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SWvST: the subject of the main site.

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seanrobertson
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Post by seanrobertson »

Not too long ago, someone posted a message to the effect that,
what would our resident Sith Master do if he tried to unilaterally support
the "Trek side"?

I've been thinking: why don't we have a thread in which we all
"switch sides," so to speak? Traditional Trek hard-liners would
support Star Wars, and Wars fans would embrace Trek. In the
Other Sci-Fi forum, B5 fans could pick one of the above, and so on.

I know it'll be difficult, but it could be fun. I'll pick up the gauntlet
and support a Star Trek victory over Star Wars...err, well, when I
think of something :) (I might have to jump ship to B5 over ST.)

For the purposes of this switcheroo, please accept the canon/official
policies outlined on Michael's site. As a turncoat, my first impulse
would be to try and remove the EU from the debate altogether, but
I don't think this is a valid move; furthermore, it's been done to death
(and is being done to death as we speak).

Also disallowed:

1--Time travel. The Krenim cannot score a Trek win by erasing the Empire from history.

2--Usage or reverse-engineering of stolen technology from another
side. This includes the Borg assimilating hyperdrive.

3--Ridiculous technological progression; e.g., Federation ships using
millions of Omega molecules as a power source.

4--Alliances between sworn enemies. Established alliances are okay.
But it'd be pushing it to have 8472, the Dominion, Borg, and Breen
going into battle together.

5--Intervention of god-like beings or one-hit wonders. Species 8472
isn't a one-hit wonder, but the Voth are. So are "The Hand" from
B5's "Legend of the Rangers."

6--Use of weapons whose effects are hotly in dispute; e.g., transphasic
torpedos. We don't want an argument about how the weapon in question works, why it'd do so-and-so to an Imperial ship, and so on. However,
Federation batmobile armor is allowed, provided you can make a convincing argument that it is in wide enough circulation to make a difference.

7--Extreme technological exchanges between friendly powers. The
Romulans wouldn't allow the Federation to use cloaking devices;
when and if the Federation learns anything from VGR's experience with
better FTL methodology, the Federation won't give the Klingons, say,
slipstream drives, etc.

8--Use of psi-kinetic powers to render an enemy helpless. The Vorlons
or Emperor Palpatine couldn't mind-screw the Borg or whoever with
a mere thought in this debate. We need geniune, physical warfare here: destruction of enemy worlds and assets, occupation, fleet engagements.

9--Use of the Galaxy Gun. Sorry :( but it makes things WAY too easy.

10--Use of the Shadow missile cloud to counter every invader's move.
Go with what we see: one active cloud on the show itself, one in a movie,
and a confirmed three in a novel.

If that's too many stipulations, lemme know. I just wanted to lay
down a few rules such that someone wouldn't take the opportunity
to turn the whole thing into satire (SW/ST/B5 ROOOOOLZ!) :)
Pain, or damage, don't end the world, or despair, or fuckin' beatin's. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, ya got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man ... and give some back.
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Cry woe, destruction, ruin and decay: The worst is death, and death will have his day.
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Post by HemlockGrey »

Nooo! Worship the Galaxy Gun!
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Slartibartfast
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Post by Slartibartfast »

Okay here goes...

hmm... ST ships are immune to beams that start with "L" and end with "ASER". if they start with something else then it's ok. A TIE fighter makes 100 mph according to the TIE-Fighter games. Also their lasers have a range of 2 km.

Every planet in the Star Wars galaxy circles the same star which is called Coruscant. That's why they can travel with such slow hyperdrives. This star is actually rocky, so people have colonized it and used as a capitol.

Also a light-year are much shorter, possibly because the Star Wars light travels much slower. That's why it's possible to go faster-than-light.

I will concede that Stormtrooper armor is virtually impenetrable (at least by their own weak lasers) but the Empire has only about 50 troopers or so. But their armor protects them and they can't be killed, that's why they always show up in every battle - they just dust themselves off and keep fighting.

<checks cheat sheet>

Ahem, Star Wars uses FUSION! You know what that is? is like, when you fuse two atoms together. I mean, c'mon! Just how much energy can you have from fusing two atoms? Instead, Star Trek uses dilithium-super-antimatter core, which is, I mean, OBVIOUSLY much better and rarely blows up (only about 10% of the time, which is pretty good, specially with the 132 million ships they have to spare... that's right, I actually counted them from onscreen evidence).

Also Star Trek is better because it uses real SCIENCE! not just fantasy shiny effects like SW. Like, lasers that can destroy worlds, how unbelievable is that? To destroy a world, you have to stop the atoms in a chain reaction, causing a cascade cracking of the Event Horizon. You need at least a mile-long quantum singularity for that!

Okay I'm done. Now, it's the Warsie, er, Trekkie turn to defend Star Wars.
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Post by Master of Ossus »

I refuse to essentially throw a debate. There are literally no arguments that could be reasonably advanced that would give ST any chance of victory.
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seanrobertson
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Post by seanrobertson »

Master of Ossus wrote:I refuse to essentially throw a debate. There are literally no arguments that could be reasonably advanced that would give ST any chance of victory.

Remember, however, that you don't necessarily have to take up the
cause for Star Trek. And there's always the Species 8472 cult, though
convincing me that they'd find sufficient balls to wage war with the Empire
might be an uphill battle :)
Pain, or damage, don't end the world, or despair, or fuckin' beatin's. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, ya got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man ... and give some back.
-Al Swearengen

Cry woe, destruction, ruin and decay: The worst is death, and death will have his day.
-Ole' Shakey's "Richard II," Act III, scene ii.
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Nobody
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Post by Nobody »

Slartibartfast wrote:Okay here goes...

Also a light-year are much shorter, possibly because the Star Wars light travels much slower. That's why it's possible to go faster-than-light.
.
Ahhhh!? The "Diskworld theroy" eh?? It's the first time I've heard THAT one...
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Post by Slartibartfast »

Nobody wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:Okay here goes...

Also a light-year are much shorter, possibly because the Star Wars light travels much slower. That's why it's possible to go faster-than-light.
.
Ahhhh!? The "Diskworld theroy" eh?? It's the first time I've heard THAT one...
"Relativity Theory Fuckup Thingamabob" is the accepted term :lol:
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Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi
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Post by Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi »

By "trading spaces", I was thinking of something like SW having the inferior technology, and ST having the galaxy-spanning Empire and the moon-sized battle stations. That would be interesting. But, Warsies would become Trekkies and vice versa, or perhaps the more rabid Trekkies wouldn't change is they're big enough fans of ST.
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Post by Typhonis 1 »

hmmm how could ST beat SW Easy Kirk points his finger Han looks and Kirk sucker punches him
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Post by Slartibartfast »

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:By "trading spaces", I was thinking of something like SW having the inferior technology, and ST having the galaxy-spanning Empire and the moon-sized battle stations. That would be interesting. But, Warsies would become Trekkies and vice versa, or perhaps the more rabid Trekkies wouldn't change is they're big enough fans of ST.
Um... the Enterprise's lasers wouldn't even penetrate the ISD's navigation shields... and all that.

C3P0 would devise a neuron particle singularity probe that would collapse the Enterprise's nuclear core with positronic mega-flunkers.
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