Bruce Lee

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-09-15 03:52pm

Ok, Thirty Years dead, the most famous action/adventure Martial Artist. So the question of the creator of Jeet Kwon Do, now what is your oppinions.

1. Hype vs. Ability ( Could he go toe to toe with the current world of fighters?)

2. What would you say his best movie was?

3. Any other comment's about the legend (hey it's hard to seperate myth from reality)

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-09-15 04:05pm

The Yosemite Bear wrote:Ok, Thirty Years dead, the most famous action/adventure Martial Artist. So the question of the creator of Jeet Kwon Do, now what is your oppinions.

1. Hype vs. Ability ( Could he go toe to toe with the current world of fighters?)

2. What would you say his best movie was?

3. Any other comment's about the legend (hey it's hard to seperate myth from reality)

1. I really think he was as good as you see in the movies. IMO if you watch the other Hong Kong stars the only ones that come close to hsi sheer grace, speed and kinetic energy is Jet Li.

2. Enter the Dragon. Many Chinese fans viewed it as a sell out movie but it was just damn good.

3. He had a very interesting life to say the least. I am also interested in the death of his son Brandon Lee. His son shared many charcateristics of his father, had the same kind of charisma that his dad had. Its a shame how he died but also a mystery of sorts. Just how was it possible that he got shot on a movie set? There were rumors circulating for a long time that Bruce had a curse against him and his children. Makes you wonder.

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2003-09-15 04:12pm

Bruce Lee was said to have had to slow down his movements for movies cause they were too fast for the camera to follow.

Just something I heard.

Montcalm · Post by **Montcalm** » 2003-09-15 04:12pm

For his son the cause of his death was the action of an idiot who never checked if everything was safe with the damn gun.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-09-15 04:20pm

Yup, Enter the Dragon is on Cable right now...

oh, I love that film.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2003-09-15 04:23pm

Enter the Dragon was Bruce Lee's gift to the world. Watch it and remember him.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-09-15 04:25pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:Enter the Dragon was Bruce Lee's gift to the world. Watch it and remember him.

It is a movie of extraordinary dimensions. Highlighting the extraordinary talents of many martial artists. Truly magnificent and of course, extraordinary.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-09-15 04:30pm

Official Cause of Death: "Alergic To Pot"

scary thought, very rare, but it does exist....

Montcalm · Post by **Montcalm** » 2003-09-15 04:35pm

The Yosemite Bear wrote:Official Cause of Death: "Alergic To Pot"

scary thought, very rare, but it does exist....

What are you talking about i heard it was an allergic reaction to whatever was in the headache medicine.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-09-15 04:40pm

The headache medicine used Hashshesh as one of it's active ingrediants....

He went into a coma a year before after allegedly smoking one for the first time....

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-09-15 04:59pm

Over the years, I've studied Lee's life a lot. First of all, he died of a "Cerebral Edema" - swelling of the brain. Months before this, he was looping dialogue for "Enter The Dragon", got into a shouting match with a Hong Kong movie bigwig, then went to the restroom. He was found collapsed on the bathroom floor, and began shaking involuntarily while unconcious. It took three men to hold him down until they got him to the hospital, where he eventually regained conciousness. The hospital found that his brain was (I don't remember exactly) 3% larger than normal.

Lee flew back to the U.S. , and had the UCLA medical center check him out. They found nothing, and pronounced the 32 year old Lee healthy, with the body of an 18 year old man.

Months later, he was at the apartment of a Hong Kong actress, along with Raymond Chow and complained of a headache. He was given aspirin, and he went to lay down in a bedroom. Chow left, and expected Lee and the actress to meet him later for dinner. About an hour later, the actress couldn't wake Lee, and he was rushed to the hospital, where he died.

Found in his system was cannibas, the kind that is "chewed"? and used in China for centuries.

Anyway, Lee is in his prime in "Way of the Dragon", the one where he fights Chuck Norris.

And for those of you that found out "Game of Death" was a worthless, cobbled-together piece of shit, I urge you to grab "Bruce Lee, A Warrior's Journey". This DVD has all the lost footage ever shot of Lee in "Game of Death", and tells you what the actual story was going to be. BTW, Lee filmed Game of Death before Enter The Dragon, then stopped production to do Dragon.

One more thing. The movie "Dragon-The Bruce Lee Story" is one of the most fictionalized pieces of shit ever put out about Lee's life. 90% of this turd is pure fantasy.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-09-15 05:12pm

Lord Poe wrote: One more thing. The movie "Dragon-The Bruce Lee Story" is one of the most fictionalized pieces of shit ever put out about Lee's life. 90% of this turd is pure fantasy.

Wait...you mean the demon spirit trying to take Bruce's soul at first then his son's wasn't real?! Damn your eyes!!

