Ancient Atomic War?

[Chardok]

The Vimana


"Gurkha, flying in his swift and powerful Vimana, hurled against the three cities of the Vrishnis and Andhakas a single projectile charged with all the power of the Universe. An incandescent column of smoke and flame as bright as the thousand suns rose in all its splendour...An iron thunderbolt, a gigantic messenger of death, which reduced to ashes the entire race of the Vrishnis and the Andhakas....The corpses were so burned as to be unrecognizable. The hair and nails fell out; pottery broke without apparent cause, and the birds turned white....After a few hours all foodstuffs were infected.... To escape from this fire, the soldiers threw themselves in streams to wash themselves and their equipment..."
- The Mahabharata

It would seem that The Mahabharata is describing an atomic war! References like this one are not isolated; but battles, using a fantastic array of weapons and aerial vehicles are common in all the epic Indian books. One even describes a vimana-Vailix battle on the Moon! The above section very accurately describes what an atomic explosion would look like and the effects of the radioactivity on the population. Jumping into water is the only respite.
"When the Rishi City of Mohenjodaro was excavated by archaeologists in the last century, they found skeletons just lying in the streets, some of them holding hands, as if some great doom had suddenly overtaken them. These skeletons are among the most radioactive ever found, on a par with those found at Hiroshima and Nagasaki."
"Futhermore, at Mohenjo-Daro, a well planned city laid on a grid, with a plumbing system superior to those used in Pakistan and India today, the streets were littered with 'black lumps of glass'. These globs of glass were discovered to be clay pots that had melted under intense heat! "
- D. Hatcher Childress, "Ancient Indian Aircraft Technology"

Found this article here:
http://www.wilsonswebdesign.com/religion/vimana.html

I'm curious to see the opionions on this from people on this board. Is it possible a grand civilization existed before us? Highly advanced enough so that, when they were at war, they unleashed weapons of such power so as to wipe the archeological record completely clean of their existence? Or is there a logical explanation of the radioactive corpses...will post with further research...

[kojikun]

I've seen similar. I would find it very convincing if Mohenjo-Daro did indeed posess the radioactive bodies and melted potshards described. I know the Mahabharata does indeed have such accounts, and that Mohenjo-Daro was also a very modernly layed out city, tho an actual archeological report on the city would be more convincing.

However, it is quite clear from various sites world wide that a large number of ancient civilisations that have been completely deteriorated due to time did exist at one point. Thousands of stone rings, many under water; large carved stone monuments a hundred feet in the ocean; the Sphinx's water weathering and the valley temple constructed out of the stone, blocks of which are as large and heavy as modern train cars (how you lift that when you don't have iron I dont know), as well as the Osirion, which is built in the same fashion as the valley temple and was buried under tens of thousands of years of sand build up.

I think that theres more to our history then we know about, and that time has done a good job at destroying the remnants.

[Guardsman Bass]

I remember reading about this possibility in the book The Coming Global Superstorm by Art Bell and Whitney Streiber (very interesting book, not sure how true the science is). It is a possibility, although I think it is kind of bizarre that while we have found missing columns, strange palaces (for example, Superstorm said the Incan Palace of Sacsayhuaman would have been very difficult to build because it is made of 300 ton stones, all very finely cut, and somehow pulled up into the mountains), and things like the Osirion(what exactly is it?), that we haven't found a single tool or trace like that, buried in the mud. Maybe we are looking in the wrong places.

[Zac Naloen]

There is evidence of advanced ancient cultures being around before the academically agreed date of 5000 odd years ago.

The most promising of this evidence is that of a city found of the coast of india, 150 or meters below the surface. (artifacts and such have been found, along with structures that can be in no way natural, too square and that sort of thing). The thing that is interesting about this city is that the last time that area of lan was above sea level was before the end of the last iceage, 10 000 years ago, no one knows much of anything about the people that built this city, and as an advanced group we have only really made big strides in the last 200 years. I don't find it beyond the abilities of our ancestors to advance like we have at some point, only to destroy themselves.

