Moderator: Vympel
That's the average size. One was 120 km in diameter.Kuja wrote:The Legacy of Torment is said to be the size of a SSD.Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:Any YV ships over 2 km?
The Worldship is 10k in diameter.
The NJO sourcebook places the YV battleship at 2.2 kilometers.Kuja wrote:No figures are given for any of the others. (Golly, why would we put figures ina Guide to Vehicles and Vessels?)
YT300000 wrote:So, that book didn't have Nemesis class SDs, did it? (don't remember which book they were from, only website I can find on it is: http://njoproject.skywalkeronline.net/n ... esis.shtml)consequences wrote:Defender class Star Destroyer, 1.2 km NR
Endurance class Fleet Carrier, 1.2km NR
Star Destroyer 'Guardian' Identified as a 'Super Star Destroyer', length unknown, NR, from Destiny's Way
The Hapan carriers first shown at the end of Dark Journey are almost certainly greater than 1 km, precise length unknown
I would think the shipwomb to be a much more solid structure, than the widespread debris of a destroyed planet.Ender wrote:Negatiive, that interpratation was a fuckup by others, Nem Yim specifically says they targeted and destroyed a worldship. the shipwomb is the remnants of the planet, not a structure itself.FTeik wrote:The structure Jaina and Kyp destroyed was a shipwomb, not a worldship.
Source for the size? Because the weapons loadout for the Republic SD is large enough that making it a cruiser would be correct.[/quote]As for the vessels over 1km:
Defender-Class-SD (actually Nebula-Class-SD): 1,040 meter
Endurance-Class-Carrier: 1,040 meter (based on the same hull as Nebula)
Republic-Class-Cruiser (not to confuse with the Republic-Class-SD): 1,000 meter
Name really first appeared back in the black Fleet Crisis[/quote]KDY-warship of unknown class mentioned in "Star by Star": 1,000 meter, possibly Republic-Class (although that name first appeard in DW)
If cruisers can be in the range of 3km and battleships as small as 6 km, I'd say 4km would be a safe guess for now.[/quote]Mediator-Class-Battlecruiser: lenght unknown
Source?FTeik wrote:Just that the supposed-to-be-more-powerful Viscount-Stardefender can just challenge an ISD.
The New-class ships were able to as well, particularily the Nebula/Defender class Star Destroyers.phongn wrote:It's ludicrous to assume the Viscount can only 'just' win out over an Imperator II, considering than an MC90 is considered superior to the ISD design and MC80Bs do quite well against them also.
Hell, the old MC80's were still considered a near match for at least the older ISD models.Even considering the poor showing of the EU-described SSDs, the MC90s and MC80Bs have decent showings at any rate, and those SSDs were described at more powerful than ISDs.
The New-Class ships were also later than the MC80B/MC90 and of a wholly different design linage (IIRC, they're on the VSD line).Connor MacLeod wrote:The New-class ships were able to as well, particularily the Nebula/Defender class Star Destroyers.
Indeed. The MC80 and MC80A would be defeated but probably would inflict severe, if not crippling, damage. The Liberty-class might actually score a kill (perhaps at severe damage to herself) since that design seems to be of a greater tonnage (and likely better combat capability).Hell, the old MC80's were still considered a near match for at least the older ISD models.
Perhaps a little of column A, a little of column B? The MC80B is certainly a powerful design - the original EGVV said that it could outlast comparable Imperial ships due to its massive shielding; the MC90 improved in all areas (especially multi-species crew compatibility)Illuminatus Primus wrote:The poor showings of the Executors either require special circumstances for the Iron Fist and the Knight Hammer both, that all Executors suffer some weakness, or that the MC80B and MC90s are more powerful (and as I believe, larger) than previously thought.
I suspect the MC80B's were actually larger than the earlier MC80's despite being said only 1200 meters long (Hell, Home One was considered that large!) - they carried 4-8 fighter squadrons (earlier MC80's could only carry 3!) in addition to all that other stuff. I suspect they might ahve carried heavier guns despite the official evidence to the contrary as well.phongn wrote:Perhaps a little of column A, a little of column B? The MC80B is certainly a powerful design - the original EGVV said that it could outlast comparable Imperial ships due to its massive shielding; the MC90 improved in all areas (especially multi-species crew compatibility)Illuminatus Primus wrote:The poor showings of the Executors either require special circumstances for the Iron Fist and the Knight Hammer both, that all Executors suffer some weakness, or that the MC80B and MC90s are more powerful (and as I believe, larger) than previously thought.
the description of the place in rebirth and Nem Yom's statements overrule your thoughts.FTeik wrote:I would think the shipwomb to be a much more solid structure, than the widespread debris of a destroyed planet.Ender wrote:Negatiive, that interpratation was a fuckup by others, Nem Yim specifically says they targeted and destroyed a worldship. the shipwomb is the remnants of the planet, not a structure itself.FTeik wrote:The structure Jaina and Kyp destroyed was a shipwomb, not a worldship.
