Favourite LOTR Army?

Companion Cube · Post by **Companion Cube** » 2003-12-21 09:26am

Your choice can be based on tactics, organisation, effectiveness, how they look, whatever. And say why you chose them.

And yes, Numenor and Gondor could be considered the same thing, but i'm talking about the Second Age army at the beginning of FOTR when I refer to Numenoreans.

El Moose Monstero · Post by **El Moose Monstero** » 2003-12-21 09:48am

The forces of Morgroth!

Balrog's, Firedrakes, Colddrakes, Orcs galore...

Minor spoilers:
But in the one's we've seen, then in terms of coolness, then the Second Age alliance or the Mordor armies with the Nazgul in divebomber mode and the Fell Beasts and the large amount of seige weaponry.

Were Gondor's seige weapons, trebuchet style, more efficient than Mordor's? I assumed that they were, but in terms of design and history, were the two designs shown equivalent or not?

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2003-12-21 01:05pm

Has to be the Rohim.
Norse on horses.

Nice contradiction there.

Demiurge · Post by **Demiurge** » 2003-12-21 01:12pm

The Numenoreans had style.

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2003-12-21 01:27pm

The Rohirrim.

"Ride to ruin, and the ending of the world!"

Shivers, man.

Companion Cube · Post by **Companion Cube** » 2003-12-21 01:53pm

The_Lumberjack wrote:
Were Gondor's seige weapons, trebuchet style, more efficient than Mordor's? I assumed that they were, but in terms of design and history, were the two designs shown equivalent or not?

I'm not sure I can really answer your question, but The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare, there's a section describing how Sauron was much more conservative technologically than Saruman, preferring to stick to weaponry that was tried and tested, hence the lack of bombs in Mordor's army.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-12-21 03:48pm

The_Lumberjack wrote:

Were Gondor's seige weapons, trebuchet style, more efficient than Mordor's? I assumed that they were, but in terms of design and history, were the two designs shown equivalent or not?

The designs did different things. The mangonel catapults used by Mordor's where generally used for smashing things against walls with a fast low trajectory, while a trebuchet is a greater reach and higher trajectory, making it far more suitable for hitting the top of a wall or flinging stuff over them. However a trebuchet is far harder to build and bring into action.

But the movie was simply full of crap when it comes to effectiveness. There's no way a trebuchet made of wood could fling stones anywhere near the size shown, and the action of one firing would shake a wall top apart, you could only mount mangonel on walls. Mordor's mangonel's where a lot closer to reality in terms of projectile size, but still excessive. In the case of both weapons the range was greatly exaggerated as well.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-12-21 04:31pm

I vote other. They weren't shown, but the dwarven armies of Erebor and the Iron Hills were kicking easterling ass at the long lake.

And I noticed the ghost army wasn't in your poll.

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2003-12-21 05:48pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:I vote other. They weren't shown, but the dwarven armies of Erebor and the Iron Hills were kicking easterling ass at the long lake.

And I noticed the ghost army wasn't in your poll.

Or, rather, losing and enduring a siege at Erebor.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-12-21 06:15pm

Hey, they won

Setzer · Post by **Setzer** » 2003-12-21 07:36pm

The Numenoreans, of course.
Men at their zenith, if the Numenoreans hadn't gotten to proud and thought they could challenge the Valar, they'd probably be kicking Sauron's ass way into the Fourth age.

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-12-21 07:43pm

Setzer wrote:The Numenoreans, of course.
Men at their zenith, if the Numenoreans hadn't gotten to proud and thought they could challenge the Valar, they'd probably be kicking Sauron's ass way into the Fourth age.

The Fourth Age only starts after and because Sauron was forever defeated..

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2003-12-22 12:37am

The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare, there's a section describing how Sauron was much more conservative technologically than Saruman, preferring to stick to weaponry that was tried and tested, hence the lack of bombs in Mordor's army.

______________________________________________________________________

Makes sense; Sauron was more sort of a just an Evil Overlord(TM); his armies were mostly orcs from the Mountains of Shadow, Trolls, and human auxiliaries.

