The Zulus vs the Roman Empire

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-11-16 01:59pm

Though some utterly bizarre cosmic joke, the Zulue empire at its height is transported through time and space, eventually becoming fused to the eastern frontier of the Roman Empire, circa Trajan, replacing the Empire's other eastern foes.

As might be expected, diplomacy quickly breaks down.

Shaka, mad with power, orders an invasion of this new land. The Empire is not idle, however, and is redeploying its legions to the new frontier in an effort to crush this new threat and expand its domain.

There can be only one!

Companion Cube · Post by **Companion Cube** » 2003-11-16 02:17pm

The Romans crush the Zulus with Bolt-action rifles and determination.

But yeah, the Romans do, iirc, have superior troop quality. (Though that could well be debatable)

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-11-16 02:25pm

Don't the romans have lots of armour and bitchin' tactics?

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-16 02:36pm

You are joking right? Zulu.....

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-16 02:38pm

Scenario....

Romans meet Zulus. Zulus let out warcry. Zulus die under a hail of fire and get bitchslapped by the Legion.

They have better economics, logistiics, and manpower. You are putting a Tribe up agaist the most powerful empire the world had ever seen. You might as well put a wheelchair vs a tank.

brothersinarm · Post by **brothersinarm** » 2003-11-16 02:44pm

Scenario....

Romans meet Zulus. Zulus let out warcry. Zulus die under a hail of fire and get bitchslapped by the Legion.

They have better economics, logistiics, and manpower. You are putting a Tribe up agaist the most powerful empire the world had ever seen. You might as well put a wheelchair vs a tank.

I would question the statement that Rome was the most powerful empire ever seen, but everything else is true. Zulus wouldn't have a chance, except in Civilization games

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-11-16 02:46pm

brothersinarm wrote:I would question the statement that Rome was the most powerful empire ever seen, but everything else is true. Zulus wouldn't have a chance, except in Civilization games

Relative to the other powers at it's time Rome was a giant. The only Empire that compare is the British Empire and even then it's iffy.

brothersinarm · Post by **brothersinarm** » 2003-11-16 03:19pm

True the Roman empire was large during it's time but there were empire that were as powerful, depending on people's perspective of what makes an empire powerful. If you're talking about size then the mogolian empire was the "most powerful" empire of it's time. Or the most country conquered would fall to the british. It's all about perspective and I just wanted to point out that encompassing statements such as rome being "most powerful empire the world had ever seen" aren't the way to go.

Hope I was clear, translating thoughts into words are quite difficult sometimes.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-11-16 03:44pm

Lets see the Zulu are all armed with short spears and no ranged weapons of any form, they have hide shields and no armor. Shaka can field about 40,000 troops, yet with a totally population base of only about 100,000 can't replace losses.

The Romans would slaughter the Zulu and swiftly conquer their lands if so inclined, the Zulu don't have much worth capturing.

paladin · Post by **paladin** » 2003-11-16 05:34pm

Roman would defeat the Zulus. But Zulus would give Rome alot of trouble!

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-11-16 05:42pm

Sea Skimmer wrote: The Romans would slaughter the Zulu and swiftly conquer their lands if so inclined, the Zulu don't have much worth capturing.

They have the economic boost that comes from 60,000 new slaves.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-17 12:15am

most powerful empire the world had ever seen

Maybe i should have been more specific.

It was the most powerful of ITs time. Of course it wasnt as powerful as the british empire. They were the romans of their time.

Trytostaydead · Post by **Trytostaydead** » 2003-11-17 12:54am

Strate_Egg wrote:most powerful empire the world had ever seen

Maybe i should have been more specific.

It was the most powerful of ITs time. Of course it wasnt as powerful as the british empire. They were the romans of their time.

Mmm.. maybe most GLORIOUS empire then? But I would probably go with the Mongol Empire.. they were just bitching people left and right. As for the British.. pah, they were good conquerors because they had no desire to stay home with their cooking!

But seriously.. zulu vs. the romans? What were the Zulu tactics like? Would they withstand an artillery barrage? Marched formations? Could the Zulus lay siege to a fortified position effectively? Could they withstand a Roman siege? Do they have cavalry? Artillery? Effective quartermasters?

