Plea for help turns deadly
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- MKSheppard
- Ruthless Genocidal Warmonger
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- Joined: 2002-07-06 06:34pm
Plea for help turns deadly
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepubli ... ing26.html
Parents call teen suicidal, police react to 'threat'
Senta Scarborough
The Arizona Republic
Aug. 26, 2003 12:00 AM
Parents' plea for help for their 15- year-old son, who was holding a kitchen knife and threatening suicide, turned deadly early Monday when Mesa police shot him in front of his family.
Westwood High School junior Mario Albert Madrigal Jr. was shot multiple times in the carport of his home near Dobson and Longmore roads in west Mesa after police said he came toward them with a knife "in a threatening manner."
The boy's parents said their son had dropped the knife after he was shot with a Taser gun moments earlier and was not a threat to officers.
The shooting was strikingly similar to the 2001 death of Ali Altug, 16, shot by a police officer in his Apache Junction kitchen as he wielded a knife.
"I was really literally in shock when I heard. It is so close to what happened here," said Altug's mother, Sande. "How can our society allow that to happen more than once?"
Madrigal's shooting occurred about 1:30 a.m. Monday. His father said he was told by neighbors that his son had consumed six or seven beers.
The officers involved in the Mesa incident were identified as Sgt. Orlando Dean, a 10-year veteran, and Officers Richard Henry and Mark Beckett, who have four and two years on the force, respectively. All three fired their weapons. None was injured and all were placed on paid leave pending investigations, Mesa police Sgt. Mike Goulet said.
Goulet said police were called to the home in the 500 block of South Johnson twice Monday morning.
Police and family versions differed on circumstances leading to the shooting.
Besides police officers, the parents and their 10-year-old son were witnesses.
"They really made a big mistake. I feel the Mesa police department made a criminal action to kill a 15-year old boy unnecessarily," said the father, Mario Madrigal Sr., a U.S. Postal Service worker. "We called for help and they killed him."
Madrigal said his son never threatened officers and was "under control" and started to shake after being shot with a Taser gun when officers started to fire.
"He dropped the knife after the electrical shock," he said. "While he was laying on the floor an officer got close and shot him twice."
Goulet said officers tried to use a Taser gun twice but it was "ineffective."
"He's got the knife and he's advancing toward the officers in a threatening manner. They are telling him to stop and he doesn't obey any of their verbal commands," Goulet said. "He's coming at them regardless of the Taser. At that point they had to discharge their weapons."
Goulet said he did not know how many shots were fired, how far away the officers were or how many times the teen was hit. The investigation is continuing.
Madrigal's father said when he heard the police account, he grabbed a camera, climbed on a neighbor's roof and took his own pictures of the scene, including photos of his son lying dead.
Police first went to the Madrigal home about 12:30 a.m. because the family called 911 when the son and father argued after the teen came home after having "six or seven" beers at a neighbor's home.
"They told us the 15-year-old was involved in a verbal confrontation and had fled," Goulet said. "Officers talked to the family and told them if he returns and there are problems to give them a call."
At 1:13 a.m., 911 got another call from the house.
Madrigal said in a later interview, "I told him (Mario Jr.) that I was going to take him to the crisis center where he can get help to stop drinking alcohol." But, he said, "He took a kitchen knife and says he is going to kill himself and that's when we called police to get help to take him to the crisis center."
About two months ago, Madrigal said police helped take his son to a crisis center to prevent him from drinking alcohol. His son spent six weeks at the center.
"They helped us take him to the crisis center. He was doing very well," Madrigal said. "I was suspecting the same help to take him to that place."
But when police arrived Monday morning, Madrigal said he told police his son was holding a knife and would kill himself.
"My wife opens the door and she was holding my son's hands.
"One of the police officers pushed her away from my son and one of them shot him with an electrical gun," Madrigal said.
"He was already under the effects of the electrical shock when he was on the floor and they started shooting unnecessarily."
His father said the knife was pointing toward the floor.
He said his son spent a lot of time at home, enjoyed fishing, boxing and riding go-carts in the mountains and wanted to join the Army when he graduated.
"He was a normal kid. He was always at home and he would tell us when he wanted to go," said Madrigal. He said his son didn't have a serious drinking problem but he wanted to stop it before it got worse.
In the past two years, about 90 percent of Mesa police have had a four- hour training session on mental illness and retardation to teach officers the signs of mental disabilities and better communicate with those suffering from those conditions, Goulet said.
The Arizona Police Officers Standards and Training Board is developing new training for police academies on the issue and creating an advanced officer training course on dealing with mental illness expected to be taught at departments statewide in nine months.
He was the second Valley civilian shot by police in 24 hours. Phoenix police shot and killed Elias Cabarera, 22, after he shot and wounded two other people at a home on North 50th Drive about 8 p.m. Sunday.
