Sweden rejects the Euro

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-09-14 08:47pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3108292.stm

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-09-14 08:48pm

Yay! The Euro goes down in flames and Sweeden retains it's sovereignity
to decide what to do with it's currency!

Worlds Spanner · Post by **Worlds Spanner** » 2003-09-14 08:57pm

Was Sweden on the Euro to begin with?

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-14 09:01pm

MKSheppard wrote:Yay! The Euro goes down in flames and Sweeden retains it's sovereignity
to decide what to do with it's currency!

Yes because Sweden was vital to the survival of the Euro.

The vote came down to 6% of the Swedish population and given the recent news coming from Euro land that isn't surprising when they try again in 5 years or so the situation will probably be different and the Swedes will join their European brothers in the super state of mother Europe.

The Eastern European countries are queuing up to get into the EU, Slovenia is on the fast track to the Euro(being the most well off new members) and the other nations will follow once they get the chance, Norway’s resistance to the EU is falling as is Switzerland’s and the anti EU members in the UK are committing suicide at the gates of Westminster, all in all things are great in EU land, praise be to socialism.

I'm not sure at which point that became a parody but there you go.

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-14 09:03pm

Worlds Spanner wrote:Was Sweden on the Euro to begin with?

No although technically they have to join as soon as they are capable (unlike Denmark and the UK who have the legal recourse to opt out forever) the EU won't force the issue and will just wait them out.

Sceptre · Post by **Sceptre** » 2003-09-14 09:43pm

MKSheppard wrote:Yay! The Euro goes down in flames and Sweeden retains it's sovereignity
to decide what to do with it's currency!

I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-14 09:52pm

Sceptre wrote:
I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!

Yeah, we all know how Sheppard has been making US government policy on the matter.

Sceptre · Post by **Sceptre** » 2003-09-14 10:03pm

Sea Skimmer wrote:
Sceptre wrote:
I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!
Yeah, we all know how Sheppard has been making US government policy on the matter.

You mean he doesn't

Do I really need to drag up all past news references to support my contention, based on Shep's behaivour, which is well documented. Or are you just going to be a smartass about it?

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-14 10:34pm

Sceptre wrote:
I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!

It is the same on the military side of things, the US constantly wants European militaries to spend more but the hint of European military integration outside of NATO causes a very lukewarm response indeed not to mention the constant cries of effort duplication.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-09-14 10:37pm

Sceptre wrote: I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!

Yeah yeah yeah, the big bad evil US is behind the setbacks behind
the Euro. Does losing national sovereignity mean anything to you?

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-14 10:38pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Sceptre wrote: I find it humourless how the entire European integration effort was encouraged by the US, up until the EU started kicking its ass at the WTO ... now it is the new devil that must be stopped at all costs!
Yeah yeah yeah, the big bad evil US is behind the setbacks behind
the Euro. Does losing national sovereignity mean anything to you?

It didn't mean anything to Texas or Hawaii it seems.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-09-14 10:39pm

TheDarkling wrote: It didn't mean anything to Texas or Hawaii it seems.

Uh hum, I so love Red Herrings. They're so salty and juicy! mmm!

Governments can chose to respond to depressions by altering the
value of their money, see Greenspan's endless "adjustments" of the
interest rate, etc et, by joining the Euro, you're giving that up to some
guys who won't gave your country's best interests at heart

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-14 10:51pm

MKSheppard wrote:
TheDarkling wrote: It didn't mean anything to Texas or Hawaii it seems.
Uh hum, I so love Red Herrings. They're so salty and juicy! mmm!

Governments can chose to respond to depressions by altering the
value of their money, see Greenspan's endless "adjustments" of the
interest rate, etc et, by joining the Euro, you're giving that up to some
guys who won't gave your country's best interests at heart

It isn't a red herring (although I do know you love them) Texas chose to join a body greater than itself (for monetary/military aid in their case) and that is what is happening here, the Euro is just another step on the road to the united states of Europe which is where the EU is leading despite everyone denying it.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2003-09-15 12:04am

Sceptre wrote:Do I really need to drag up all past news references to support my contention, based on Shep's behaivour, which is well documented.

Yes. Yes you do.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-09-15 12:25am

TheDarkling wrote:
It isn't a red herring (although I do know you love them) Texas chose to join a body greater than itself (for monetary/military aid in their case) and that is what is happening here, the Euro is just another step on the road to the united states of Europe which is where the EU is leading despite everyone denying it.

Texas was completely bankrupt and too small and undeveloped to stand on its own feet, that is not the case with Sweden, which has survived being independent for a rather long time. Hawaii had just had its government overthrown by a sugar company, which did so with the intent to make the country part of the US.

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-15 12:37am

Sea Skimmer wrote: Texas was completely bankrupt and too small and undeveloped to stand on its own feet, that is not the case with Sweden, which has survived being independent for a rather long time. Hawaii had just had its government overthrown by a sugar company, which did so with the intent to make the country part of the US.

I mentioned why Texas joined the US in my post, in exchange for aid they gave up sovereignty which was my point, the fact that Sweden could remain independent is immaterial trading sovereignty for gains is perfectly acceptable if the people of the country are ok with it contrary to what Sheps jerking knee concludes.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-09-15 01:38am

Actually there's an amusing article on that neocon rag the Weekly Standard arguing that a united Europe must be stopped at all costs to prevent it from restraining American power blah blah blah typical neo-imperialist bs.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-09-15 01:42am

Vympel wrote:Actually there's an amusing article on that neocon rag the Weekly Standard arguing that a united Europe must be stopped at all costs to prevent it from restraining American power blah blah blah typical neo-imperialist bs.

Let me guess, Pat Buchanan and his ilk?

Hamel · Post by **Hamel** » 2003-09-15 01:49am

Pat would hardly give a shit since he's isolationist

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-09-15 02:15am

Actually, the Texans declared independence with the idea that they would be annexed by the US almost immediately. Anti-slavery northerners blocked it for ten years.

A better example would be the original 13 states surrendering much of their power when they ratified the Constitution (the prior arrangement, the Articles of Confederation, left them basically independent states in a defensive alliance--they could even collect tarriffs on interstate trade), though even that has its differences, since they were all small, threatened by much larger powers, and shared a common language and culture (and had just been through an eight year war together).

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-09-15 02:57am

Stormbringer wrote:Let me guess, Pat Buchanan and his ilk?

No way man- Pat Buchanan HATES the neoconservatives. He's a rabid classical conservative. Neocons include people like Wolfowitz, Bill Kristol, Charles Krauthammer, and other such warmongering ideologues.

Faram · Post by **Faram** » 2003-09-15 03:09am

Well the yes side did’t convince me with their arguments. Just a revival of the last election (when we joined EU) arguments.

The promised did't come thru then so why shold it now?

InnerBrat · Post by **InnerBrat** » 2003-09-15 04:10am

So what about your job, Faram?

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-09-15 04:17am

Faram wrote:Well the yes side did?t convince me with their arguments. Just a revival of the last election (when we joined EU) arguments.

The promised did't come thru then so why shold it now?

What was the promise, and how could it come through if the Euro was rejected?

Faram · Post by **Faram** » 2003-09-15 04:17am

innerbrat wrote:So what about your job, Faram?

Shrug dunno have to see about that.

IT bizz is dead here, change of occupation perhaps.