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-17 01:05am

I still think they were the most powerful force of antiquity. Governmentally, militarily.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-17 01:07am

The Zulus did employ some intellegent strategy, but personaly i dont think the bull technique compares with the discipline and organization of the legion and auxilla.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-11-17 01:08am

Could the Zulus lay siege to a fortified position effectively

Judging by the movie ZULU, they cant hit the broad side of a barn with rifles.

Worlds Spanner · Post by **Worlds Spanner** » 2003-11-17 01:24am

It comes down to tactics largely, since the Romans had methods that they did not deviate from.

The most striking examples of this being a weakness was Hannibal's ability to destroy Roman armies with, I don't remember, 20-1 casualties or something?

On the other hand, a few hundred years later Boadicea's rebellion was put down with casualties of 1-100. Roma Victa indeed.

I don't know much about the Zulu's, but they strike me as somewhat similair to the Visigoths, at least in the match-up with Rome. The Visigoth's repeatedly lost in the field, but had a base of support that was never successfully Romanized and absorbed into the Empire. Something similair might happen with the Zulu's.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-11-17 01:27am

I don't know much about the Zulu's, but they strike me as somewhat similair to the Visigoths, at least in the match-up with Rome. The Visigoth's repeatedly lost in the field, but had a base of support that was never successfully Romanized and absorbed into the Empire. Something similair might happen with the Zulu's.

On the contrary, the Zulus have so few numbers that unlike the Guals or Visigoths the Romans could and would simply wipe out the Zulu tribe. It doesn't matter they would be Roman-ized or not, they'd be wiped out if they didn't.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2003-11-17 01:29am

Rome

Assets
Piliam(Javilin/ throwing spear): Each Legionaire caries 2 on his person into battle. when thrown can peirce through even the Roman's own shields(only weapon at the time that could). Would go through Zulu shields like a hot knife through butter. On impact they break becoming useless so they CANNOT be thrown back.

Tower Shield: Roman Standard Issue, almost half an inch thick and built to be easily carried on the parry hand with being dropped.

Gladius: Short Sword that allows the Romans to make maxilmum use of their Team based tactics.

Lorica Segmenta: Best armor of the day vary hard to penitrate. In clude rest of armor kit here as well(helhat. ect)

Limited Calvary

Best Siege equiptment at the time

Zulus

Assets
Short Spears: Small and basiallaly designed for mass poking attacks.

Leather Shields: large and mainly cover everything but mainly only ornimental.

Tactical analysis
Romans: Tight formation that march in formation and make use of devestating projectile weapons. Also the Turtle where the can use their shields to glance off enemy arrows fired on their formation. Very Deadly

Zulus: The Horns of the Bull. Formation of warriors are spilt into 4 groups. these groups march togather towards enemy. the center advances towards the enemy inviting a charging attack. the 'head' disperses to join the 'horns' that were moving to encircle the enemy and the enemy is then forced into the largest group the 'loins'. Very deadly!

both enemies have the advantage of good tactics but the Romans have better training an equiptment.

I give it to the Romans

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2003-11-17 07:21am

You are putting a Tribe up agaist the most powerful empire the world had ever seen.

That sums it up clearly.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-11-17 08:14am

Worlds Spanner wrote:It comes down to tactics largely, since the Romans had methods that they did not deviate from.

Not true. They had tactics that usually worked and strengths. They played to their strengths, but when terrain or circumstances demanded, they could vary their tactics quite a lot...

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-11-17 08:19am

Isolder74 wrote: Romans: Tight formation that march in formation and make use of devestating projectile weapons. Also the Turtle where the can use their shields to glance off enemy arrows fired on their formation. Very Deadly

The Tortoise is only really used in seige warfare, where projectiles are likely to be coming from all directions, including above.

Demiurge · Post by **Demiurge** » 2003-11-17 09:46am

The Zulus can only win if they have their Country Coo-Coo Clock Codpiece Zulu Warriors. No one can beat them.

Darth Gojira · Post by **Darth Gojira** » 2003-11-17 12:50pm

The ZULU?! The Persians went toe-to-toe, the Mongols could win in a toss-up, but the Zulu? How about this, same scenario, except with Aztecs(or Maya, or Toltecs, or Chichimecs, or Tarascans, or Tabascans, or Tlaxcalla, etc.). They would probably go down, due to superior tech, but you can never be too sure......