******************
Okay, now repeat to yourself the following:
The decisions of LEOs when they kill someone are not to be questioned if they repeat the magic phrase, "I felt my life was threatened."
All witnesses to the contrary are to be disregarded, all ambiguous evidence is to be dismissed.
Nobody should ever read the page on this link:
Whack'em and Stack'em
much less ever think like this. The lives of badged persons are the most precious lives on earth, and we should be glad to die for their safety if at ANY point we meet them in their professional capacity.
In spite of their superior training and equipment, we must not even minimally hold them to the standard we would be held if we were to shoot someone. Cops are a legally priveleged class.
Parents call teen suicidal, police react to 'threat'
Senta Scarborough
The Arizona Republic
Aug. 26, 2003 12:00 AM
Parents' plea for help for their 15- year-old son, who was holding a kitchen knife and threatening suicide, turned deadly early Monday when Mesa police shot him in front of his family.
Westwood High School junior Mario Albert Madrigal Jr. was shot multiple times in the carport of his home near Dobson and Longmore roads in west Mesa after police said he came toward them with a knife "in a threatening manner."
The boy's parents said their son had dropped the knife after he was shot with a Taser gun moments earlier and was not a threat to officers.
The shooting was strikingly similar to the 2001 death of Ali Altug, 16, shot by a police officer in his Apache Junction kitchen as he wielded a knife.
"I was really literally in shock when I heard. It is so close to what happened here," said Altug's mother, Sande. "How can our society allow that to happen more than once?"
Madrigal's shooting occurred about 1:30 a.m. Monday. His father said he was told by neighbors that his son had consumed six or seven beers.
The officers involved in the Mesa incident were identified as Sgt. Orlando Dean, a 10-year veteran, and Officers Richard Henry and Mark Beckett, who have four and two years on the force, respectively. All three fired their weapons. None was injured and all were placed on paid leave pending investigations, Mesa police Sgt. Mike Goulet said.
Goulet said police were called to the home in the 500 block of South Johnson twice Monday morning.
Police and family versions differed on circumstances leading to the shooting.
Besides police officers, the parents and their 10-year-old son were witnesses.
"They really made a big mistake. I feel the Mesa police department made a criminal action to kill a 15-year old boy unnecessarily," said the father, Mario Madrigal Sr., a U.S. Postal Service worker. "We called for help and they killed him."
Madrigal said his son never threatened officers and was "under control" and started to shake after being shot with a Taser gun when officers started to fire.
"He dropped the knife after the electrical shock," he said. "While he was laying on the floor an officer got close and shot him twice."
Goulet said officers tried to use a Taser gun twice but it was "ineffective."
"He's got the knife and he's advancing toward the officers in a threatening manner. They are telling him to stop and he doesn't obey any of their verbal commands," Goulet said. "He's coming at them regardless of the Taser. At that point they had to discharge their weapons."
Goulet said he did not know how many shots were fired, how far away the officers were or how many times the teen was hit. The investigation is continuing.
Madrigal's father said when he heard the police account, he grabbed a camera, climbed on a neighbor's roof and took his own pictures of the scene, including photos of his son lying dead.
Police first went to the Madrigal home about 12:30 a.m. because the family called 911 when the son and father argued after the teen came home after having "six or seven" beers at a neighbor's home.
"They told us the 15-year-old was involved in a verbal confrontation and had fled," Goulet said. "Officers talked to the family and told them if he returns and there are problems to give them a call."
At 1:13 a.m., 911 got another call from the house.
Madrigal said in a later interview, "I told him (Mario Jr.) that I was going to take him to the crisis center where he can get help to stop drinking alcohol." But, he said, "He took a kitchen knife and says he is going to kill himself and that's when we called police to get help to take him to the crisis center."
About two months ago, Madrigal said police helped take his son to a crisis center to prevent him from drinking alcohol. His son spent six weeks at the center.
"They helped us take him to the crisis center. He was doing very well," Madrigal said. "I was suspecting the same help to take him to that place."
But when police arrived Monday morning, Madrigal said he told police his son was holding a knife and would kill himself.
"My wife opens the door and she was holding my son's hands.
"One of the police officers pushed her away from my son and one of them shot him with an electrical gun," Madrigal said.
"He was already under the effects of the electrical shock when he was on the floor and they started shooting unnecessarily."
His father said the knife was pointing toward the floor.
He said his son spent a lot of time at home, enjoyed fishing, boxing and riding go-carts in the mountains and wanted to join the Army when he graduated.
"He was a normal kid. He was always at home and he would tell us when he wanted to go," said Madrigal. He said his son didn't have a serious drinking problem but he wanted to stop it before it got worse.