Gee, thanks for the evidence I asked for.About the Republic-Class-CRUISER we only know, that it is 1,000 meters long (interview with WJW, the ship is supposed to be an easily mass-produced vessel by KDY)
Name really first appeared back in the black Fleet Crisis[/quote]KDY-warship of unknown class mentioned in "Star by Star": 1,000 meter, possibly Republic-Class (although that name first appeard in DW)
Just that the supposed-to-be-more-powerful Viscount-Stardefender can just challenge an ISD.[/quote]No "just" about it. According to the movies, a Death Star can engage an ISDIf cruisers can be in the range of 3km and battleships as small as 6 km, I'd say 4km would be a safe guess for now.Mediator-Class-Battlecruiser: lenght unknown
Eh, a 1200m-long craft should be able to hold 4-8 fighter squadrons. They might well be larger and I'd suspect they'd have better gun layouts than the MC80/MC80As had.Connor MacLeod wrote:I suspect the MC80B's were actually larger than the earlier MC80's despite being said only 1200 meters long (Hell, Home One was considered that large!) - they carried 4-8 fighter squadrons (earlier MC80's could only carry 3!) in addition to all that other stuff. I suspect they might ahve carried heavier guns despite the official evidence to the contrary as well.
True.Connor MacLeod wrote:It says that it can engage Star Destroyers. That doesnt mean its equal to (it gives no indication of whether it just matches it or exceeds it, actually.)
Having rushed through "Rebirth" last night, i had to discover that you are right (although, considering the importance of the worldship, there might be a slight chance, that the huge structure (that didn´t resemble other worldships seen so far) was the shipwomb, with the worldship inside).Ender wrote:the description of the place in rebirth and Nem Yom's statements overrule your thoughts.FTeik wrote:I would think the shipwomb to be a much more solid structure, than the widespread debris of a destroyed planet.Ender wrote:Negatiive, that interpratation was a fuckup by others, Nem Yim specifically says they targeted and destroyed a worldship. the shipwomb is the remnants of the planet, not a structure itself.
Do i look like i would download or buy every bit of information i get about SW? Much of what i know i only memorize and if i don´t have the source myself i have to trust the guy, who quoted it in the first place, was honest.Gee, thanks for the evidence I asked for.About the Republic-Class-CRUISER we only know, that it is 1,000 meters long (interview with WJW, the ship is supposed to be an easily mass-produced vessel by KDY)
Your point? If you are talking about industrial abilities i want to remind you, that the NR employes/d a different approach of building ships, than the empire. Even if we get more standard ships with the New Class-vessels, they are suddenly vanished and replaced by a new design. Ask yourself: How many NR-ships "that can engage a star destroyer" have we seen over the years.And you are aware that Executor class vessels were easily mass produced vessels by KDY, right?
Destiny´s Way, page 45/46:How about some proof like I asked for rather then a vague reference and a repition that you are right?
No "just" about it. According to the movies, a Death Star can engage an ISD[/quote]Just that the supposed-to-be-more-powerful Viscount-Stardefender can just challenge an ISD.
FTeik wrote:True.Connor MacLeod wrote:It says that it can engage Star Destroyers. That doesnt mean its equal to (it gives no indication of whether it just matches it or exceeds it, actually.)
But i would think, that the gap in performance between the two ships would be really small. Now if they would have said "it can almost engage Super Star Destroyers "or "can engage three Star Destroyers at once". But what we get is "it can engage imperial Star Destroyers" and that from a ship, that is supposed to be twice the size of the biggest ships the MC have ever built.
If you're going to start playing semantics games, I can point out that it only says it can engage an Imperial (as in the Navy it belongs to, not the "name" of the class.) Star Destroyer, which could mean anything from a Victory class up to something much larger (Alleigance classes, one of the o ther various class types Saxton has identified such as from Dark Empire, etc.) the length is the key bit that proves the distinction that they are seperate classes.FTeik wrote:Do i look like i would download or buy every bit of information i get about SW? Much of what i know i only memorize and if i don´t have the source myself i have to trust the guy, who quoted it in the first place, was honest.Gee, thanks for the evidence I asked for.About the Republic-Class-CRUISER we only know, that it is 1,000 meters long (interview with WJW, the ship is supposed to be an easily mass-produced vessel by KDY)
The thing about the Republic-Class-Cruiser as an easily mass-produced vessel was on theforce.net in the Authors and Artists-Section, Walter Jon Williams. The link is http: //boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=5816776&page=27.
Unfortunately it doesn´t say anything about the lenght of the vessel, but i´m sure i´ll find that again, too, given enough time.
My point is the his description there doesn't give us alot of information.Your point? If you are talking about industrial abilities i want to remind you, that the NR employes/d a different approach of building ships, than the empire.And you are aware that Executor class vessels were easily mass produced vessels by KDY, right?
All of them. Any ship can engage another, its just a question of who wins and by how much. thats why that sentance provides zero useful information.Even if we get more standard ships with the New Class-vessels, they are suddenly vanished and replaced by a new design. Ask yourself: How many NR-ships "that can engage a star destroyer" have we seen over the years.
And as I said before, the weapons loadout and design makes the Republic class SD rate as a KDY scale cruiser.Destiny´s Way, page 45/46:How about some proof like I asked for rather then a vague reference and a repition that you are right?
