Hey GAT

[Ender]

Can I get those numbers based on the Empire only having a few ships? You know, the ones for countering trekkie idiots who claim the Empire only has a few dozen - hundred ships, where ISDS have Yottaton cannons?

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Can I get those numbers based on the Empire only having a few ships? You know, the ones for countering trekkie idiots who claim the Empire only has a few dozen - hundred ships, where ISDS have Yottaton cannons?

Sure.

According to the Solo quote the Empire has less then 1000 ships, say 600 ships. And since it takes half the fleet to destroy a planet, it takes 300 ships while in star trek it takes 30. Well lets play with these numbers.




According to MW, the DS blast is 1E38 or 23900.57361 yottatons. Now divide that by 300 ships and you get 79 yottatons. So a single imperial warship can fire 79 yt firing each gun once.


Now according to Graham Kennedy, the high end calcs for torpedoes are 20,000,000,000 mt or 20 petatons. a GCS can fire ten at once, or 200 petatons.



according to these calcs, it would take over 3 billion GCS to annoy a single imp warship. Assuming a borg cube is equal to 1000 GCSs, it would still take 3 million to annoy a ISD.


Edited as it was adressed to someone.

[Ender]

thanks

[Ha Lire]

79 YT? Dear god. If these were true, Ha Lire has no doubt that the Empire's enemies would be absolutely assfucked. =P However, he also knows that these weapons are ludicrously overpowered and fairly unlikely. =D

[Master of Ossus]

79 YT? Dear god. If these were true, Ha Lire has no doubt that the Empire's enemies would be absolutely assfucked. =P However, he also knows that these weapons are ludicrously overpowered and fairly unlikely. =D

I hardly think that we can dismiss much as being fairly unlikely based on the magnitude of firepower in the SW universe. The DS blast would, quite obviously, fall into the category of "fairly unlikely," but we know that it happened in SW. Similarly, I'm pretty sure we can take many other weapons to be like that from the evidence presented in SW, though I don't agree with a nearly 100 YT weapon statistic based only on the evidence provided.

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

It's really sweet giving Trekkies a taste of their own medicine. If they distort facts to make SW look weak, use it agianst them.

One more things I've noticed: If ISD run on lighbulb power, isn't that good considering that something that can reduche the surface of a planet into molten slag using the power of a stadium light must be a of efficency. That kid thinks that ST ships are "better" because they waste more power idling in a few seconds than a major city uses in years.

[Master of Ossus]

It's really sweet giving Trekkies a taste of their own medicine. If they distort facts to make SW look weak, use it agianst them.

One more things I've noticed: If ISD run on lighbulb power, isn't that good considering that something that can reduche the surface of a planet into molten slag using the power of a stadium light must be a of efficency. That kid thinks that ST ships are "better" because they waste more power idling in a few seconds than a major city uses in years.

It is impossible to do that kind of damage with that little power.

[Evil Jerk]

If those calcs are based on the superlaser, would those same Trekkie morons also claim that the DS used the grand mega sneaky because-we-can't-stand-the-truth trick to destroy planets, instead of raw power?

[consequences]

that's okay, we can argue that Genesis just transposed a planet from an alternate reality to take the place of the nebula with just as much justification, and has no destructive properties whatsoever

[Guest]

the Genesis device used Proto-matter which is described as being very risky. In the Ashes of Eden Admiral Drake planned to use Protomatter in new torpedoes to make a very effective weapon. maybe even dangerouis enough to damage a ISD?

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

the Genesis device used Proto-matter which is described as being very risky. In the Ashes of Eden Admiral Drake planned to use Protomatter in new torpedoes to make a very effective weapon. maybe even dangerouis enough to damage a ISD?

Ashes of Eden-UNCANON!

[Spanky The Dolphin]

the Genesis device used Proto-matter which is described as being very risky. In the Ashes of Eden Admiral Drake planned to use Protomatter in new torpedoes to make a very effective weapon. maybe even dangerouis enough to damage a ISD?

DO NOT USE NON-CANON IN ANY DEBATE

[Ender]

Here's something I created based soely on literal canon interpretations to battle another trekkie (the one going on about neutronium in my sig). It's about as useful as GAT's, so don't bother analyzing it, simply enjoy.

Alright, canon only eh? Let's have some fun. Let me preface this by saying that these numbers are not to be taken seriously for any debate. They rank right up there with the GT level starfuries from B%.

Lets start with Hyperspace speed. In AOTC we see that the Galactic Republic is not only one galaxy, it is actually 3. This means that it is far larger then the Milky Way Galaxy. However, to be conservitive, let us say they are the same size. Luke describes Tatooine as being the furthest thing from the bright center of the galaxy. Let's work with that number. The Milky Way galaxy is 100,000 LYs across. This would put Tatooine and Coruscant about 50,000 LYs apart. In TPM we saw that there is at least a 12 hour difference between Darth Maul's section of Coruscant and Mos Espa. Presumably is is less, but let's go low end here. It It was early in the day there when Maul left for Tatooine, and he arrives at dusk. Let's go with 12 hours travel time here as a result. This means he traveled at 36.5 million C.