If it is proven that this city is truly older than anything found in the middle east previously a lot of text books are going to have to be re-written.

[Chardok]

personally, I find the mahabharata very compelling, the way it decribes futuristic engines, that sound alot like Mercury-ion drives we are experimenting with today....

http://www.skyrocket.de/space/index_fra ... sert-1.htm

Although ours are quite pitiful with respect to power output.

[Colonel Olrik]

I don't find it beyond the abilities of our ancestors to advance like we have at some point, only to destroy themselves.

A single city, or a small state, doesn't have the critical mass to produce enough scientific knowledge. They could advance until a certain point by themselves, like the greeks (individual genious, small technical advancements over the neighbours), but for an advanced society you need millions of people to work and, among those, hundred of thousands of scientists and engineers to advance the knowledge and means of production. It's ludicrous to think that a few hundred thousand (to be generous) could do it.

[Zac Naloen]

i didn't say just this city


all that city could prove was that there was an advanced culture long before the currently accepted date.

[Colonel Olrik]

i didn't say just this city


all that city could prove was that there was an advanced culture long before the currently accepted date.

You'd need a global civilization to do that. Earth tends to hide its ancient history, but where are the ancient sats, for example? Archeological remains in the Moon? (We went there with obsolete technology, it's not that hard)

[Chardok]

and if, indeed, they did have flying machines (Vimana) then what's to say the exchange of ideas was not freely flowing worldwide? (Small though it may have been...)

[Montcalm]

and if, indeed, they did have flying machines (Vimana) then what's to say the exchange of ideas was not freely flowing worldwide? (Small though it may have been...)

Judging by whats happening in the world today,if they had an advance civilisation in the past,that would have been suicide to share it with other countries where the government is run by fanatical fundies.

[Zac Naloen]

these tales of advanced technology aren't just confined to indian mythology, chinese and sumerian texts also describe these things in one form or another, thats pretty global, considering america appears to not have been inhabited before then.

the chances that a sattelite can stay in orbit for a over 5000 years without anybody to look after it, and not suffer somekind of orbital decay are pretty slim, so the likely hood of finding these are pretty limited.

[Warspite]

"When the Rishi City of Mohenjodaro was excavated by archaeologists in the last century, they found skeletons just lying in the streets, some of them holding hands, as if some great doom had suddenly overtaken them. These skeletons are among the most radioactive ever found, on a par with those found at Hiroshima and Nagasaki."
"Futhermore, at Mohenjo-Daro, a well planned city laid on a grid, with a plumbing system superior to those used in Pakistan and India today, the streets were littered with 'black lumps of glass'. These globs of glass were discovered to be clay pots that had melted under intense heat! "
- D. Hatcher Childress, "Ancient Indian Aircraft Technology"

You know, a while ago, I saw a documentary about the geological formation of the Indian sub-continent, and one aspect of it was the volcanic nature of the south-western part of the sub-continent, specially, the geologists refering to several "seas of lava".

The proofs mentioned by Childress can all come from volcanic origins, without introducing all this lost-tech ideias, the glass "beads", the position of corpses, even the radioactivity (several kinds of volcanic rocks posess (sp?) small amounts of radioactive elements, its not uncommon). And frankly, the plumbing system in India and Pakistan isn't something too marvelous, Romans and Greeks already had vast, efficeint plumbings in their cities.

I can see shapes in the clouds also, but that doesn't mean they're real.

[Chardok]

You're being Awfully pessimistic. Doesn't it seem odd/neat that something described in a ancient text is actually being used today? (Engines using mercury for fuel?) Frieghteningly accurate depictions of nuclear explosions, and whatnot. I'm not saying I believe it actually happened, not until I see evidece, but I DO know that the mahabhrata is an ancient text, and the descriptive writing in it is superb, I find it fascinating! Of course, it could just be an amazing coincidence. anyway, if an ancient nuclear war, could it be a description of an asteroid strike? Then what?