Saruman, on the other hand, was the more radical- he had this supposed vision of the Great Order, where as Sauron just wanted to dominate the World.

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2003-12-22 02:02am

I don't know if they count as an army, but eagles kick ass.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-12-22 02:07am

Sea Skimmer wrote:
Setzer wrote:The Numenoreans, of course.
Men at their zenith, if the Numenoreans hadn't gotten to proud and thought they could challenge the Valar, they'd probably be kicking Sauron's ass way into the Fourth age.
The Fourth Age only starts after and because Sauron was forever defeated..

And the Numenorians were perfectly prepared and able to put foot to ass in that match up. If Sauron hadn't good and surrendered there would have been no need of a Fourth Age as they would have crushed Sauron.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-12-22 04:17am

I don't know why some of you guys chose the Rohirrim. They look like crap- aside from Eomer and Theoden, they're a rabble. Elves of the Second Age for me (the ones at Helm's Deep look too tarted up).

D.Turtle · Post by **D.Turtle** » 2003-12-22 05:26am

Numenoreans.

Any army that can cause Sauron to surrender immediately is impressive enough for me

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-12-22 06:16am

Crazedwraith wrote:Has to be the Rohim.
Norse on horses. Nice contradiction there.

I don't think the Rohirrim were based upon Vikings - rather, they are probably supposed to resemble Dark Ages germanic tribes such as the Visigoths and Ostrogoths, who did use cavalry.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2003-12-22 09:35am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
Crazedwraith wrote:Has to be the Rohim.
Norse on horses. Nice contradiction there.
I don't think the Rohirrim were based upon Vikings - rather, they are probably supposed to resemble Dark Ages germanic tribes such as the Visigoths and Ostrogoths, who did use cavalry.

That was PJ's connection - he's the one who thought so, and pushed for it.

I can't recall much about the Rohirrim in the books, except they're located in a central location within Middle-earth, and use horse predominantly in war. Another comparison you could make is Hungarian/Magyar warriors, who if I recall correctly fought predominantly on horseback. Of course, I'm slightly biased in that regard.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2003-12-22 02:06pm

The Rohirrim rode to their current home from the wilds of the North, and their language is a Welsh derrivation. They aren't supposed to be direct analogues of Tolkien's creation, just groovy people.

Post by **Kuja** » 2003-12-22 02:38pm

"The time for Man has ended. Now is the time for Orcs."

So says the badass Orc general just after shoving a spear right through Faramir's right-hand man.

Post by **LadyTevar** » 2003-12-22 02:44pm

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
Crazedwraith wrote:Has to be the Rohim.
Norse on horses. Nice contradiction there.
I don't think the Rohirrim were based upon Vikings - rather, they are probably supposed to resemble Dark Ages germanic tribes such as the Visigoths and Ostrogoths, who did use cavalry.

Actually... the Rohirrim were Celtic and Norse-deriviatives. Look to their standard, the White Horse on Green field. Now, ladies and gentlemen, especially those living in England... where in the world can you find a large white horse on a green field?

But the Horse-Lords are fantastic, and I think they're the best army.

Their horses weren't just something to ride, they were trained to fight as well!

Setzer · Post by **Setzer** » 2003-12-22 04:17pm

D.Turtle wrote:Numenoreans.

Any army that can cause Sauron to surrender immediately is impressive enough for me

Especially when you consider that most Orcs are more scared of their leaders then any army.

A force that would make them surrender is nigh unbelieveable.

Companion Cube · Post by **Companion Cube** » 2003-12-22 05:08pm

Kuja wrote:"The time for Man has ended. Now is the time for Orcs."

So says the badass Orc general just after shoving a spear right through Faramir's right-hand man.

Yeah, gotta love Gothmog.

Personally, (and this is my first reply strictly on-topic) I like the army of Gondor, even if they did have Denethor in charge at first. The Citadel and Fountain Guard in particular look bad-ass.

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2003-12-22 05:27pm

anarchistbunny wrote:I don't know if they count as an army, but eagles kick ass.

I don't remember the Eagles being in the Lord of the Rings. But they did kick ass.

Anyway, I vote for Numenor. Men worthy of an alliance with Elves are always cool.

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