luke when he was (as Kuja said) Focused or Motivated. Luke didn't care about the fight at all, then Corran gets through his guard and floors him, as he drives to follow through luke simply narrows his eyes and corran runs into a force barrier. klonk. This was the only point when luke took him serioulsy. After the luke goes off to think about all the wonderful things that amazong does-everything corran has told him.

well I do accept that rationale behind your and Kujas argument. (is klonk a real word)

But this still doesn't change the fact that I, Jedi was one of the most horrible books ever written.

[YT300000]

Corran: (Don't remember exact quote) I've seen this woman lying on the ground choking in a pool of her own blood and vomit, with her kids, about as old a Jacen and Jania standing over her looking sad, while her glitterstimming husband is lying on the couch in the other room, sleeping, her blood still on his fingers. I wanted to give him the most rude awakening of his life, but I didn't. I've been much closer to the Dark Side that you.

What a dipshit.

[Crazedwraith]

Corran: (Don't remember exact quote) I've seen this woman lying on the ground choking in a pool of her own blood and vomit, with her kids, about as old a Jacen and Jania standing over her looking sad, while her glitterstimming husband is lying on the couch in the other room, sleeping, her blood still on his fingers. I wanted to give him the most rude awakening of his life, but I didn't. I've been much closer to the Dark Side that you.

What a dipshit.

You idiot. Thats not what he said, that certinaly not what he meant. Luke thought Corran was gonning to fall to the dark side by leaving his training earlier (just like luke did). Corran snapps and tells luke about his experiences in corsec and tell him he,s seing things in an epic scale AND he, corran has been where to light meets dark and never fallen. Luke's obvously been closer to darkness seeing as he actually fell into in DE. But corran never did. That line was spouted cause luke was treating him like a child who nevr seen the world.

[YT300000]

Corran: (Don't remember exact quote) I've seen this woman lying on the ground choking in a pool of her own blood and vomit, with her kids, about as old a Jacen and Jania standing over her looking sad, while her glitterstimming husband is lying on the couch in the other room, sleeping, her blood still on his fingers. I wanted to give him the most rude awakening of his life, but I didn't. I've been much closer to the Dark Side that you.

What a dipshit.

You idiot. Thats not what he said, that certinaly not what he meant. Luke thought Corran was gonning to fall to the dark side by leaving his training earlier (just like luke did). Corran snapps and tells luke about his experiences in corsec and tell him he,s seing things in an epic scale AND he, corran has been where to light meets dark and never fallen. Luke's obvously been closer to darkness seeing as he actually fell into in DE. But corran never did. That line was spouted cause luke was treating him like a child who nevr seen the world.

I don't have I, Jedi. Like I said, I quoted from memory, so the quote isn't exact. IIRC, Corran claimed to have come closer to the Dark Side than Luke.

[Crazedwraith]

I don't have I, Jedi. Like I said, I quoted from memory, so the quote isn't exact. IIRC, Corran claimed to have come closer to the Dark Side than Luke.

I have I, Jedi right in front of me. What happens is that Luke tells Corran he's going to fall to the darkside if he leaves now- Corran goes in to the rant you described and more the important part. he tells luke

I don't know, but don't tell me i don't know the dark side, that I don't know its temptations. I've been there, and i've walked away.

Nowhere in the entire rant does he compare his experiences with lukes.

[Mad]

I think people's dislike of Corran is causing them to have a biased view of his actions. This is only made worse by the fact that I, Jedi is written from Corran's point of view; naturally, everything Corran does will be the right choice according to Corran, because of his own bias about himself. Corran's disagreements with Luke made this abundantly clear. Had the events been written from Luke's point of view, things would be spun so that Luke appeared better.

(Something similar happened in The Bacta War, where the same events were described through both the perspectives of Gavin and Erisi. The implications for each event described twice were drastically different.)

So I guess people dislike the way Corran views himself.

So what do people think of the charactarization of Corran when he's written from the viewpoint of other characters? (Be it by Stackpole or another author.)

[Kuja]

IIRC, Corran claimed to have come closer to the Dark Side than Luke.

Wrong. He did claim that he'd been tempted to do some bad stuff, but he never made the claim that he'd been closer to the dark side.

[Joe Momma]

I think people's dislike of Corran is causing them to have a biased view of his actions. This is only made worse by the fact that I, Jedi is written from Corran's point of view; naturally, everything Corran does will be the right choice according to Corran, because of his own bias about himself.

By the same token, people seem to forget that Corran Horn's arrogance is frequently punctured, too.

Yes, he's a talented pilot, but he's no Luke Skywalker (which annoys him to no end when Edge points this out) or even a Tycho or Wedge (the former of which he couldn't beat even when he was reading Tycho's mind with the Force to anticipate his movements).

He's a skilled detective but fucks up repeatedly with Exar Kun, both in anticipating Kun's actions (and Horn acknowledges his mistake in that regard after Luke is put in a coma by Kun) and analyzing Kun's abilities (which gets Horn several broken limbs when he confronts Kun).

As noted by others, yeah he has an initial advantage with Luke in their last sparring session because Horn has better close combat training and Luke's not paying any attention to him, but once he gets Luke's attention Horn can't even get close to Skywalker. Later on during their fight with the Jennsarrai (I probably fucked up the spelling on that) when Skywalker's kicking Dark Jedi ass Horn frankly states that "the only thing Luke needed me for was to hold his cloak."

Corran Horn is depicted as a highly-skilled character but not as being better than everyone else, except in his own mind. Indeed, events in the novels demonstrate time and again that he's inferior to the main heroes and even to second tier characters such as Wedge. Everyone who thinks Horn is supposed to be an uber-character seems to be buying in to Horn's own bullshit.

I must admit, BTW, I thought that said bullshit made the character more interesting if not necessarily more likable, all the more for his attempts to pull his head out of ass regarding his own inflated self-image. Insert your own Mary Sue analogy here, ha-ha.

I'm also not sure why the whole "no-TK" issue seems so weird. There are plenty of EU examples of characters being more skilled in some areas of the Force than others. The trade of a near-total inability at telekinesis for much higher potential at energy absorption and mental illusions is an extreme case, but not totally unprecedented.

-- Joe Momma

[YT300000]

I don't have I, Jedi. Like I said, I quoted from memory, so the quote isn't exact. IIRC, Corran claimed to have come closer to the Dark Side than Luke.

I have I, Jedi right in front of me. What happens is that Luke tells Corran he's going to fall to the darkside if he leaves now- Corran goes in to the rant you described and more the important part. he tells luke

I don't know, but don't tell me i don't know the dark side, that I don't know its temptations. I've been there, and i've walked away.

Nowhere in the entire rant does he compare his experiences with lukes.

Point conceeded.