In the past two years, about 90 percent of Mesa police have had a four- hour training session on mental illness and retardation to teach officers the signs of mental disabilities and better communicate with those suffering from those conditions, Goulet said.
The Arizona Police Officers Standards and Training Board is developing new training for police academies on the issue and creating an advanced officer training course on dealing with mental illness expected to be taught at departments statewide in nine months.
He was the second Valley civilian shot by police in 24 hours. Phoenix police shot and killed Elias Cabarera, 22, after he shot and wounded two other people at a home on North 50th Drive about 8 p.m. Sunday.
******************
Okay, now repeat to yourself the following:
The decisions of LEOs when they kill someone are not to be questioned if they repeat the magic phrase, "I felt my life was threatened."
All witnesses to the contrary are to be disregarded, all ambiguous evidence is to be dismissed.
Nobody should ever read the page on this link:
Whack'em and Stack'em
much less ever think like this. The lives of badged persons are the most precious lives on earth, and we should be glad to die for their safety if at ANY point we meet them in their professional capacity.
In spite of their superior training and equipment, we must not even minimally hold them to the standard we would be held if we were to shoot someone. Cops are a legally priveleged class.
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
- Iceberg
- ASVS Master of Laundry
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- Joined: 2002-07-03 11:23am
- Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
- Contact:
Shut the fuck up, Shep. Having a badge does NOT give you an automatic bye to blow somebody away, and these officers had BETTER be thoroughly investigated and they had BETTER get their asses chopped off if they were in the wrong (which it sounds like they were if they tasered the kid and STILL killed him after he had dropped the knife and was no longer a threat).
"Carriers dispense fighters, which dispense assbeatings." - White Haven
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
- Iceberg
- ASVS Master of Laundry
- Posts: 4068
- Joined: 2002-07-03 11:23am
- Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
- Contact:
Oh. Right.
Never mind.
Dammit, 8:00 is too early for me to be trying to reason.
Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.
Never mind.
Dammit, 8:00 is too early for me to be trying to reason.
Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.
"Carriers dispense fighters, which dispense assbeatings." - White Haven
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
- MKSheppard
- Ruthless Genocidal Warmonger
- Posts: 29842
- Joined: 2002-07-06 06:34pm
Iceberg wrote:Shut the fuck up, Shep. Having a badge does NOT give you an automatic bye to blow somebody away
I cannot believe you're saying that, Ice, the liberal. You don't live next
to Prince George's County, home of some of the most fucked up cops
where they get suspended (only suspended!) for tying someone up to
a lightpole and then siccing a K9 onto the tied up person...
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
- Iceberg
- ASVS Master of Laundry
- Posts: 4068
- Joined: 2002-07-03 11:23am
- Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
- Contact:
Shep, you wouldn't believe how much Winona cops are on the take.
We're not too many years removed from the days when one of Winona County's judges was running a heroin ring virtually out of his courtroom. The legal system is INCREDIBLY corrupt in Winona County.
We're not too many years removed from the days when one of Winona County's judges was running a heroin ring virtually out of his courtroom. The legal system is INCREDIBLY corrupt in Winona County.
"Carriers dispense fighters, which dispense assbeatings." - White Haven
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
- MKSheppard
- Ruthless Genocidal Warmonger
- Posts: 29842
- Joined: 2002-07-06 06:34pm
Iceberg wrote: We're not too many years removed from the days when one of Winona County's judges was running a heroin ring virtually out of his courtroom. The legal system is INCREDIBLY corrupt in Winona County.
Let me guess, no matter how improbable, the Coroner ALWAYS rules
in the Cops' favor when shootings go bad, and rigs his results so that it
supports the Cops' side of the story.
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
- MKSheppard
- Ruthless Genocidal Warmonger
- Posts: 29842
- Joined: 2002-07-06 06:34pm
A good example:MKSheppard wrote: Let me guess, no matter how improbable, the Coroner ALWAYS rules
in the Cops' favor when shootings go bad, and rigs his results so that it
supports the Cops' side of the story.
Bullet holes in the back of a dead guy mysteriously
become bullet holes in the FRONT, in order to exonerate
the cops who said "he was charging an officer", so he
had to be shot
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
- Iceberg
- ASVS Master of Laundry
- Posts: 4068
- Joined: 2002-07-03 11:23am
- Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
- Contact:
Keep in mind that Winona County is mostly rural. Rural cops are just as corrupt as urban cops, but that corruption usually manifests itself in the form of drug trafficking instead of innocent dead people.
"Carriers dispense fighters, which dispense assbeatings." - White Haven
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.
| Hyperactive Gundam Pilot of MM | GALE | ASVS | Cleaners | Kibologist (beable) | DFB |
If only one rock and roll song echoes into tomorrow
There won't be anything to keep you from the distant morning glow.
I'm not a man. I just portrayed one for 15 years.