[Sea Skimmer]

There is evidence of advanced ancient cultures being around before the academically agreed date of 5000 odd years ago.

The most promising of this evidence is that of a city found of the coast of india, 150 or meters below the surface. (artifacts and such have been found, along with structures that can be in no way natural, too square and that sort of thing).

The guy who claimed to have found that is known for massive exaggerations and has claimed to have found several cities before which turned out of be natural geological formations. A few artifacts mean nothing since rivers have this habit of washing stuff out to sea.

[Zac Naloen]

http://www.grahamhancock.com/underworld/underworld5.php


That links to the statement by the indian institute of oceanongraphy involving the discovery, they seem to agree that there are structures there

[SirNitram]

It's not pessimism, it's skepticism, a valuable tool to any scientific thinker.

Now, could there have been an exceptionally advanced civilization in the past, before the 'dawn'? Possible. Roman civilization was highly advanced and nearly vanished, but that doesn't mean we can leap to atomic-age civilizations in the past(Look up the Leap In Logic fallacy).

More likely, if this text is literal, someone used Greek Fire or Napalm. The requirements for an atomic-age civilization are too high, with none of the resulting refuse being uncovered.

(Hint: Where's the atomic waste storage? Where's the ruins of their metal structures?)

[Darth Wong]

Can you say "leap in logic?"

Large rock structures do not indicate advanced technology. The Egyptians build pyramids thousands of years ago, and their techniques were ingenious but not technologically advanced.

If there were a technologically advanced society 5000 years ago, please show me microstructural analysis of the high-strength alloys they left behind. Oh yeah, you can't, because all they had was fucking rocks.

[NapoleonGH]

greek fire, if only we could find out exactly what that was, just goes to show how good the Roman Empire's version of the NSA was that they hid the secret so well.

[Robert Treder]

You're being Awfully pessimistic. Doesn't it seem odd/neat that something described in a ancient text is actually being used today? (Engines using mercury for fuel?) Frieghteningly accurate depictions of nuclear explosions, and whatnot. I'm not saying I believe it actually happened, not until I see evidece, but I DO know that the mahabhrata is an ancient text, and the descriptive writing in it is superb, I find it fascinating! Of course, it could just be an amazing coincidence. anyway, if an ancient nuclear war, could it be a description of an asteroid strike? Then what?

Have you ever seen a bible? Ancient texts describe all sorts of crazy shit, but that doesn't make them true. Do you think that a thousand years from now, archaeologists deciphering Star Wars books should conclude that we had planetkillers?

And besides, the blasts in the passage you gave sound an awful lot like asteroid strikes. And if not those, could it not be *gasp* that the author was using his imagination?

[Warspite]

You're being Awfully pessimistic. Doesn't it seem odd/neat that something described in a ancient text is actually being used today? (Engines using mercury for fuel?) Frieghteningly accurate depictions of nuclear explosions, and whatnot. I'm not saying I believe it actually happened, not until I see evidece, but I DO know that the mahabhrata is an ancient text, and the descriptive writing in it is superb, I find it fascinating! Of course, it could just be an amazing coincidence. anyway, if an ancient nuclear war, could it be a description of an asteroid strike? Then what?

The problem is, we're using our own modern views to interpret an ancient text.
This is similar to the drawings on pre-Colombian cities depicting what looks like ancient astronauts, when in fact they are more akin to artistic license, we look at them, see a globe around their heads and "hey, it's an astronaut!", people want to believe on some glorious (forgotten) past, and for sure they can find it, but it is not the real past.


Another example is using the vast, expansive, constructions found around the world (South America, South East Asia, Middle East, etc.) as a proof of long lost technologies and global civilizations, or even the (forgot the name of that babylonian book) regarding God-like beings (that strangey looked like astronauts to us) that came to this planet and enslaved the human race, or such like, as another proof of that glorious past. IS it so hard to have a thriving stone age civilization using only man-power to build cities? People had a lot more time back then, not until recently has technology allowed for a "fast life", take European cathedral construction for example, some of them took centuries to build, again, people had a lot of free time between crops.

