The Empire vs. The Third Reich

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

the German Lufwaffe could cover the artillery. Tie Fighters are not designed for atmospheric use. the high manuverablity of the German aircraft would keep those tie's busy.

Ties are still manueverable. And capable of at least 1000 kph.

Tie's are fragil and prologed fire on them and they'd cave.

So are german fighters.

200 lb bombs droped on At-aat's would make a mess too. as would white phosforous incediary bombs

Normal tie laser blasts would murder Ground vehicles. We're talking like hundred ton-1 kiloton weapons.

[Isolder74]

so it would be a slaughter as far as vehicles are concerned, but the infanrty could still do some damage. the Imperial numbers would eventual overwell the Germans. this fight would leave a big body count on both sides.

here's a new topic Empire VS the Empire of Japan

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

so it would be a slaughter as far as vehicles are concerned, but the infanrty could still do some damage. the Imperial numbers would eventual overwell the Germans. this fight would leave a big body count on both sides.

here's a new topic Empire VS the Empire of Japan

Murder. Japan relies on Naval and airpower. Even Tie Bombers go way faster then any of their fighters. The Naval ships would lose to kiloton level gunship lasers.

[Howedar]

under Light Machine guns i include the 38 cal "machine Pistol"

Low velocity weapon. Kevlar would protect a person adequately, let alone Stormtrooper armor

and the German infantry standard weapon was a 45 cal Rifle.

Bullshit. They used 7.92mm rounds. Stormtrooper armor would have a decent chance of protecting a person.

also the larger german tank Tiger Tanks had a 65 mm high velocity gun.

Actually, they usually mounted 88mm guns, which still would be worthless against AT-ATs (an M1 could be shot at with them all day and it wouldn't matter worth a damn).

Technology can be a hinderence too i could put a 12 in artillery enplacement behind a mountain would wreack havoke on a AT-AT devision with it's only line of site weapons

A land battleship, eh? Well, that will only take weeks to set up, and will not necessarily be at all accurate. Oh well!

[Tycho]

under Light Machine guns i include the 38 cal "machine Pistol" and the German infantry standard weapon was a 45 cal Rifle. this weapon would be able to pierce ST Armor. also the larger german tank Tiger Tanks had a 65 mm high velocity gun. Technology can be a hinderence too i could put a 12 in artillery enplacement behind a mountain would wreack havoke on a AT-AT devision with it's only line of site weapons

Prove it.

I see NO calculations for this supposition, automatically making this an assumption, which doesn't hold vacuum in a debate.

Get some hard facts. The onus of evidence is on YOU.

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

What kind of question is that? Imperial forces would destroy their bases, slag their cities, and crush their Jew-hating . However, such an attack would destroy the Allied forces as well.

Anyway, the only thing troops and Stormtroopers have in common are that they both have guns that look alike. (I heard that the blasters used in SW are 20th century guns with stuff added to them, and fring spent shells.)

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

What kind of question is that? Imperial forces would destroy their bases, slag their cities, and crush their Jew-hating . However, such an attack would destroy the Allied forces as well.

Anyway, the only thing troops and Stormtroopers have in common are that they both have guns that look alike. (I heard that the blasters used in SW are 20th century guns with stuff added to them, and fring spent shells.)

Yep. All SW guns are RL guns modified to look futuristic. They fired blank shells. Most rifles seen were actually Machine Guns.

[BrianDavion]

whomever said the german fighters had more manuverability I have one question.. so?

a Biplane is more manuverable then a monoplane, a triplane even more manuverable still.. why are all our fighters monoplanes... say it with me here folks.. SPEED.

in modren air combat speed is more important then manuverability. air combat especially these days is a lot less dog fighting then one might think. the bulk of the aces at least didn't dog fight. they swooped out of the sun or something making an attack and climibing away. repaeat as nesscary. the best pilots perfered a fighter that was good in a dive, fast and had a good climb rate over something insanely manuverable.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Missles would also tip the balance. More.

[Isolder74]

Missles would also tip the balance. More.

BUT THEY ARE NOT INFALLABLBE. The Pentagon once designed a fighter (the F-4) with no guns. the kill numbers for the American Air Force when down considerably. the Veitnamess pilots quickly learned to fly low and the American pilots could not get missile locks on them. It took a PILOT to make the Pentagon see the design was flawed

[User099]

Jeez man, sometimes I think a good old 20th century gun is actually BETTER than a blaster, if not equal. I mean, Laea got shot in the arm with a blaster and nothing much really happened, her arm wasnt disintigrated and only a small burn-mark appeared, as much if not less damage then being shot by a bullet.
But of COURSE the Empire would win, billions of troops vs 30 million. I thougth we were talking about only the Empire force on Endor vs a German Division replacing the Ewoks. There werent any TIE fighter involved there, only soldiers, 4 AT-STs and an AT-AT plus speederbikes and snot.

[Cpt_Frank]

Blasters are superior.
When was the last time you saw a submachine gun blowing huge chunks out of a metal wall? (Tantive)
When was the last time you saw a handgun blowing huge chunks out of a metal wall? (Millenium Falcon dock on Tatooine)
Empire=winner even without superior numbers

[Soulman]

Blasters are superior.
When was the last time you saw a submachine gun blowing huge chunks out of a metal wall? (Tantive)
When was the last time you saw a handgun blowing huge chunks out of a metal wall? (Millenium Falcon dock on Tatooine)
Empire=winner even without superior numbers

They may be more powerful but good old rifles are far better for snipers and in ambushes. A blaster does a helluva good job of giving you position away. Add to that the slow velocity of the bolts they would make piss-poor weapons for long-range work against small or fast targets.

