The Great Eastern

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-09-04 04:11pm

On BBC2 now, a programme on Isambard Kingdom Brunel and his greatest ship; the Great Eastern, the third of his great steam ships and one of the first iron ships since the Great Britain was made.

All I can say is, the guy's a frikkin' genius and what's more, he knew it.

Oh how I miss the Empire...

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-04 04:20pm

I wouldn't call him a genius, not after his bright idea to place the world's largest ship on one of the shortest major of the major liner routes, from Britain to America. He should have had the thing going from Britain to India or Australia, which would have attracted full bookings of passengers. As it was the ship was a financial disaster.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-09-04 04:25pm

Sea Skimmer wrote:I wouldn't call him a genius, not after his bright idea to place the world's largest ship on one of the shortest major of the major liner routes, from Britain to America. He should have had the thing going from Britain to India or Australia, which would have attracted full bookings of passengers. As it was the ship was a financial disaster.

That was the original plan. I believe bunkerage concerns were what, in part, halted that.

You know what is completely shocking about this thread? Last night, laying in bed, I was thinking of how to start a discussion of the Great Eastern!!!! And I had NO idea the BBC was airing any specials on it.

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2003-09-04 04:27pm

Wasn't that the ship later used to put in place the first telegraph cable between Europe and the U.S?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-09-04 04:28pm

Sea Skimmer wrote:I wouldn't call him a genius, not after his bright idea to place the world's largest ship on one of the shortest major of the major liner routes, from Britain to America. He should have had the thing going from Britain to India or Australia, which would have attracted full bookings of passengers. As it was the ship was a financial disaster.

Some schmuck opened the Suez canal halfway through building the ship, this led to the ship being put on such a short route and having a dismal financial life, but engineering wise, Brunel was a genius in every sense. And like many great minds at the time, he knew it and his ego did too.

I still can't believe the size of the thing and it has paddle power not screws like the Great Britain and 6 masts so it doesn't even need steam!

And as a note, John Scott Russell was an idiot who nearly killed the project until Brunel took over and oversaw it himself. This resulted in Brunel dying for his dream.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-09-04 04:30pm

Colonel Olrik wrote:Wasn't that the ship later used to put in place the first com cable between Europe and the U.S?

Yep, escorted by the HMS Terrible and some US vessels.

"We have achieved our great object and laid our cable from shore to shore, along which the lightning may now flash messages of peace and goodwill between two kindred nations."
Sir. Daniel Gooch, chief engineer, 26 July 1886

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-09-04 05:32pm

Great Eastern's paddle engines were...unusual, to say the least. They were inverted V twins, that were hinged at the cylinder heads so the entire thing oscillated.
She had a propellor engine, as well.
A good candidate for the most unique ship ever built. And that's not even taking into consideration her size.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-04 05:45pm

Colonel Olrik wrote:Wasn't that the ship later used to put in place the first telegraph cable between Europe and the U.S?

Yes, though her first cabal broke after three weeks. However not long after she succeeded on the second attempt which held that a purpose built vessel was completed for the job and she never laid a cabal again.

Some schmuck opened the Suez canal halfway through building the ship, this led to the ship being put on such a short route and having a dismal financial life, but engineering wise, Brunel was a genius in every sense. And like many great minds at the time, he knew it and his ego did too.

I thought she entered service a couple years before the canal was completed...

Though its still further from say Italy or France (trains and a ferry allowing for a quick crossing of Europe from Britain ) to Australia then from Britian to America. Course the fact that the canal was so close to completion puts the whole project into question.

Edit: I'm right, the canal was opened in 1869 and Great Eastern made her first run to New York in 1860.

Jadeite · Post by **Jadeite** » 2003-09-04 05:47pm

I've heard of the Great Eastern before, but don't remember what it looked like. Got any pics?

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-04 05:50pm

Jadeite wrote:I've heard of the Great Eastern before, but don't remember what it looked like. Got any pics?

My web search turned up very little but this. But I've seen some very nice color paintings of her and quite a few photos. I'll search further.

Edit: Hears some more stuff

http://members.aol.com/drakare/greateastern.html
http://www.wayward.com/great4.gif
http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~branderr/risk_es ... inside.jpg
http://www.history.rochester.edu/steam/ ... 46p315.gif

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-04 05:55pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Yep, escorted by the HMS Terrible and some US vessels.

