Return of the King Discussion Thread (MAJOR SPOILERS!)

D.Turtle · Post by **D.Turtle** » 2003-12-16 11:38pm

I just got back from LOTR 3 (Triple Night).

The movie is simply amazing. This is an absolute must-see.
Eventhough it is very long (198 minutes), you do not get bored at all (at least I wasnt).

I just hope that your Cinema has better sound than the one I went to did, because it was just terrible (vibrating bass, swinging high notes - especially trumpets). Needless to say, I'm not going to that cinema anytime soon.

But Return of the King is simply absolutely amazing.

Do NOT, under any circumstances, miss this movie in the cinema.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2003-12-16 11:54pm

I don't plan on it.

See it in the theater.

Then wait for the Extended version.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2003-12-17 05:04am

It was ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC! Do not read any further, drop what you're doing and GO SEE IT. I thought maybe Peter jackson might drop the ball with so many things to juggle, so many things cut but he out did himself. This movie is a modern masterpiece, a classic for all time and I don't think I have the words for it.

It is beautiful and before anyone asks you will NOT miss the Saruman scene. Jackson handles it superbly with a few sentences from Gandalf, we get the gist, Saruman is out of the picture onto the main fucking event.

The Battle of the Pelennor fields has to be one of the finest battle scenes ever committed to film. This is not mere hyperbole, when you see the sheer number of troops and the interaction as well as siege engine duels and the like you will be awestruck. The charge of the Rohirrim is a marvel to behold. And when we get to Eowen and the witch king you cannot help cheer for her (Though the Darth Vader like helmet apparatus to distinguish him from the other wraiths was a tad diappointing)

The undead army that Aragorn brings at the close of the battle is chilling. And then we have the true stars, Frodo and Sam. Their performances were superb, Elijah Woods' performance was subtle and powerful. You could feel his despair and his agony. He did not just act torn and tempted you really believed it and the way his eyes expressed such emotion and anguish it could move you to tears.

Sam was amazing and you could feel the bond between the two, the real love and commitment.

Shelob's scene was handled well and it truly was frightening and see was a wonder of CGI.

Saruman was simply not missed neither was the scouring so all you pursits go cry somewhere else.

A small flaw that made me a tad pissed just because it marred an otherwise flawless film:

The shoehorning of Arwen into the last act was more than upsetting. Get over it she was a tertiary character at best!!! For Elrond to suddenly say: "The fate of Arwen and the ring are now bound" made me want to reach for my popcorn tub and projectile vomit into it.

It follows a pattern that was not as intrusive as Fellowship where she fit in flawlessly because she had one minor scene (Though it robbed Frodo of a heroic moment confronting the wraiths, guesss we have to justify Liv's salary somehow right?

) but in TTT and more disgustingly here she is shoehorned wherever they can find room and then to simply state that her life is now bound to the fate of the ring was absolutely absurd.

GO SEE THIS MOVIE. IN FACT DO AS I AND SEE IT MORE THAN ONCE.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-12-17 05:06am

Return of the King is definitely the best movie I've ever had the oppurtunity to see; it far outstrips even Fellowship of the Ring. It's nothing sort of absolutely amazing and by the time it ended there wasn't a dry eye in the house. Simply fabulous! There are a few things that might ruffle a few feather with the die hard purists (and I count myself close kin of theirs) and I was simply too swept away to care. Cinematic story telling at it's best.

Now to get some sleep, find some cash and repeat the experience all over again.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-12-17 05:11am

Oh, I would like to offer a condolences to the poor bastards at the AMC 20 that had their theater crap out before they got to see it.

Post by **Dalton** » 2003-12-17 05:12am

I feel I must agree more or less with what Stravo said, though I would have liked to see a little more of Isengard and I did not mind Arwen in the final act.

But I must say...this movie had a bit of a shaky start...and ended absolutely spectacularly. It is a worthy ending to an awe-inspiring saga. I must admit, I haven't almost-cried at a movie ever since Millennium Actress...until today. The scene near the end when Aragorn and Arwen, hell, the entirety of the people arrayed at the top of Minas Tirith, bowed to the hobbits made me choke up and brought tears to my eyes. It was the absolute fulfillment of Galadriel's words: "Even the smallest person can change the course of the future." Indeed they did, and indeed their lofty deeds far outdid their small stature, and that one scene alone signified that far better than any other. It was a marvelous moment in cinema history.

