Virus-X Debate (updated Dec 15!)

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-12-02 04:31pm

I believe that many of the Trekkies believe the accepted conclusion on the Imps crushing the Feds is simply due to deceptive debate techniques on the part of "Warsies" (it no doubt helps to have RSA telling them that this is precisely the case), and that they need only kick in the door and the whole rotten edifice will come crumbling down, much as Hitler thought would occur during his invasion of Russia.

RSA hurts them more than he helps them, because he falsely buoys their confidence by convincing them that their enemies will break and scatter before his irrefutable arguments (hell, he even puffs them up with a lot of warlike analogies and language). The result is that they honestly believe that they can simply quote his arguments and win any debate. We've seen this behaviour twice already, with AJT and now with Virus-X. There are huge holes in his arguments which they are simply not prepared to deal with, so they can talk amongst themselves and feel pretty confident, but everything falls apart the instant they actually try to engage the Evil Warsie Horde in battle.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-02 04:42pm

*Howls with laughter.* That's great! I especially like the part about the Evil Warsie Horde.

Seriously, they really buy RSA's arguments? (I use the term "arguments" loosely, but there it is.) A five year old child could see through them.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2003-12-02 04:46pm

Rogue 9 wrote:*Howls with laughter.* That's great! I especially like the part about the Evil Warsie Horde.

Seriously, they really buy RSA's arguments? (I use the term "arguments" loosely, but there it is.) A five year old child could see through them.

Don't be so sure of that. RSA isn't an idiot; he knows preciecly the language to use to ensnare physics-impared Trekkies to his way of thinking. Sure his arguments have holes but they are so doused in legalese that on the surface they seem very compelling. By the time they read SD.Net's couter-points, they have already converted to the Church of Darkstar and no longer accept any logical argument.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-02 04:53pm

Bleh. I ran into DarkStar before I ever heard of SD.net, and was completely unimpressed. This was back when I was naive enough to believe that Trek might put up a good fight.

But the gaping holes were, well... gaping. No other word for it. Legalese never impresses me much. *Shrug.* Maybe its just because I paid attention to my (awesome) physics teacher in high school. But anyone who equates joule with watt and refuses to accept otherwise when corrected goes on the "ignore" list for me.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-12-02 04:57pm

The Kernel wrote:Don't be so sure of that. RSA isn't an idiot; he knows preciecly the language to use to ensnare physics-impared Trekkies to his way of thinking. Sure his arguments have holes but they are so doused in legalese that on the surface they seem very compelling. By the time they read SD.Net's couter-points, they have already converted to the Church of Darkstar and no longer accept any logical argument.

"Quickly, my children, drink the blue milk! The Warsie Hordes are upon our gates!"

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2003-12-02 05:02pm

Who the fuck is that guy?

Atavarius · Post by **Atavarius** » 2003-12-02 05:12pm

Jim Jones.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2003-12-02 05:17pm

Rogue 9 wrote:Bleh. I ran into DarkStar before I ever heard of SD.net, and was completely unimpressed. This was back when I was naive enough to believe that Trek might put up a good fight. But the gaping holes were, well... gaping. No other word for it. Legalese never impresses me much. *Shrug.* Maybe its just because I paid attention to my (awesome) physics teacher in high school. But anyone who equates joule with watt and refuses to accept otherwise when corrected goes on the "ignore" list for me.

Oh I agree with that certainly. I always thought Darkstar was pretty much a moron at first too. The thing is, physics isn't even a required course in most high schools and a lot of kids tend to avoid it due to the math required. So because of this, we have people like Darkstar who can use a lot of big words a fool these kids into believing him.