Going by the asteroids vaporized in the Geonosis scene, the laser canons on Slave 1 are about a kiloton. Slave 1 is an outdated transport using black market tech, so 1 kt for eack of the lasers on Ties is low end. As for turbolasers, assuming Silicon Dioxide and a low end scaling of 40 meters, the vaporization of the Asteroid in ESB would have been 300 MT. Now applying the intensity scaling from ROTJ and you get the MTLs being 4x stronger and the HTLs being 125x stronger. This gives us a strength of 300 MT for the LTLs, 1.2 GT for the MTls, and 37.5 GT for the HTLs. Not near the ICS numbers, but then this is low-end and they are high-end.

Now then, as for shielding, accounting for the time cuts indicated in the novelization and the radioplay, the Exacutor was getting wailed on for 5 minutes by the entire rebel fleet, including about a dozen cruisers. Saxton's study of the Mon Cal cruisers gives them about 29 HTLs per broadside (note that this is far more then the armermant given in the EU). In addition, based off the Refire rate shown by the TFB and the Death Star's LTLs, let su say they fire once every 2 seconds. 29 * 37.5 * 12 * 150 = 1957500 GT for the Ray shields. Since dialogue in the movie indicates the presence of 6 shields (dorsal, ventral, port starbord, hanger, bridge) multiply that my 6 to get total ray shields, and by 2 to get total shielding (ray and particle). Thus the total shielding for the Executor is 23,490,000 GT, or about 23.5 PT. Since the ESB novel says that the ISDs are 1/5th as powerful as the SSD, this means they have shielding of 4,698,000 GT, or 4.7 PT.

Now lets examine Fleet size. Tarkin said the Empire had a million worlds. We see in ANH that Tatooine had 2 Star Destroyers in orbit above it, while the 3rd, the Devestator had been called in (Note that the novelization said there were five, meaning 4 stationed there and one called in). This means the Imperial Fleet consists of at least 2 Million Imperial Star Destroyers. Note that Tatooine is a worthless dustball, yet it still rates 2 Star Destroyers stationed there, so this is a low end number. It only makes sense that Coruscant or other key worlds would have larger fleets stationed there, increasing the number. Now according to the ROTJ Novel, the fleet at Endor was just the standard sector fleet. Given that Han did not question the presence of the Executor, it appears that SSDs are a standard part of sector fleets, even sectors as insignifigant and backwater as Endor. Since we know from the count of senatorial seats in TPM that there are 1024 sectors, this thanslates into at least 1025 SSDs (all the sectors, plus Vader's ship). In addition, you still have all the left over Acclamator class ships making up your fleet from the Clone wars.

Now lets compare this to Star Trek. The Dominion forces numbered at 30,000. Given that they were a threat to the Aplha quadrent, the FKR alliance did not have this many ships. However, by the last battle they were able to send out a fleet of 20,000 ships. Ths establishes high end and low end limits for the fleet size of the FKR, so let s go for middle ground and say their fleet is 25,000 ships. Now then, the most powerful ship of the line for the FKR is the Soverign class. High end calcs by SCVN put the output of type 12 phasers at 40 MT (he assumed vaporization of tyep 10s and ignored the NDF, then adsusted for the change in power and what we see when the type 12s are fired. If you plug in NDF the number drops drastically, but lets leave it as is for high end). He also arrived at Photon Torpedoes being at 50 MT (or 74% efficieny of the TM numbers, which is about what you get with modern nukes) and 150 MT for Quantum torpedoes. THe Neutral Zone Ship database gave the torpedo load of 250 PT and 250 QT for the Sovie. This means that if the ship fires 10 full power shots from all it's phasers and fires off it's entire torp load, it has a total outpust of 54,800 MT or 54.8 GT.

Using these numbers, It would take 428,650 Soverigns to kill a single Executor class. It would take 85,730 Soverigns to kill a single ISD. This is more then the FKR and Dominion combined. Death Squadron consistd of 6 ISDs and the Executor. The total combined shielding for these ships is 51,678,000,000 MT. This means it would take 943,030 Soverign class ships to kill Death Squadron alone, much less the Imperial Fleet.

Note that this is just using canon, just like you asked Slobba.
Using the EU, Hyperdrive was 20 million C. Now it is 36.5 million C. Using EU, the shielding for an ISD is 160 TT. Now it is 4.7 PT. Using EU, the shielding for the Executor was 800 TT. Now it is 23.5 PT. The ISD count used to only be 25,000. Now it is 2 million. The SSD count used to only be 16 confirmed, 20 speculated. Now it is 1025. And note that I can make these numbers all go up simply by deciding to use a 100 meter asteroid in the ESB field. The scaling would still work out and I could get GT range for LTLs.

So Slobba, in your pathetic despiration and grasping at straws, you called down the thunder. Well here it is bitch. You tried to put artificial limits on the debate in hopes of winning and now it is biting you in the ass. If I toss the EU out the airlock, I actually make Wars stronger.
Now be a good little bitch and shut your fucking mouth.