I cannot wait to share this experience with my friends on Saturday.

Psycho Smiley · Post by **Psycho Smiley** » 2003-12-17 08:19am

So, going to see it today, and then again with my sister when I get home next week is a good idea?

D.Turtle · Post by **D.Turtle** » 2003-12-17 09:40am

See this movie as often as you possibly can in the cinemas

Best comment of Gimli: "That still only counts as one" (after Legolas single-handedly kills an oliphant).

Seeing it again next week in Frankfurt in the big cinema there (with laser show and everything)

Maybe then I can appreciate the charge of the Rohirrim even more.

This movie is by far the best of the trilogy (better than the other two combined IMO - and they were excellent).

The birds-eye view of the human army being surrounded at the Black Gate - wow.

To see the Nazgul start their assault on them and then suddenly see the giant eagles swoop out of the skies to engage them - wow.

And the ending of the movie was simply heart-tearing.

Damn, this movie is great

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2003-12-17 12:22pm

The local movie reviewer for The St. Petersburg Times did not particularly enjoy the first two movies and had never read the books. He loved this movie.

SHODAN · Post by **SHODAN** » 2003-12-17 01:10pm

I merely wanted to say I enjoyed Return of the Dwarf Comedian as well, and will enjoy again in foreseeable future.

Ace Pace · Post by **Ace Pace** » 2003-12-17 01:19pm

Hmn, all I can say, right now is

GODDAMIT I MISSED THE TRILOGY VIEWING THANKS TO A TAFFIC JAM

well, 23 more hours of the regular premir here.

Super-Gagme · Post by **Super-Gagme** » 2003-12-17 03:01pm

Actually I was a bit disappointed

Now don't start flaming me! I felt some of the cuts made the movie jump around too quick in some points. Sure there was a lot to fill in but I just kept getting a feeling of "Hmm that was a bit rushed" and I also felt the assault on Minas Tirrith had some bad structuring. From the book I was engrossed in the battle, understanding and visualising everything, the whole time unable to put it down. During the movie it seemed hard to follow exactly how the battle was playing out and kept getting cut too often to Frodo and Sam also. I am not saying the movie was bad, just that I went in expecting more and came out disappointed. I am putting my faith in the extended edition.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-12-17 03:50pm

Does it include Prince Imrahil, and does Frodo claim the ring for himself?

PackMule · Post by **PackMule** » 2003-12-17 04:13pm

Super-Gagme wrote:... and I also felt the assault on Minas Tirrith had some bad structuring. From the book I was engrossed in the battle, understanding and visualising everything, the whole time unable to put it down. During the movie it seemed hard to follow exactly how the battle was playing out and kept getting cut too often to Frodo and Sam also. I am not saying the movie was bad, just that I went in expecting more and came out disappointed. I am putting my faith in the extended edition.

I get what you're saying, but I disagree. I always found Tolkien's descriptions of battles to be rather lacking. I have never been a major fan of the books, but I always found the written battles scenes hard to follow, and without enough dramatic suspense.

OT: Hi, long time reader, first time poster.

PackMule · Post by **PackMule** » 2003-12-17 04:19pm

Sorry double post.

My favourite three parts of ROTK:

1. The swooping shots of the beacon lights being lit along the mountain range.

2. Gandalf and some random Gondorian guards protecting a gate, and three huge trolls (i think) burst through.

3. The return of the four Hobbits to The Shire and the look on the face of that old Hobbit from Fellowship.

El Moose Monstero · Post by **El Moose Monstero** » 2003-12-17 04:25pm

I thought the start was a little shaky, the Smeagol scene was too light and cheery for me, it didnt sit well in a film which I knew was going to dark as hell, maybe they were trying to juxtapose the horror with the scenery, but it needed more linkage with the rest of the film.

Another problem I saw was that in some places the film suffered from having so much cut, just a handful of spots where it felt rushed, as if some more dialogue was cut, which it was. Means I'm eagerly awaiting the extended edition, Elrond at times felt a little odd, and the Sauron's eye special effect looked out of place at times.