I still think Darkstar isn't stupid; the men who sold snake oil as a plague remedy weren't stupid, just dishonest and shameful. The only question in my mind is if Darkstar really believes his own filth or if he just does it to get attention.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-02 05:22pm

Physics was required where I went to school. Along with chemistry and biology. At least if you wanted anything over the basic diploma, something that less than a tenth of my class earned. *Shrug.* Oh well.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-12-03 01:06am

Darth Wong wrote:I believe that many of the Trekkies believe the accepted conclusion on the Imps crushing the Feds is simply due to deceptive debate techniques on the part of "Warsies" (it no doubt helps to have RSA telling them that this is precisely the case), and that they need only kick in the door and the whole rotten edifice will come crumbling down, much as Hitler thought would occur during his invasion of Russia.

RSA hurts them more than he helps them, because he falsely buoys their confidence by convincing them that their enemies will break and scatter before his irrefutable arguments (hell, he even puffs them up with a lot of warlike analogies and language). The result is that they honestly believe that they can simply quote his arguments and win any debate. We've seen this behaviour twice already, with AJT and now with Virus-X. There are huge holes in his arguments which they are simply not prepared to deal with, so they can talk amongst themselves and feel pretty confident, but everything falls apart the instant they actually try to engage the Evil Warsie Horde in battle.

Actually that was one thing I noticed that differentiated Virus-X from Darkstar at least - he seemed not interested in "cutting down" Star Wars by irrationally attacking its sources. He just decided to pretend Star Trek was in fact superior by inaccurate and dishonest analysis.

Darkstar, on the other hand, appears to employ a method that is a distorted image of what he no doubt thinks you do: He tried to cut down wars to the weakest degree while building Trek up to an implausible degree. Of course, it never occurs to him that things might *actually* be that way objectively, and because it doesnt work his way he has to resort to irrational and dishonest tactics to make his point.

Basically he's trying to make the square pegs fit the round holes and hasn't yet realized the shapes don't match up.

Oh, and if you don't believe his logic is some bizarre mutant parody of Mike (and of Curtis for that matter), all one has to do is point oto his "MUM" theory for superlasers and the "super-antimatter" he pretends exists. (Phaser chain reactions and hypermatter, anyone?)

(PS: Don't go giving him ideas with the "Evil Warsie Horde" - he'll start likening the Warsies to Mongols, you or Wayne to Genghis Khan, and simply shout even louder just how he's the "last bastion of Trek")

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-03 01:27am

So? And what did the Mongols do to bastions?

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-12-03 02:11am

Rogue 9 wrote:So? And what did the Mongols do to bastions?

I like the n00b already

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-12-03 02:18am

Rogue 9 wrote:So? And what did the Mongols do to bastions?

Its the principle of the thing. Its disturbing to see Darkstar equate the discussions to real life even in minor degrees. Its bad enough that he thinks he's a giant white whale.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-03 02:21am

Quick, get the harpoons! *Pulls out a +3 harpoon of logic.* (No, I'm not ever going to take DS seriously.

)

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2003-12-03 03:14am

Ender wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:So? And what did the Mongols do to bastions?
I like the n00b already

Heheh. Just got done with the Mongols in Civ 101. Interesting reading. So, when do we ask DarkStar to give us 10,000 cats and sparrows as ransom to leave him alone and then light them on fire and send them running back to his webpage? (One of Genghis Khan's favorite tricks.

)

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2003-12-03 08:56am

I hope that you make him cry Mike ... does that make me cruel?

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2003-12-03 09:46am

Crown wrote:I hope that you make him cry Mike ... does that make me cruel?

Nah, I'm in full agreement there.

The dork is pretty much as ignorant and as stupid as one gets...though I'm sure he's assured in his mind of his great victory, regardless of how he looked against Mike.

Sharp-kun · Post by **Sharp-kun** » 2003-12-03 09:55am

The Kernel wrote:By the time they read SD.Net's couter-points, they have already converted to the Church of Darkstar and no longer accept any logical argument.

Once you start down the Dark Path, forever will it dominate your destony....

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2003-12-03 10:52am

Connor MacLeod wrote:Its bad enough that Darkstar thinks he's a giant white whale.

