Darth Wong wrote:This is the problem with England and Europe; every damned thing seems to be "irreplaceable" and "historic". And delicate too.
Generally they are historic and irreplacable. And there is nothing problematic with that
Irreplaceable, eh? Technically, so was the run-down Shell gas station at the end of my street which they finally renovated this year. I think you're missing my intent, which was to point out that there is an excessive emotional attachment made to every damned little thing. Honestly, let's put this in perspective. We're talking about some bushes and flowers, for fuck's sake. Big deal. And if you invite somebody to show up at a place and you want his security people to be careful with the bushes and flowers ("irreplaceable" bushes and flowers hardly being a common condition), then perhaps you should tell him ahead of time, instead of expecting him to intuit that a bunch of shrubbery is a fucking national treasure.
Honestly, this whole story just sounds incredibly whiny to me. Oh no, the flamingoes were frightened!. What, are they going to need therapy now? And we couldn't get good TV reception while they were here! What, did they miss a rerun of ER?
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
I'm still getting over the fact that Dubya was allowed to helicopter onto the grounds of the palace ... the symbolism isn't exactly favouring the UK here...
...Anyone remember the last time a foriegn dignatary helicoptered onto the front lawn of the Whitehouse?
Η ζωή, η ζωή εδω τελειώνει!
"Science is one cold-hearted bitch with a 14" strap-on" - Masuka 'Dexter'
"Angela is not the woman you think she is Gabriel, she's done terrible things"
"So have I, and I'm going to do them all to you." - Sylar to Arthur 'Heroes'
I'll restate my question for anyone who might know, "Who decided that he would land in the garden?" I doubt the Bush administration told the British government that Bush had to land there, and if the British did its their own damn fault.
Setzer wrote:How about the Brits finally dump the royal family like the useless appendage they are?
How about the yanks dump their constituion like the inflexible archaic noncense it is?
Inflexible? Archaic?
The constitution's openess to interpretation, i.e. flexiblity, is it's chief strength. It accomodates views ranging from very conservative to very liberal.
The simple fact that after more than two centuries it's held an artificial construct together despite being stretched to the breaking point, that it's been the single thing that has unified a diverse population more than anything else, does not point to inflexibility, at all.
And here's a hint, replying to a suggestion to get rid of an ancient institution like the monarchy by calling a modern document archaic isn't particularly effective, you know. Just because you find that suggestion insulting doesn't mean that the first thing that comes to mind is the best counter.
Funny thing is, there'd be a huge number of Americans upset if the monarchy were abolished, and it seems like most Brits in on-the-spot interviews don't give a fuck.
The basis of "on-the-spot" interviews means jack and shit. Repeated polls over the years have shown continually that the Royal Family has a firm following, a few loons crying "republic!" and that manage to get on TV does not a full nation show.
In anycase, Frank, you no doubt get what Mackey was getting at, it's simply a time honoured tradition and they also bring in the tourists. The monarchy stays.
Admiral Valdemar wrote:The basis of "on-the-spot" interviews means jack and shit. Repeated polls over the years have shown continually that the Royal Family has a firm following, a few loons crying "republic!" and that manage to get on TV does not a full nation show.
In anycase, Frank, you no doubt get what Mackey was getting at, it's simply a time honoured tradition and they also bring in the tourists. The monarchy stays.
I wished we had our monarchy back. I may be a shameless monarchist, but *anything's* better than those stuid Federal Presidents we had (have)...
An Emperor just has a much cooler flair.
Great Dolphin Conspiracy - Chatter box
"Implications: we have been intercepted deliberately by a means unknown, for a purpose unknown, and transferred to a place unknown by a form of intelligence unknown. Apart from the unknown, everything is obvious." ZORAC GALE Force Euro Wimp Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority.
The_Lumberjack wrote:I expect we'll hear more about it in the next few days when the 'we won the rugby world cup' fever has died down and the media gets back to reporting the news.
Oh yeah...
IN YOUR FACE, WEEMADANDO!
*cackles insanely*
Meh. We deserved to lose with the stupid rugby we'd been playing. We were lucky to make it that far.
Just FYI - still not been reported in the British News. Methinks 'tis a pile of bovid waste...
"I fight with love, and I laugh with rage, you gotta live light enough to see the humour and long enough to see some change" - Ani DiFranco, Pick Yer Nose
"Life 's not a song, life isn't bliss, life is just this: it's living." - Spike, Once More with Feeling
InnerBrat wrote:Just FYI - still not been reported in the British News. Methinks 'tis a pile of bovid waste...
It's probably true, but it's probably also overblown. As I said earlier, we're talking about some SS people stepping on a few flowers. Big fucking deal.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
InnerBrat wrote:Just FYI - still not been reported in the British News. Methinks 'tis a pile of bovid waste...
It's probably true, but it's probably also overblown. As I said earlier, we're talking about some SS people stepping on a few flowers. Big fucking deal.
Unless one of the flowers happened to have a plaque in front of it saying: "In memory of..."
InnerBrat wrote:Just FYI - still not been reported in the British News. Methinks 'tis a pile of bovid waste...
It's probably true, but it's probably also overblown. As I said earlier, we're talking about some SS people stepping on a few flowers. Big fucking deal.
Unless one of the flowers happened to have a plaque in front of it saying: "In memory of..."
Was this the case here? If so, how big was the plaque, how obvious was it, why didn't anyone say anything at the time, are you sure the flower was tthe monument, do they also start crying whenever winter comes, and did it ever occur to you why most people use something more durable, like a headstone? If not, then why are you bringing it up?
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
weemadando wrote:
Unless one of the flowers happened to have a plaque in front of it saying: "In memory of..."