"We have achieved our great object and laid our cable from shore to shore, along which the lightning may now flash messages of peace and goodwill between two kindred nations."
Sir. Daniel Gooch, chief engineer, 26 July 1886

Me thinks your date is off, since the ship was being used as a floating advertisement board at that point. She actually laid the cable in 1865 and the second in 1866

The Third Man · Post by **The Third Man** » 2003-09-04 06:09pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote: Oh how I miss the Empire...

Brunel was French!

Well, OK. his old man, Marc was. And American too, before he was part of the Empire. Marc KB was a big mate of Henry Maudsley who truly was a great engineer, and was responsible for making many of Marc KBs ideas work. Does Maudsley get any mention on the show? IRC Maudsley's son made the engines for Isambard KBs Great Western?

DocHorror · Post by **DocHorror** » 2003-09-04 07:28pm

Damn I mean't to tape that programme tonight...was it good?

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-09-05 08:55am

The Third Man wrote:
Admiral Valdemar wrote: Oh how I miss the Empire...
Brunel was French!
Well, OK. his old man, Marc was. And American too, before he was part of the Empire. Marc KB was a big mate of Henry Maudsley who truly was a great engineer, and was responsible for making many of Marc KBs ideas work. Does Maudsley get any mention on the show? IRC Maudsley's son made the engines for Isambard KBs Great Western?

He was English, deal.

No, they never mentioned him from what I could hear, they did mention Russell making the engines for the paddle drive and Watt's company making the engines for the screws.

And yes, it was a good programme and the ending was a damn shame to see Brunel die at only 53 from a stroke. The fact that one of the last things he heard was how on sea trials a boiler exploded and boiled several guys alive because of incompetent crewmen not checking the safety release valve could only make him worse.

Though the amazing things that occured to that ship need mentioning. Firstly, the ship hit some submerged rocks on one trip which made a huge gash along most of the hull. The crew and passengers never even noticed it until they got back to port. A far smaller brush against an iceberg sank the "unsinkable" Titanic.

Secondly, when the horrible scrap team got their hands on the ship after only 30 years service, they found in one of the sealed bulkheads the bodies of two people, one a child. They said that the riveters that died when making this ship and locked inside cursed it from there on.

And as far as that date goes, Sea Skimmer, it likely is wrong but I quoted it from a site on the ship so didn't really check.

Next week the programme is on the Brooklyn Bridge, may watch that, butI prefer BB looking ships of leisure. They nearly named the ship Leviathan too at one point.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-09-05 05:50pm

Firstly, the ship hit some submerged rocks on one trip which made a huge gash along most of the hull. The crew and passengers never even noticed it until they got back to port. A far smaller brush against an iceberg sank the "unsinkable" Titanic.

Where was the gash made?

Secondly, when the horrible scrap team got their hands on the ship after only 30 years service, they found in one of the sealed bulkheads the bodies of two people, one a child. They said that the riveters that died when making this ship and locked inside cursed it from there on.

Thirty years service is very high for a passenger vessel, actually. For a ship so underused like the Great Eastern, it is a shame it sat and did nothing for so long, though.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-05 05:59pm

StarshipTitanic wrote: Where was the gash made?

It was on the ships bottom, and it only pierced one hull layer. The inner hull held and flooding was minimal as a result. However since no dry-dock could possibul take the ship they had to build an elaborate underwater cofferdam around the gash, with a pipe leading to the surface. Workmen could then go down and repair the plating.

StarshipTitanic wrote: Thirty years service is very high for a passenger vessel, actually. For a ship so underused like the Great Eastern, it is a shame it sat and did nothing for so long, though.

When I was younger I used to wonder how large a battery of Rifled Muzzle Loaders the ship could have taken. The iron hull could have been a problem, since without heavy wood backing it would splinter horribly and stop little in the way of gunfire. However if employed as a commerce destroying cruiser which could avoid most action some real fun could occur. Especially if she wasn't in British service. Just imagine the endurance the thing would have under sail and with its vast holds filled with stores and ammo.

Plus it would just be fucking cool to have a warship bigger then the first Dreadnoughts as early as 1860. Well mabey 1861 to allow for some rebuilding into a vessel of war.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2003-09-06 10:35am

It's a shame we don't have anything that grand anymore. Oh sure, the World and Oriana are big and have loads of little gadgets and stuff, but nothing is a quantum leap, not unless they're secretly nuke powered or have giant hydrofoils.

Plus they all look like pleasant oceanliners, the Great Eastern looked mean, the BBC's FX made it look to me like a ship of death, which makes it my favourite liner of all time.

Titanic, pah.