Well, thats about the only type of girl who would find him appealing. Perhaps there is meanign to his madness.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-12-03 05:30pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
Darth Servo wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Not a word. Either he intends to pull the Andrew Joshua Talon trick of taking weeks to reply, or he believes that his pitiful "I don't recognize your rebuttal because you only put it on the Web and then E-mailed it to me as a PDF rather than typing out the text in plain ASCII E-Mail format" excuse is actually a workable way to get out while saving face.
Well he IS using AJT's tactic of running to other trekkies on the net for advice, so that obviously takes some time for them to email back and forth.
*Snort.* Watch 'em band together and try to lead a charge. I hope so, actually. That'd be fun to watch.

What Trekkies are left to charge with him? The reasonable ones have conceded the debate and the unreasonable ones have had their assholes cored out already. Maybe he could gather a couple of whoever's left of Darkstar's clique on Spacebattles (what have they done since their great leader was banned, by the way?), but those morons aren't going to be much help.

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2003-12-03 06:19pm

RedImperator wrote:What Trekkies are left to charge with him? The reasonable ones have conceded the debate and the unreasonable ones have had their assholes cored out already. Maybe he could gather a couple of whoever's left of Darkstar's clique on Spacebattles (what have they done since their great leader was banned, by the way?), but those morons aren't going to be much help.

There are several over at Trek BBS that think Darkstar is the second comming.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-12-03 06:28pm

Darth Servo wrote:
RedImperator wrote:What Trekkies are left to charge with him? The reasonable ones have conceded the debate and the unreasonable ones have had their assholes cored out already. Maybe he could gather a couple of whoever's left of Darkstar's clique on Spacebattles (what have they done since their great leader was banned, by the way?), but those morons aren't going to be much help.
There are several over at Trek BBS that think Darkstar is the second comming.

You mean the ass-clowns who think that George Lucas doesn't have the right to say what is and isn't true in Star Wars? Even the average Trekkie fanatic couldn't take those fuck-nuts seriously.

Rightous Fist Of Heaven · Post by **Rightous Fist Of Heaven** » 2003-12-03 07:01pm

Darth Wong wrote:
Darth Servo wrote:
RedImperator wrote:What Trekkies are left to charge with him? The reasonable ones have conceded the debate and the unreasonable ones have had their assholes cored out already. Maybe he could gather a couple of whoever's left of Darkstar's clique on Spacebattles (what have they done since their great leader was banned, by the way?), but those morons aren't going to be much help.
There are several over at Trek BBS that think Darkstar is the second comming.
You mean the ass-clowns who think that George Lucas doesn't have the right to say what is and isn't true in Star Wars? Even the average Trekkie fanatic couldn't take those fuck-nuts seriously.

Yep, those same personae. Altough some of them who believe Dorkstars BS are a bit more on the reasonable side than the others (which isnt saying much yet). Im in a debate with Kazeite at the moment over for instance the admissability of EU and the canonity of AOTC:ICS. Not to mention the arguments that capital starships during Republic era dont have enough power to power up SPHA-T cannons (this belief came from the mentioning at the site's EU section) and ofcourse the growth of torpedo glow (supprisingly based on other episodes than Rise).

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2003-12-04 12:18am

Darth Servo wrote:
Connor MacLeod wrote:Its bad enough that Darkstar thinks he's a giant white whale.
Well, thats about the only type of girl who would find him appealing. Perhaps there is meanign to his madness.

Moby Dick is male. Perhaps he has some sort of bizarre sea-life beastiality fetish and its simply role-playing to him.

Maybe Virus-X is taking so long because he has to help out?

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-12-04 12:22am

Connor MacLeod wrote:
Darth Servo wrote:
Connor MacLeod wrote:Its bad enough that Darkstar thinks he's a giant white whale.
Well, thats about the only type of girl who would find him appealing. Perhaps there is meanign to his madness.
Moby Dick is male. Perhaps he has some sort of bizarre sea-life beastiality fetish and its simply role-playing to him.

Maybe Virus-X is taking so long because he has to help out?

You mean they go here?