What is the Miranda-class designation and role?

[Doomriser]

Much attention on the internet regarding Star Trek vessels has been devoted to inconsequential, insignificant differences and nitpicks in vessel classes. Very little investigation has gone into the so-called "Miranda" class starships, despite appearing to be the most profilic and continually-serving ship class in Starfleet.

What is the designation and role of the "Miranda" class starships in the TOS movie era? We know that, for example, the contemporary Constitution-class was probably designated as a heavy cruiser or battlecruiser. We also know that the Mirandas in TNG+ are used as a workhorse for all manner of tasks. I am more interested in its designation relative to the TOS Starfleet. From various non-canon books, websites, and even video games, I have seen the following defininitions for Miranda-class ships:

Heavy Frigate
Heavy Destroyer
Light Cruiser
Medium Cruiser

So the designation ranges from Heavy Frigate [Avenger deckplans] all the way to Medium Cruiser [Starfleet Academy] Can comparisons to other, non-canon contemporaries help discern the class? I know these are non-canon, but as far as I know, the Miranda doesn't have a canon designation.

We have to look, then, at what Miranda-class vessels are seen doing in the TOS movie era.

ST2: The U.S.S. Reliant is assigned to survey potential planetary test-sites for the genesis device. This is a high-security mission. We know that the crew is scientifically incompetent for their inability to register the fact that a planet in the system has exploded, despite even the fact that the U.S.S. Enterprise had presumably surveyed the system when is passed right by that planet several years before. In addition, the captain and commander of the ship both beam down unescorted into a potentially hazardous area, with disastrous consequences. If all Federation starships have such incompetent crews, then we learn nothing new about the Reliant. But if the problem was endemic to the Reliant, it may the the consequence of a militarily-oriented crew. On the other hand, a properly trained military crew, even without any scientific knowledge, would not have made the mistakes that the Reliant's crew did. Conclusion: The Reliant's mission was one of high risk, requiring both military and scientific/exploratory skill. She "followed in the footsteps" of the U.S.S. Enterprise, going where man had already been.

ST4: The U.S.S. Saratoga is disabled by the alien whale probe in the Sol system. Without information about its mission, we can assume that it might have been on patrol.

Also, the Soyuz-class modification, U.S.S. Bozeman, seen in TNG might be able to shed some light on the situation.

Another thing we know about the Miranda class is that Starfleet continued to produce them, whereas the Constitution-class was decommissioned. Why? How does the Miranda compare to the Constitution?

Armament: Visibly, the Miranda has at least as much, if not more, firepower than the Constitution. It has the saucer's ventral phasers, the two phasers mounted dorsally on the saucer, the photon torpedo launcher on the roll bar, and the aft torpedo launcher. The Constitution visibly has the forward torpedo launcher and ventral phasers. It may also have an aft launcher, but I haven't seen it. Some have suggested that the Miranda's phasers are weaker, but what evidence is there to support that? The Reliant was able to deal as much phaser damage to the Enterprise as vice-versa. I don't think there's any visual evidence, e.g. size of openings, to support that either.

Shielding: The Miranda's design actually allows for a tighter shield bubble. In terms of raw power generation however, the Constitution is probably the winner in this respect.

Hull: The Miranda has only a primary hull, a distinct disadvantage when it comes to the fragile Star Trek ships. The shuttlebay, engineering, weapons, science, living, command, etc... areas are all rolled into one. It probably has less shields-down combat survivability, though it still took as bad a beating as the Enterprise in ST2.

Speed: Generally, ships with raised nacelles seem to be the fastest, so the Constitution probably wins in this regard.

Other: The Constitution also almost certainly has a greater operational range compared to the Miranda and practically any other ship of its day until the advent of the Excelsior-class. The Constitution probably has greater living quarters and various other non-combat facilities.

My guess is that the Miranda offers most of the capabilities of the Consitution at a smaller build-price. While it loses in mission space, it does have the detachable roll-bar, which gives some customization. It may not have the long range and fancy facilities of the Constitution, but it does offer cheap, adequate service. The Excelsior probably made the Constitution obsolete and replaced it as the flag-type ship with the C&C, diplomatic, and long-range frontier exploration capabilities. But nothing emerged to fill the niche of the Miranda, arguably to Trek "present."