Was this the case here? If so, how big was the plaque, how obvious was it, why didn't anyone say anything at the time, are you sure the flower was tthe monument, do they also start crying whenever winter comes, and did it ever occur to you why most people use something more durable, like a headstone? If not, then why are you bringing it up?
Hey, when I heard the story it was kind of laughable too, but I know that the grounds of Buckingham palace are nothing short of immaculate, not to mention an astounding garden. And I'm fairly sure that there are a few "in memory..." spaces. And it strikes me that your philosophy on such things is different to mine, possibly a product of culture. Many of our family don't have gravestones, instead choosing to have a rosebush, tree or other plant placed on the site of the grave, or in the case of cremation, just a plant placed somewhere with a plaque.
Also, what would happen if the British did a similar thing to the White House grounds? Trampling the rose garden etc?
weemadando wrote:Hey, when I heard the story it was kind of laughable too, but I know that the grounds of Buckingham palace are nothing short of immaculate, not to mention an astounding garden.
Then inviting Bush to come there with his helicopters was a dumb idea on their part. As an analogy, if you have some kind of exotic deep-pile super-delicate carpet in your living room and you decide to invite a bunch of people to hold a party in there, you can hardly go blaming the guests when the carpet gets messed up. It was your own decision, and your own fault, particularly if your concerns did not occur to you until after the party.
And I'm fairly sure that there are a few "in memory..." spaces. And it strikes me that your philosophy on such things is different to mine, possibly a product of culture. Many of our family don't have gravestones, instead choosing to have a rosebush, tree or other plant placed on the site of the grave, or in the case of cremation, just a plant placed somewhere with a plaque.
We have real winters here. We use headstones.
Also, what would happen if the British did a similar thing to the White House grounds? Trampling the rose garden etc?
If they were invited to land on the rose garden in their helicopters? I can only imagine that people would be getting on websites like this one and laughing at what an idiot George Bush is for inviting somebody to land on his rose garden in a helicopter and then whining about it afterwards.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
I don't think that would have happen, because we would have told the british where to land the plane. Just as the people at the palace must have told the preseident plane to land. And as someone said before I doubt bush and his escort plane just howed up and said "wow that looks like a good place to land. This thing has been planned for months now. if someone had a problem with it they should have said something before it happened.
"The point of war isn't to die for your country, but to make the other bastard die for his" Gen. George Patton.
Darth Wong wrote:
We have real winters here. We use headstones.
This also applies to some of my family in Canada...
If they were invited to land on the rose garden in their helicopters? I can only imagine that people would be getting on websites like this one and laughing at what an idiot George Bush is for inviting somebody to land on his rose garden in a helicopter and then whining about it afterwards.
I don't think they anticipated quite that much damage, still doesn't make the complaint any less silly.
TheDarkling wrote:I certainly don't want head of state and head of government combined in one
I never even realized they could be separated. If the head of state isn't also the head of government, then what the hell is it?
"Okay, we're going to have a real leader who makes decisons and probably half of us will hate him at any given time, but then let's also have a fake leader that we all love, except for the people who think this whole idea is just plain stupid! Whee!"
Huh???
If Religion and Politics were characters on a soap opera, Religion would be the one that goes insane with jealousy over Politics' intimate relationship with Reality, and secretly murder Politics in the night, skin the corpse, and run around its apartment wearing the skin like a cape shouting "My votes now! All votes for me! Wheeee!" -- Lagmonster
Darth Wong wrote:snip
Irreplaceable, eh? Technically, so was the run-down Shell gas station at the end of my street which they finally renovated this year. I think you're missing my intent, which was to point out that there is an excessive emotional attachment made to every damned little thing. Honestly, let's put this in perspective. We're talking about some bushes and flowers, for fuck's sake. Big deal. And if you invite somebody to show up at a place and you want his security people to be careful with the bushes and flowers ("irreplaceable" bushes and flowers hardly being a common condition), then perhaps you should tell him ahead of time, instead of expecting him to intuit that a bunch of shrubbery is a fucking national treasure.
Honestly, this whole story just sounds incredibly whiny to me. Oh no, the flamingoes were frightened!. What, are they going to need therapy now? And we couldn't get good TV reception while they were here! What, did they miss a rerun of ER?
As to irreplacible items..I was thinking of buildings etc, not flowers.
When you talk about flowers in someones home ,or the entire garden,then thats a different matter. The point is is that the USSS should have at least been diplomatic about it, they did it without so much as a by your leave in the home of another nations head of state.
As to TV reception and flamingoes, well, I couldnt care less actually..
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Setzer wrote:How about the Brits finally dump the royal family like the useless appendage they are?
How about the yanks dump their constituion like the inflexible archaic noncense it is?
Inflexible? Archaic?
The constitution's openess to interpretation, i.e. flexiblity, is it's chief strength. It accomodates views ranging from very conservative to very liberal.
Interesting, thew British/English monarchy has been like that for its entire history..bar that Interregnum thing.
The simple fact that after more than two centuries it's held an artificial construct together despite being stretched to the breaking point, that it's been the single thing that has unified a diverse population more than anything else, does not point to inflexibility, at all.
so? but I am glad to see you putting up an argument.
And here's a hint, replying to a suggestion to get rid of an ancient institution like the monarchy by calling a modern document archaic isn't particularly effective, you know. Just because you find that suggestion insulting doesn't mean that the first thing that comes to mind is the best counter.
And hear is a wee hint for you, and Setzer. The Brits choice of system is there choice alone. Calling the British monachy a useless appendage without any thought as to what it does, how it functions and why it is still there in this day and age, is not particuly effectve position, which is why I said what I said. Ask a stupid question and expect a stupid answer
Funny thing is, there'd be a huge number of Americans upset if the monarchy were abolished, and it seems like most Brits in on-the-spot interviews don't give a fuck.
so?
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