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-09-15 05:29pm

Stravo wrote:Wait...you mean the demon spirit trying to take Bruce's soul at first then his son's wasn't real?! Damn your eyes!!

It's a lot worse than that. Throughout the movie, they made it look like Lee was the victim of racism at every turn, which wasn't true. For instance, they showed Lee traveling to America in the bowels of a cruise ship, huddled together with other asians as if they were stowaways. I can't recall, but I think there was dialogue to the effect of they weren't allowed on the upper decks with the white people.

In reality, Lee's mother sent him to America on a second-class ticket to take advantage of his US citizenship (Lee was born in San Francisco). However, Lee spent the trip in First Class, teaching the passengers dances like the Cha-Cha (Lee was the Cha-Cha champion of Hong Kong!)

In "Dragon", they show Lee just getting to the University of Washingon, and immediately bein harassed by the white thugs. Not true. Le had a huge following of kids at the UoW, where he wowed them with Chinese philosophy. He also began teaching Wing Chun to many white and Asian friends behind the restaurant where he worked.

Lee did experience racism however, when he began going out with his future (white) wife, Lina Caldwell. And this was from both sides; whies and asians. Asians also began berating him for teaching his white friends chinese boxing and Wing Chun.

Remember that scene where Lee was challenged because of the above, and was crippled by a kick to the back which put him in traction and a wheelchair? Never happened. Lee WAS challenged for teaching whites asian martial arts by a Japanese karate instructor, and he accepted. The fight lasted three minutes, and consisted mostly of Lee running around the dojo chasing the Japanese instructor.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-09-15 05:32pm

Poe is it true that he never finished his style? That only a few students had really learned most of the moves and that the secrets of mastery died with him?

Anyone that can create his own martial arts style needs to be respected.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-09-15 05:48pm

Stravo wrote:Anyone that can create his own martial arts style needs to be respected.

Well, it wasn't exactly a style. In fact, he never intended for the "Tao of Jeet Kune Do" to be printed, since it borrows liberally from dozens of books Lee collected about fighting. It was just a bunch of cobbled together notes, and not a real book.

Anyway, from all accounts, there's no real "secret". He taught whatever works for that particular individual, using any form of martial art appropriate for the situation, and that includes western boxing and streetfighting. Unfortunately for his students, Lee was very impatient when they couldn't learn moves quickly.

The reason Lee was a phenomenon wasn't any "secret" he discovered. He was a fanatic who trained constantly, and always practiced speed and accuracy. He was also said to be able to learn moves quickly from other instructors, and was able to be proficient in it in under an hour! In fact, Lee was nearsighted, and one leg was longer than the other, so he wasn't some genetic freak of nature!

Did you know Lee had a stand-in in Enter The Dragon? Every time you see "Lee" do those aerial somersaults, that's someone else. Lee never practiced that sort of thing, and would never do the high kicks he did in movies in a real fight.

And....Lee broke the neck of Jackie Chan in EtD!

aerius · Post by **aerius** » 2003-09-15 05:49pm

Stravo wrote:Poe is it true that he never finished his style? That only a few students had really learned most of the moves and that the secrets of mastery died with him?

Anyone that can create his own martial arts style needs to be respected.

Bruce Lee was always improving JKD, looking for ways adapt it for various situations and make it a better & more complete art. In that sense he never finished it since the art was constantly evolving and improving as he went along. JKD was made as a flexible martial arts system, sure there's some basic moves & theories to be mastered, but from what I've studied it's designed so that each student can adapt it to suit their needs, and there's changes and improvements being made to the art to this day.

There are few masters of JKD, Dan Inosanto is the only one I can think of right now, and from what I remember there's a split in the teachings of JKD. Some want to keep the art the way it was when Bruce Lee was teaching it, others believe that Bruce wanted the art to evolve and improve and have teach accordingly. I personally believe the latter to be the right way, and what Lee would've wanted things to go.

Enigma · Post by **Enigma** » 2003-09-15 05:56pm

So how long could the current celebrity martial artists (when in their prime)fare aganist Bruce Lee in a fight before losing (that is if they couldn't beat him)?

Bruce vs. Jackie Chan
Bruce vs. Jet Li
Bruce vs. Chow Yun Fat
Bruce vs. Chuck Norris
Bruce vs. Jean Claude Van Damme
Bruce vs. ???

aerius · Post by **aerius** » 2003-09-15 06:06pm

Jacki Chan gets wasted fast. He's not a combat martial artist, Bruce is.

Jet Li gets wasted pretty quick too. Jet specializes in Wushu, which is non-contact forms. He does not have combat fight training.

Chow Yun Fat gets dropped in one punch. The guy's not even a martial artist, his stuff in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon was done with careful rehearsals and clever camera angles.

Jean Claude Van Damme might last for a bit, but he still gets wasted.