[Cpt_Frank]

You can bet the Empire has appropriate Sniper rifles at hand.
Possibly ones which won't give your position away.
Oh, and Blaster bolts aren't that slow, and they worked well over long range at the battle of hoth, not only against walkers, but also against infantry.

[Eleas]

"You can bet the Empire has appropriate Sniper rifles at hand.
Possibly ones which won't give your position away."

They are called Xerrol Nightstingers, and are seen in the Hand of Thrawn duology. They fire invisible bolts.

[Darth Yoshi]

The only problem with Nightstingers is that they are ridiculously expensive ammo wise.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Laser rifles are faster.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Jeez man, sometimes I think a good old 20th century gun is actually BETTER than a blaster, if not equal. I mean, Laea got shot in the arm with a blaster and nothing much really happened, her arm wasnt disintigrated and only a small burn-mark appeared, as much if not less damage then being shot by a bullet.

You ignore of course all the points where blasters blew large chunks out of walls. Can you say POWER LEVELS?

[Eleas]

"The only problem with Nightstingers is that they are ridiculously expensive ammo wise."

Uh, yeah, but they still exist.

[Darth Yoshi]

That is true. I was merely pointing out that's it's not a very practical weapon because of the ammo costs, but it's still useful, which is why it exists.

[Master of Ossus]

The Empire does have sniper rifles, and one of them was designed so as not to reveal one's location (the Nightstinger). It was used by Noghri assassins. In any case, "slugthrowers" are used by some people in the SW universe, just not very often. Blasters obviously have significant advantages even for simple hunting purposes. Also, stormtrooper armor is HIGHLY resistant to physical weapons, like bullets and knives (ref. Lightsabers), and is also resistant to chemical weapons. I'm not sure that the Nazis would have a chance, despite their cool equipment and uniforms.

[Crayz9000]

In any case, "slugthrowers" are used by some people in the SW universe, just not very often.

For a good example, see Zam Wessel's sniper rifle in AotC. According to the ICS, it was a railgun of sorts, but still a slugthrower nonetheless.

Anyway, this thread is OT for this forum and ought to be in Other Sci-Fi.

[IRG CommandoJoe]

While the Stormtroopers are not invincible, they still are most likely resistant to many things that soldiers of the WWII time period weren't. For one thing, flamethrowers. Their armor suits could probably withstand the heat of German flamethrowers, making these weapons useless. The armor itself most likely is able to withstand high-velocity projectiles, but then again there are the exposed parts of the body glove in which German soldiers would aim for. But every other aspect is in the favor of the Empire. In fact, Stormtroopers might be able to power up their blasters to destroy Panzer armor. But it is definitely true that TIEs would destroy the Luftwaffe. I don't understand where one would get the idea that TIEs were not meant for atmospheric flight when you clearly see them flying around Cloud City with the same maneuverability they had in space. They have the ability to go into and out of space at will. Hell, they could just travel above the maximum altitude of the Luftwaffe and still be safe from them. After destroying the Luftwaffe, they would devastate German armor. They would just burn holes right through the tanks and artillery pieces. Same thing goes for both AT-STs and AT-ATs, also with the ability to simply step on them or in some cases, outrun them. Actually, I don't see why they would even consider outrunning them when they could just blast the goose-stepping bastards to a crisp. lol Unless they could hijack some of the walkers and then magically figure out the controls that would be completely foreign to them, they wouldn't be able to win. The only reason why the Ewoks won was because Chewie was there to pilot that AT-ST.

[Isolder74]

While the Stormtroopers are not invincible, they still are most likely resistant to many things that soldiers of the WWII time period weren't. For one thing, flamethrowers. Their armor suits could probably withstand the heat of German flamethrowers, making these weapons useless. The armor itself most likely is able to withstand high-velocity projectiles, but then again there are the exposed parts of the body glove in which German soldiers would aim for. But every other aspect is in the favor of the Empire. In fact, Stormtroopers might be able to power up their blasters to destroy Panzer armor. But it is definitely true that TIEs would destroy the Luftwaffe. I don't understand where one would get the idea that TIEs were not meant for atmospheric flight when you clearly see them flying around Cloud City with the same maneuverability they had in space. They have the ability to go into and out of space at will. Hell, they could just travel above the maximum altitude of the Luftwaffe and still be safe from them. After destroying the Luftwaffe, they would devastate German armor. They would just burn holes right through the tanks and artillery pieces. Same thing goes for both AT-STs and AT-ATs, also with the ability to simply step on them or in some cases, outrun them. Actually, I don't see why they would even consider outrunning them when they could just blast the goose-stepping bastards to a crisp. lol Unless they could hijack some of the walkers and then magically figure out the controls that would be completely foreign to them, they wouldn't be able to win. The only reason why the Ewoks won was because Chewie was there to pilot that AT-ST.

a FLAME THROWER would cook a stormtrooper no matter what he is wearing. it is weapon that fires a extreemly hot flame. can we say Fried Stormtrooper

[Master of Ossus]

a FLAME THROWER would cook a stormtrooper no matter what he is wearing. it is weapon that fires a extreemly hot flame. can we say Fried Stormtrooper

This is simply not true. The flame would have to be either hot enough to melt the liner underneath the plasteel liner for this to work, and while the precise thermoresistance of stormtroopers is not known, we DO know that they can function easily in extremely hot environments (at least in temperatures that can melt cheap plastics). Also, there are official sources that say that stormtroopers are virtually impervious to such tactics (ref. Tales of the Bounty Hunters). Finally, the stormtrooper would not be fried if cooked over an open flame. He would be roasted.