[Isolder74]

As far as I has seen or heard the Miranda-Class is a Constitution-Class saucer with 2 Connie Warp engines with a adition of the Weapons pod on top. It appears to have the same firepower as a Connie but with slightly lower cost to build. It does have the addition of the rear mounted torpedo tube perhaps due to a shorter turning radius because of the engine configuration. It appears that the ship with various upgrades is the Star Fleet ship built with the largest construction run. It seems that the ship must very easy to modify because Sisco's ship has an interior similer to TNG ships. The Reliant appears to be slightly less advanced then the "refit" Enterprise since the consols are slightly more like the original series consols than the new ones of the Enterprise. As for the crew not knowing about Ceti Alpha 5 is cause Kirk didn't place in his report the Kahn incident due to promise to Kahn about making sure he was left alone. besides the planet was now located in the sixth orbit instead of the fifth so don'e be too hard on them.

[Alyeska]

I would have to say when the Miranda came into service it was a Heavy Cruiser just like the Contistitution. Several offical sources list the Excelsior as a Battle Cruiser, and the info screen on the Enterprise called it a Heavy Cruiser. The Miranda seems to have identical firepower, slightly stronger shields at a lower cost. I would say be DS9 it is nothing more then an Escort Destroyer.

[Alyeska]

As far as I has seen or heard the Miranda-Class is a Constitution-Class saucer with 2 Connie Warp engines with a adition of the Weapons pod on top. It appears to have the same firepower as a Connie but with slightly lower cost to build. It does have the addition of the rear mounted torpedo tube perhaps due to a shorter turning radius because of the engine configuration. It appears that the ship with various upgrades is the Star Fleet ship built with the largest construction run. It seems that the ship must very easy to modify because Sisco's ship has an interior similer to TNG ships. The Reliant appears to be slightly less advanced then the "refit" Enterprise since the consols are slightly more like the original series consols than the new ones of the Enterprise. As for the crew not knowing about Ceti Alpha 5 is cause Kirk didn't place in his report the Kahn incident due to promise to Kahn about making sure he was left alone. besides the planet was now located in the sixth orbit instead of the fifth so don'e be too hard on them.

They used the exact same bridge for the Reliant as they did the Enterprise in ST2, they just lit the bridges up differently.

[Isolder74]

As far as I has seen or heard the Miranda-Class is a Constitution-Class saucer with 2 Connie Warp engines with a adition of the Weapons pod on top. It appears to have the same firepower as a Connie but with slightly lower cost to build. It does have the addition of the rear mounted torpedo tube perhaps due to a shorter turning radius because of the engine configuration. It appears that the ship with various upgrades is the Star Fleet ship built with the largest construction run. It seems that the ship must very easy to modify because Sisco's ship has an interior similer to TNG ships. The Reliant appears to be slightly less advanced then the "refit" Enterprise since the consols are slightly more like the original series consols than the new ones of the Enterprise. As for the crew not knowing about Ceti Alpha 5 is cause Kirk didn't place in his report the Kahn incident due to promise to Kahn about making sure he was left alone. besides the planet was now located in the sixth orbit instead of the fifth so don'e be too hard on them.

They used the exact same bridge for the Reliant as they did the Enterprise in ST2, they just lit the bridges up differently.

The shield control panel was different as was the weapons panel.

[Alyeska]

As far as I has seen or heard the Miranda-Class is a Constitution-Class saucer with 2 Connie Warp engines with a adition of the Weapons pod on top. It appears to have the same firepower as a Connie but with slightly lower cost to build. It does have the addition of the rear mounted torpedo tube perhaps due to a shorter turning radius because of the engine configuration. It appears that the ship with various upgrades is the Star Fleet ship built with the largest construction run. It seems that the ship must very easy to modify because Sisco's ship has an interior similer to TNG ships. The Reliant appears to be slightly less advanced then the "refit" Enterprise since the consols are slightly more like the original series consols than the new ones of the Enterprise. As for the crew not knowing about Ceti Alpha 5 is cause Kirk didn't place in his report the Kahn incident due to promise to Kahn about making sure he was left alone. besides the planet was now located in the sixth orbit instead of the fifth so don'e be too hard on them.

They used the exact same bridge for the Reliant as they did the Enterprise in ST2, they just lit the bridges up differently.

The shield control panel was different as was the weapons panel.

Minor differences at best. The budget for the movie was so low they had to use the same bridge for both ships. TMP was such a flop the studio wasn't going to risk large sums of money to be wasted on ST2.

[Doomriser]

Regarding the exploded planet, even if the planet was uncatalogued, the Reliant should have been able to detect debris or shifting gravitational orbits or environmental damage on neighbouring planets, etc... from the explosion. I expect that we could do it with 20th century science, from Earth, if the planet were in Venus/Mars orbits, never mind right by us.