Chuck Norris has the best chance against Lee, but I still think he loses. Chuck excelled in tournament Karate, but tournaments have rules & scoring and don't translate to real life very well.

Of the major stars Steven Segal has the best shot, and may even win. He trained in Akido from the founder of the art, and he's the real deal. If you see his black belt promotions tests he takes on multiple opponents at the same time and does lots of full contact stuff.

It would be far more realistic to put Bruce Lee up against someone like Royce Gracie or any one of the other Gracie brothers, or maybe Chuck Liddell or one of those full contact fighting guys.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-09-15 06:14pm

I would also point out that Jackie Chan and Chuck Norris already knew Bruce Lee and Norris Describes him as being much better.

aphexmonster · Post by **aphexmonster** » 2003-09-15 07:08pm

aerius wrote:Of the major stars Steven Segal has the best shot, and may even win. He trained in Akido from the founder of the art, and he's the real deal. If you see his black belt promotions tests he takes on multiple opponents at the same time and does lots of full contact stuff.

It would be far more realistic to put Bruce Lee up against someone like Royce Gracie or any one of the other Gracie brothers, or maybe Chuck Liddell or one of those full contact fighting guys.

Well aren't you the UFC scholar ?

If gracie couldn't get a grapple on Lee, i dont think the fight wouldn't last too long.

Montcalm · Post by **Montcalm** » 2003-09-15 07:26pm

aerius wrote:Jean Claude Van Damme might last for a bit, but he still gets wasted.

Are you serious Van Damme would`nt last a second against Bruce Lee,remember the Hell`s Angel he hired to guard his puny body,what i heard one punch and VD was in a fetal position craping his pants.

EmperorChrostas the Cruel · Post by **EmperorChrostas the Cruel** » 2003-09-15 08:44pm

Bruce Lee's contribution to fighting, was the use of science. Bruce did high speed movies of martial arts moves, with white dots painted on the test subjects. (motion studies) The various moves were photographed at high speed, and analysed. Variations of technique were tried and measured to see which variant was faster. He KNEW, and could prove with a stopwatch, that much of what he had been told traditionaly was CRAP! This earned him some prideful enemies. He never hesitated to dismiss legends and bullshit of martialist as lenend and outright bullshit.
Bruce Lee started from results, and worked backwards to find the reasons behind his methods' sucsess'. His pioneering was mainly cutting through the hype, misunderstandings, and outright bullshit in old combat styles. He put any move he thought he could use into his bag of tricks. he also rejected any move he thought was " a practiced mistake, unchalenged for millenia."(Like cocking the fist back further than a boxer would, which gives no power advantage, and is slower than a western boxing punch)

He also practiced quick drawing, and target shooting!
Jackie Chan said it best. "You can never be better than Bruce Lee because he's dead. Even if you are better than Bruce Lee, you are not better than Bruce Lee."

pellaeons_scion · Post by **pellaeons_scion** » 2003-09-15 10:29pm

Bruce was a true genius. Not as in he was blessed with supernormal physcial abilities, but more for his way of studying a martial art form, beit from western or eastern origins, then incorporate those techniques into his idea of a complete fighting system. The techniques he developed are I would say brilliant. He used practical applications of physics and biomechanics in his art. These helped to create a fighting system that made the best use of science, and made it so it was as destructive to its enemies as it was friendly to the student (in physical terms). Ive studied various martial arts, but when I studied JKD, its was like my eyes had been opened. There were no self harming techniques, if something didnt work for you, or you couldnt do it, our instructors worked with us to develop a way that would suit our needs.

Not conforming to a ridgid curriculum really helped our students develop as fighters. Much more emphasis was put on actual martial training, rather than the current trend of physical fitness (pushups situp etc). They are basics and are needed, yes. But to spend an hour on them, when thats an hour not training in the art? Nah... Now Ive moved IM pissed theres no JKD club here.

Looking back on the listing of fighters vs bruce, Id say the only one who would have a chance ( dont know much about seagal, cept rumours, nothing concrete) would be chuck. Least he was a tournament fighter. But bruce was a streetfighter, never shied from testing his skills against another. Its been said that the style you see on the screen isnt actually much like what he would use in a real fight. Yes we see glimpses of JKD in the movies, but from what we learnt, his real fighting style was vicious and effective, certainly not suitable for 'movies'.

He was great, combined the best and most useful of the techniques he found, and was constantly learning and adapting. He wasnt one to discard soemthing new just because its wasnt chinese....my own experience with MA schools is that they mostly got quite shitty when you used a technique from a different school....no matter if it worked or not.

Hail Bruce! The like I fear we shall not see again

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-09-15 10:48pm

Bruce Lee once said that he could defeat any person in the world in unarmed combat, and he was not one to make empty boasts.

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2003-09-15 10:51pm

Are there any videos of him actually fighting for real?

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