How would Ali fair in Modern times?

Butterbean569 · Post by **Butterbean569** » 2004-01-04 12:54am

I just got done watching the "Thrilla in Manilla" fight on ESPN2 and I got to thinking...how would Ali fair in "modern times" because of the recent events with the Islam religion? After his fight he kept saying "Praise Muhammed" and all that type of stuff...do you think that, if he was doing that today, he would cause a lot of problems and generally piss off America? Do you think that the prejudice against Muslims would spill over into the sporting world? Just wondering what you guys think...

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-01-04 01:37am

It wouldn't be a problem. Despite the absurd antics of the Falwells of this world, mainstream Christians have been falling all over themselves to say they have no problem with Muslims ever since 9/11.

Besides, he's black, not arab. Most of the prejudice is directed against arabs. I really can't see it making much of a difference. Athletes and musicians "praise Jesus" all the fucking time when they win things; it would not be a big scandal if Ali praised Mohammed.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2004-01-04 01:51am

Besides, he was prasing him long before 9/11.

Butterbean569 · Post by **Butterbean569** » 2004-01-04 02:04am

Very true...because of "political correctness" many people try to show that they are tolerent.

As an add-on...what if he converted AFTER 9/11? Let's say that he was the heavyweight champ at the time of 9/11, but was known as Cassius Clay (spelling?)...then he converts. Even though people try to show tolerence these days I think that would push it to the breaking point.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2004-01-04 04:56am

Oh, they mean how he'd fare politically. Too bad. When I saw the thread title, I was ready to write a diatribe about how badly he'd kick the shit out of Lennox Lewis.

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2004-01-04 06:08am

GrandAdmiralPrawn wrote:Oh, they mean how he'd fare politically. Too bad. When I saw the thread title, I was ready to write a diatribe about how badly he'd kick the shit out of Lennox Lewis.

I was thinking along those lines as well.

Just look at how 40+ George Foreman did against the recent heavy weights. Imagine how Ali, Foreman or Fraiser would have done now if
they were in their physical prime.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2004-01-04 09:28am

Even some second-tier fighters of that era, like Ken Norton and Earnie Shavers, would dominate among today's crowd.

The Aliens · Post by **The Aliens** » 2004-01-04 06:37pm

If Christians can thank God for winning awards or being elected President, Ali can praise Muhommad for betaing the living ass out of someone.

Butterbean569 · Post by **Butterbean569** » 2004-01-04 06:41pm

Oh I agree totally...with both of ya

I don't mind Muslims praising their religion...and I think Ali would kick the crap outta all the modern heavyweights hehe

Perinquus · Post by **Perinquus** » 2004-01-04 07:31pm

Butterbean569 wrote:Oh I agree totally...with both of ya I don't mind Muslims praising their religion...and I think Ali would kick the crap outta all the modern heavyweights hehe

Any of the really great fighters of previous decades would dominate today, even though they were a bit smaller on average than today's heavyweights (Rocky Marciano wouldn't even be a heavyweight today; he'd be a cruiserweight). The reason is that today's fighters just don't get the ring experience the older fighters got. Today, a champ who defends his title twice a year is seen as an active heavyweight champ. In the old days, they fought a lot more often. The result is that by the time today's fighters have learned as much as earlier fighters did, and have acquired as much ring experience, they're past their physical primes. This just wasn't true of fighters like Ali, Marciano, Louis, or Dempsey.

Peter Diamond · Post by **Peter Diamond** » 2004-01-04 09:32pm

Perinquus wrote:The reason is that today's fighters just don't get the ring experience the older fighters got. Today, a champ who defends his title twice a year is seen as an active heavyweight champ. In the old days, they fought a lot more often. The result is that by the time today's fighters have learned as much as earlier fighters did, and have acquired as much ring experience, they're past their physical primes. This just wasn't true of fighters like Ali, Marciano, Louis, or Dempsey.

Hmmm, I don't agree. Todays boxers, from light heavy down, show skills which are comparable to previous eras. So what's happened to the heavy weights? Why are they now so shoddy? Well, boxing used to be the marque sport in the US a few decades ago. Black athletes used to see boxing as the best chance to become a superstar, and make buckets of money. But today boxing is not the only option for blacks, and isn't the richest or glamorous anymore. Todays bigger athletes can make much more money in NFL then boxing, so that's where the better bigger athletes go.

Perinquus · Post by **Perinquus** » 2004-01-04 09:55pm

Peter Diamond wrote:
Perinquus wrote:The reason is that today's fighters just don't get the ring experience the older fighters got. Today, a champ who defends his title twice a year is seen as an active heavyweight champ. In the old days, they fought a lot more often. The result is that by the time today's fighters have learned as much as earlier fighters did, and have acquired as much ring experience, they're past their physical primes. This just wasn't true of fighters like Ali, Marciano, Louis, or Dempsey.
Hmmm, I don't agree. Todays boxers, from light heavy down, show skills which are comparable to previous eras. So what's happened to the heavy weights? Why are they now so shoddy? Well, boxing used to be the marque sport in the US a few decades ago. Black athletes used to see boxing as the best chance to become a superstar, and make buckets of money. But today boxing is not the only option for blacks, and isn't the richest or glamorous anymore. Todays bigger athletes can make much more money in NFL then boxing, so that's where the better bigger athletes go.

Sorry, but it's a fact that today's heavyweights don't fight nearly as often as heavyweights of previous eras. That means they just don't get the experience. What you say here may also be a factor, but constant training for fights, and more frequent fights does have the effect of sharpening the skills faster, and these days, heavyweights just aren't training and fighting as much as they used to.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2004-01-05 08:25pm

There are strong and weak eras in any division. If you were to send a prime Holyfield back to the weak period that came after Dempsey but before Joe Louis, he'd clean house. By the same token, a great fighter like Louis would crush everyone around today.

By and large though, I think fighters have gotten better. Who of the Joe Louis era, besides Joe Louis, would you pick to win over Vitali Klitchko? Taking a handful of glorious names who dominated their own times and would today doesn't tell the whole story. The only reason I think even second-tier fighters of the 70's would kick ass today is because the 70's were the all-time strongest era of the division.