[Alyeska]

Regarding the exploded planet, even if the planet was uncatalogued, the Reliant should have been able to detect debris or shifting gravitational orbits or environmental damage on neighbouring planets, etc... from the explosion. I expect that we could do it with 20th century science, from Earth, if the planet were in Venus/Mars orbits, never mind right by us.

That is one of the more major nitpicks about the movie. Some of the other issues can be rationalized away, but this? Its just a writers fuck up really. Hell, Checkov expected Khan to be alive on a planet they should have noticed didn't exist (had they been paying attention at all).

[Isolder74]

Regarding the exploded planet, even if the planet was uncatalogued, the Reliant should have been able to detect debris or shifting gravitational orbits or environmental damage on neighbouring planets, etc... from the explosion. I expect that we could do it with 20th century science, from Earth, if the planet were in Venus/Mars orbits, never mind right by us.

That is one of the more major nitpicks about the movie. Some of the other issues can be rationalized away, but this? Its just a writers fuck up really. Hell, Checkov expected Khan to be alive on a planet they should have noticed didn't exist (had they been paying attention at all).

Or Checov forgot were they had left Kahn but when he saw SS Botney Bay he freaked out.

[SCVN 2812]

Considering Chekov was in the science department at the time, and not a member of the bridge crew, I wouldn't be suprised if he didn't know where or didn't remember where Kahn was left. Not to mention the Kahn incident is fairly minor compared to some of the stuff the Enterprise was involved with. It's 1 nasty experience out of dozens and 1 system and planet out of a decades long career in Starfleet.

As far as detecting debries, even if they did detect the debries unless they stopped and paid much attention to it, how would they know if it was fresh or not since the debries had had a decade at least to cool off and settle into a relatively stable orbit.

[Doomriser]

Speaking of nitpicks...

At the beginning of ST:6, Sulu's Excelsior is stated to be cataloguing gaseous planetary anomalies.

Later at the climax, when the Ent-A is getting ripped a new one, someone mentions 'what about that equipment we have for cataloguing gaseous planetary anomalies?' and subsequently the torpedo is modified as we all know.

So the two most important ships in Starfleet, on opposite ends of the quadrant, both have equipment for cataloguing gaseous planetary anomalies? Either gaseous planetary anomalies are suddently a high priority for Starfleet science or the continuity departmen f*#ed up.

BTW I still find it amazing how Meyer managed to make TWOK, a vastly superior movie and arguably the best in the series, with such a smaller budget. I wonder what he would have done with an even higher budget. Naah, I can't imagine him doing it any better except maybe for picture quality/special effects and I haven't even seen the DVD SE.

[Patrick Degan]

The failure of the crew of the Reliant to notice the missing sixth planet of Ceti Alpha goes beyond their being a military crew. After all, we're not talking about a far distant star system. Ceti Alpha, or Menkar as it is otherwise known in the Bayer Catalogue, is only 54 light years from Earth —in the neighbourhood, so to speak. The system was certainly surveyed once before and registered at least six planets, and somebody should have put that in the records at some point. What kind of a crew enters into a known star system well within Federation space which is supposed to have a certain number of planets and not notice that one of them is missing!

Even a military crew should be able to count planets. Unless maybe they're all Marines (Navy joke —no offense intended).

[Isolder74]

The failure of the crew of the Reliant to notice the missing sixth planet of Ceti Alpha goes beyond their being a military crew. After all, we're not talking about a far distant star system. Ceti Alpha, or Menkar as it is otherwise known in the Bayer Catalogue, is only 54 light years from Earth —in the neighbourhood, so to speak. The system was certainly surveyed once before and registered at least six planets, and somebody should have put that in the records at some point. What kind of a crew enters into a known star system well within Federation space which is supposed to have a certain number of planets and not notice that one of them is missing!

Even a military crew should be able to count planets. Unless maybe they're all Marines (Navy joke —no offense intended).

yes they should have noticed but maybe they only scanned the planet they wanted and ignored the rest of the system cause it wasn't their business. They did seem to suffer from a major case of narrowmindedness.

[Isolder74]

The Mirandas apear to have started out as a medium cruiser and as time went it got moved lower and lower in the order of battle. The Conxtellation class came out and took its place as a medium cruiser. Now it seems to fill the role of a missile destroyer or fleet scout

[Moonshadow]

I do know that the Miranda was a very deadly ship durring the TOS period. It was able to stand toe to toe with the Flagship and nearly won. That should say something about what its military role might have been( Trek ships seem to have 2 roles a wartime and a peacetime role)

[consequences]

The charted orbit of the 6th planet might have put it on the far side of the sun from their location at the time, and trek sensors of that period might not have been capable of detecting matter without a signifigant energy signature at that distance.