Nine flights of fighters. Four corellian gunships. Three Kuat Systems Republic-Class-CRUISERS.
And of course an ISD can engage a DeathStar. But would this give us some values for comparison?[/quote]No, it wouldn't. That's my POINT.No "just" about it. According to the movies, a Death Star can engage an ISDJust that the supposed-to-be-more-powerful Viscount-Stardefender can just challenge an ISD.
MC80B ad MC90 are both in the cruiser scale, so they should be able to hand an ISD its ass on a silver platter.As for the MC80 or MC90 better than an ISD i fail to remember, where and when those ships showed to be superior (aside from KJA´s Darksaber).
Nebula class stats are useless for the comparison to Republic class stats as they wre from different systems, D6 and D20And if i count the ds for damage in the old WEG-stats together i get 480 ds for the ISD-I, 930 ds for the ISD-II, but only 252 ds for the MC80 and 426 ds for the MC90, the Republic-SD 660 ds and the Defender-SD 832 ds.
Alright, those are game-stats, but what shall we do?
Each of the MC80 letters are radically different designs, so I've toyed with the idea that possibly the number stands for some sort of time measurement, just as one gets "1974" into the AK-47, and some other classification basis than mere model. Afterall, they all are different designs and often have different purposes.Connor MacLeod wrote:I suspect the MC80B's were actually larger than the earlier MC80's despite being said only 1200 meters long (Hell, Home One was considered that large!) - they carried 4-8 fighter squadrons (earlier MC80's could only carry 3!) in addition to all that other stuff. I suspect they might ahve carried heavier guns despite the official evidence to the contrary as well.phongn wrote:Perhaps a little of column A, a little of column B? The MC80B is certainly a powerful design - the original EGVV said that it could outlast comparable Imperial ships due to its massive shielding; the MC90 improved in all areas (especially multi-species crew compatibility)Illuminatus Primus wrote:The poor showings of the Executors either require special circumstances for the Iron Fist and the Knight Hammer both, that all Executors suffer some weakness, or that the MC80B and MC90s are more powerful (and as I believe, larger) than previously thought.
The question is if that gun-layout on a 1200 meter vessel could be better than the entire front wedge of an Executor-class (albeit likely a dilapidated one)?phongn wrote:Eh, a 1200m-long craft should be able to hold 4-8 fighter squadrons. They might well be larger and I'd suspect they'd have better gun layouts than the MC80/MC80As had.
Or heavier guns simply.phongn wrote:Eh, a 1200m-long craft should be able to hold 4-8 fighter squadrons. They might well be larger and I'd suspect they'd have better gun layouts than the MC80/MC80As had.Connor MacLeod wrote:I suspect the MC80B's were actually larger than the earlier MC80's despite being said only 1200 meters long (Hell, Home One was considered that large!) - they carried 4-8 fighter squadrons (earlier MC80's could only carry 3!) in addition to all that other stuff. I suspect they might ahve carried heavier guns despite the official evidence to the contrary as well.
In that case they wouldn´t have wrote "imperial" with a capital "I".Connor MacLeod wrote:FTeik wrote:True.Connor MacLeod wrote:It says that it can engage Star Destroyers. That doesnt mean its equal to (it gives no indication of whether it just matches it or exceeds it, actually.)
But i would think, that the gap in performance between the two ships would be really small. Now if they would have said "it can almost engage Super Star Destroyers "or "can engage three Star Destroyers at once". But what we get is "it can engage imperial Star Destroyers" and that from a ship, that is supposed to be twice the size of the biggest ships the MC have ever built.
I remind you that as you've already said, the size of the Star Defender is much greater than the Home One class (Ref: Vector PRime) - which itself is nearly 4 kilometers long, suggesting it *is* probably much more powerful than an Imperator, but less powerful than an Executor-class.
If there would be more information, i would have probably posted it.My point is the his description there doesn't give us alot of information.
On the contrary. It shows, that the NR designed one vessel after the other, that could engage an ISD, but wasn´t satisfied with anyone of them. The ISD was that good, that the empire built at least 25,000 of those things.All of them. Any ship can engage another, its just a question of who wins and by how much. thats why that sentance provides zero useful information.
Not according to the official line of thought. Besides, the Rendili-Class-SD is smaller and has comparable weapons compared to the KDY-SD, not some kind of KDY-scale cruiser we only briefly glimpsed in DE.And as I said before, the weapons loadout and design makes the Republic class SD rate as a KDY scale cruiser.
What makes you think a cruiser built by the MC can hand an KDY-SD its ass on a silver platter?MC80B ad MC90 are both in the cruiser scale, so they should be able to hand an ISD its ass on a silver platter.
Because they can go head-to-head with SSDs?FTeik wrote:What makes you think a cruiser built by the MC can hand an KDY-SD its ass on a silver platter?
In novels written by KJA.Illuminatus Primus wrote:Because they can go head-to-head with SSDs?FTeik wrote:What makes you think a cruiser built by the MC can hand an KDY-SD its ass on a silver platter?