Also, such catachlismic (sp?) occurences wouldn't have gone unnoticed by now, even the Great Flood was finally discovered, where are the battlegrounds of this ancient war?

[Agent R]

The idea of an ancient, globe-spanning civilization that greatly predates our time seems a lot less unlikely now, does it? Our civilization has been around for a few hundred years-a fraction of an existence that extends ten or thirty millenia. What if there were cultures in the past that were just as "advanced" as ours, but were wiped out somehow?

A single city, or a small state, doesn't have the critical mass to produce enough scientific knowledge.

What if they didn't produce the knowledge themselves? Yes, I know that question has me delving into the realm of "Aliens giving ancient humans advanced tech" and all that which it would imply, but, you know. . . .

these tales of advanced technology aren't just confined to indian mythology, chinese and sumerian texts also describe these things in one form or another, thats pretty global, considering america appears to not have been inhabited before then.

Wasn't America inhabited during that time? By the Incas, Mayans, Toltecs, Aztecs, Anasazi, etc? Also, I've heard of drawing either in some temple or on a tablet found in Latin America that depics a man sitting in what appears to be a crude rocket with controls placed all around him.

Earth tends to hide its ancient history, but where are the ancient sats, for example? Archeological remains in the Moon?

Maybe the "Advanced Ancients" had this thing about leaving all their junk around where anyone could find it? Kinda like that saying about leaving nothing but footprints. . . .

[Zac Naloen]

Can you say "leap in logic?"

Large rock structures do not indicate advanced technology. The Egyptians build pyramids thousands of years ago, and their techniques were ingenious but not technologically advanced.

If there were a technologically advanced society 5000 years ago, please show me microstructural analysis of the high-strength alloys they left behind. Oh yeah, you can't, because all they had was fucking rocks.

Your putting words into my mouth, i'm not saying that this city is evidence of an advanced civilisation, im saying this is evidence of an OLDER civilisation, suggesting that perhaps we need to rethink our ideas about human civilisation.

I also never said i believe that an atomic civilisation existed, just that i can't completely rule it out... what can i say, i watch too much science fiction

[Chardok]

Again, I said it was fascinating, not undeniable proof, you condescending prick. I am certainly open to to other interpretations, including the author using his imagination, but you dodge the point. 5000 years ago some indian guy sits down with a pen and decides to write about flying machines using mercury powered engines, that is not fascinating to you, given the fact that we are only now expermienting with said engines? (sp?)
as for the asteroid strike theory I will concede on that point, though I hold reservations.


____________________EDIT_______________-
That was in answer to Robert Treder...
Sorry, forgot to quote and don't know how to go back and do it later

[Shinova]

(Hint: Where's the atomic waste storage? Where's the ruins of their metal structures?)

Doesn't metal rust and eventually just become ordinary ore over time?

Or for the atomic waste storage: maybe it all fell out into the open and eventually decayed itself into lead (it'll have to be not plutonium to do that).

Or I think they blew themselves to oblivion maybe.



For me, I think it seemed a bit like a volcanic eruption, like the kind that completely destroyed an island some decades back.

[Warspite]

Again, I said it was fascinating, not undeniable proof, you condescending prick. I am certainly open to to other interpretations, including the author using his imagination, but you dodge the point. 5000 years ago some indian guy sits down with a pen and decides to write about flying machines using mercury powered engines, that is not fascinating to you, given the fact that we are only now expermienting with said engines? (sp?)
as for the asteroid strike theory I will concede on that point, though I hold reservations.

(Was that directed at me?)
Anyway, it's as fascinating as H.G. Wells, so?
There have been several past "writers" that described flying machines, ok, all good and dandy, they had a feverish imagination. But to leap onto the conlcusion that maybe, just maybe, there really were mercury-powered flying machines back then is crazy.