[Cpt_Frank]

Aaah the Miranda my favorite ST ship (which I've also encountered under the name Avenger class btw).

How about missile cruiser? It features 4 launchers after all.

I would say be DS9 it is nothing more then an Escort Destroyer.

Indeed. A picket ship, probably a corvette or frigate.

[Isolder74]

Aaah the Miranda my favorite ST ship (which I've also encountered under the name Avenger class btw).

How about missile cruiser? It features 4 launchers after all.

I would say be DS9 it is nothing more then an Escort Destroyer.

Indeed. A picket ship, probably a corvette or frigate.

Kind of sad huh. These ships deserved more than that.

[Cpt_Frank]

Yes. They're capable vessels and it's somewhat strange that they're so weak in DS9 since the TOS federation had considerably stronger weaponry etc.

[Isolder74]

yep, if the ship is as easily modifiable as the shows indicate then they are worth far more than DS9 has credited them with. Incidetally the Constalation-Class seems to have been phased out but the Miranda is still flying around. Says alot for this TOS dinasaur

[Patrick Ogaard]

It seems that the Miranda class and its variants had, at least by the time of TNG, been largely put into semi-retirement. Simply removing the "roll bar" and remaining military weaponry allowed the ships to be operated as supply ships with small crews (such as the 26 of the USS Lantree). In case of military mobilization, the supply ships report to their homeports (starbases). The ship's military-grade equipment is re-attached (and is presumably as modular and easily swappable as the bridge modules), so that in the course of a few weeks possibly hundreds of Miranda warships would be ready for action across the Federation. Keeping a few Miranda-class or similar class ships fully active would keep Federation personnel familiar enough with the class that crews for basic military purposes could be quickly assembled.

As for what its classification should be, I agree with the other posters who maintain that the designation was almost certainly downgraded over time. Back in Kirk's day, when a Constitution-class ship was a heavy cruiser, a Miranda would have almost certainly been a light cruiser, able to stand toe-to-toe with anything less than a Constitution. By the time of Picard, frigate would have been the right classification for a Miranda-class ship, placing Mirandas at the lowest end of the capital ship scale: good enough to take out a smaller Cardassian cruiser or a Bird of Prey, but wise to stay out of one-on-one slugging matches with real capital ships. By the time of the Dominion War, the advancing level of military technology apparently begins to push the Miranda class into the neighborhood of corvettes. The addition of improved weaponry by the time of the Borg temporal invasion of Earth drags the Miranda kicking and screaming back into the neighborhood of frigates and destroyers.

Essentially, the Miranda seems like the Energizer Bunny of the UFP, a design at least as durable as the basic Klingon Bird of Prey. Both spaceframes are obviously amenable to extensive upgrades, modifications and tweaks.

As for their apparent fragility in DS9, that seems to be a problem with even the largest of combat vessels in DS9. Small numbers of hits at the beginning of a battle, at a time when shields should have been at 100%, were sufficient to cause massive structural damage to Warbirds, Galaxies and pretty much any other big ship type shown in visuals. The allied attack to retake the Chintoka (sp?) system is the prime example. The visuals did make the Defiant look ever so much tougher, though.

[Cpt_Frank]

I'm starting to think that they just removed the rollbar to justify the purchase of new warships instead of keeping the good old ones.

[Patrick Ogaard]

I'm starting to think that they just removed the rollbar to justify the purchase of new warships instead of keeping the good old ones.

You're forgetting that the Mirandas were obviously inferior to their replacements. Note the telltale lack of spontaneous, single-incident warp core plasma overproduction, which seriously reduced the peak power output of Mirandas compared to, say, Galaxy-class ships like the Yamato. Note also the telltale lack of smooth, organic, postmodern lines of the Miranda compared to an Intrepid.

The removal of the primary weapons systems was merely a way to help progress along. Forcibly.

[Guest]

In defence of Kirk in TWOK i would point out that the Enterprise was crewed by mainly caddets in training and that Kahn and his crew were bred to fight a war using any means neccessary. More to the point how was Kahn able to pin point the week point of the Constitution class. He repeatedly targeted the Engineering section.

[Cpt_Frank]

Yes, but nonetheless the Reliant kicked the E's ass, and with 2x number of launchers and the huge phasers that's no surprise.
Also very remarkable:
Reliant took a direct hit to that warp drive dome behind the roll bar.
Imagine such a crucial component being hit with a GCS!