But other than that, gorgeous, I'm going to see it again on Saturday, the battles were great, the sweeping combination of the charges, the seige, the ride of the nazgul, the eagles arriving, I've been waiting three years for Gandalf to cry the eagle's are coming, and whilst it wasnt him, it still put a tear in my eye, the climb to Mount Doom engrossed me, I spent the last 2 hours of the film with my eyes fixed on the screen and my fingernail in my mouth, loved it all. Can't wait to see it again. Need Lord of the Rings stuff now!

Faram · Post by **Faram** » 2003-12-17 05:13pm

Just back It fucking ROCKS!

gona see it again this weekend.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-12-17 05:55pm

HemlockGrey wrote:Does it include Prince Imrahil,

No. No reinforcements come to Gondor except for Rohan.

and does Frodo claim the ring for himself?

Yes. In the fire.

It was all very good. I never thought of the army of the dead figuring prominently in the battle of Pellenor Fields. I understood it that they allowed Aragorn to take the ships and then left. Still, MOST groovy.

And you know, it really was only one kill. I loved how in the middle of battle both of them are calling out "Thirty-four! Thirty-five!"

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2003-12-17 06:56pm

HemlockGrey wrote:Does it include Prince Imrahil, and does Frodo claim the ring for himself?

No and yes.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-12-17 07:02pm

Stellar flick. Definitely the best third movie in a series, ever.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-12-17 07:03pm

Excellant. No Imrahil I can forgive (I only like the character because he has the coolest name, ever), but had Frodo not claimd the Ring it would have ruined the film for me.

Daltonator · Post by **Daltonator** » 2003-12-17 09:12pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:It was all very good. I never thought of the army of the dead figuring prominently in the battle of Pellenor Fields. I understood it that they allowed Aragorn to take the ships and then left. Still, MOST groovy.

In the books, the Army of the Dead were not summoned on the Path of the Dead, but on the other side of it, at the stone of Erech. They helped Aragorn rout the Corsairs at...uh...Pelargir, and after that Aragorn held their oath fulfilled and crewed the ships with the former slaves of the Corsairs, with one of Aragorn's Rangers captaining each ship and Elladan and Elrohir (with Legolas and Gimli) at his side.

That annoyed me a bit, not having Aragorn's Rangers nor Elrond's sons, but sacrifices must be made.

I also think that they should have left in the bit where the men of Gondor see the ships coming up the river. It would have added the final death of hope to their hearts...then the unfurling of the Flag of the White Tree made by Arwen. I hope they have that in the EE.

All in all, the flaws in the film did not ruin the experience for me, as PJ did an incredible job at making everything seem both hopeless and pointless, to emphasize the sheer desperation of the Fellowship and the nearly impossible journey of Sam and Frodo. But when the riders of Rohan appeared, my heart cheered...when Aragorn leapt off the ship with the Army of the dead, my heart cheered...when Samwise came to rescue Frodo from Shelob, my heart cheered...when Pippin saved Faramir from Denethor, my heart cheered...when Merry struck the blow and Eowyn slew the Witch King, my heart cheered...and when Barad-dur fell, my heart cheered.

The buildup was intense and all the payoffs even more so, making the end of the film that much more intense for me.

Daltonator · Post by **Daltonator** » 2003-12-17 09:15pm

The_Lumberjack wrote:I thought the start was a little shaky, the Smeagol scene was too light and cheery for me, it didnt sit well in a film which I knew was going to dark as hell, maybe they were trying to juxtapose the horror with the scenery, but it needed more linkage with the rest of the film.

Are you talking about the scene with Smeagol and Deagol? That was meant to present a different side to Gollum, to show that once even he was happy, until the Ring claimed him.

Too bad they didn't continue until Bilbo's appearance, though we did get a nice taste of that in the first movie.

Melkor · Post by **Melkor** » 2003-12-17 10:16pm

Its just a minor detail but I think it would have been so poignant if they had shown frodo and bilbo seeing the shores of Valinor just as Gandalf described it to Pippen. I was really hoping for that, and still hope that they will have it in the extended edition.

Seggybop · Post by **Seggybop** » 2003-12-17 11:15pm

Although I agree with everyone that it was an awesome movie, I don't think it was as flawless as many claim. Some of the editing was very annoying. Not because of cut scenes, but because of the pacing. Massive fast-paced battles and then scenes of people staring at eachother with anguished faces for minutes at a time. I wanted to scream at some points to get on with it, because it was totally obvious what was happening and they were interrupting the flow of the fights.