Which religion is the MOST harmful?

[MattTheSkywalker]

Mr Bean,

Anyway the simple point its, It does not matter if "David" was a pot scrobber and did none of the things they say he did, The fact that they SAY he did them and APROVE of what he did is one of the greatest Evils in the Bible, Preformed and helped by their God.

I'll agree. Christians embrace these stories and perpetuate them as true. This is not what you said above, though. Your initial post was

when the Jews had power, they abused it as much as possible, they KILLED AND ENSLAVED thier neighbors when they got back to the promised land

I am trying to make the point that this in untrue, and that (to Pablo's point several posts ago) monotheistic religions cannot all be grouped together as equally harmful throughout history.

perhaps we were talking past each other.

[Mr Bean]

I am trying to make the point that this in untrue, and that (to Pablo's point several posts ago) monotheistic religions cannot all be grouped together as equally harmful throughout history.

Call it then what they would have done had they been in power it the time, The point is, thier plans inculded Enslavment and Genocided
If they acutal got to do that is up for Achocial Debate HOWEVER one of the Citys listed as being Burned to the ground and its citizins murdered, so many died they say *The Streets ran with blood is acutal a true happening, they discovred the town and found that a roughly 1/2 inch layer of sedmate was stained red, when tested it was discovred to contain exatly what the bible said it did, Blood

If they did as much as they say they did agian is up for debate, the Fact they say they did is not, and the implcations for it are pretty clear


Also Forgot to add last point, What would you call a Country Founded for a Race of People who worship the same religion(Generaly speaking) in that Religions Holy Land?

Isreal has secular reasons for the fight yes but the Confilct is rooted in Religious reasons

Or would you kindly explain any reason one would want to live in a place best described as Hell-Hole 2/3 of the Year surrounded by people who want you dead BUT as a Religious Motivation?

[MattTheSkywalker]

Isreal has secular reasons for the fight yes but the Confilct is rooted in Religious reasons

Or would you kindly explain any reason one would want to live in a place best described as Hell-Hole 2/3 of the Year surrounded by people who want you dead BUT as a Religious Motivation?

The reasons for jews wanting to be there are religious. The Palestinian conflcit is purely secular.

Palestine was a name given to the area by the Romans to add insult to the conquest of the Jews. They also changed the name of jerusalem to Aelia Capitolina but that didn't stick.

The occupied lands are so occupied because of a second invasion of Israel in 1967 (the first of course being 1948). When these people tried to establish something in Jordan, they were massacred by King Hussein of Jordan. The same happened in Syria under Assad.

The current conflict is a secular one.

[Iceberg]

I'd nominate belief systems that actively encourage and promulgate rampant stupidity and assholism (i.e. Scientology, Jehovah's Witnesses, fundies of any religion, Christian Scientists).

I occasionally deeply wish for any or all of these groups to be dumped in one of the square states (Wyoming will do nicely), each person be given a gun with plenty of ammo, and let them all fight it out until the last man is standing. Then we can take the winner, put him on a pedestal, and shoot him in the fucking head[/carlin].

[Mr Bean]

The Palestinian conflcit is purely secular

EXCEPT the state of Isreal EXISTS ONLY because of the UN granting land already owned by the Locals inculding Jersiulium the Second and First Holiest Sites in three Religious plus a few hundred square miles of assundry things to the JEWISH people(And when the first clause of your religion is you must be a Jew how can you NOT call that a Religious matter)

The reason anyone ELSE carred about Isreal is because of its location, if they had taken Jordan off the map and kicked everyone out and moved the Jews in, right so the Jordanians and maybe a neighbor or two would be angrey but Not, SA, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Egypt, Pakistan and the rest...

You take land holy to three very interrelated religions all of which promte violence, two of which promote conquest over others to the smallest and weakest of the three and you honsetly think you can have a nice normal state?



Escpilly with Islam, In Islam, there is no such thing as the Secular, Religion is a part of everything from how one prepares one's food to how the state should act, all is layed out in the Koran

[Next of Kin]

Isreal has secular reasons for the fight yes but the Confilct is rooted in Religious reasons

Or would you kindly explain any reason one would want to live in a place best described as Hell-Hole 2/3 of the Year surrounded by people who want you dead BUT as a Religious Motivation?

The reasons for jews wanting to be there are religious. The Palestinian conflcit is purely secular.

Palestine was a name given to the area by the Romans to add insult to the conquest of the Jews. They also changed the name of jerusalem to Aelia Capitolina but that didn't stick.

The occupied lands are so occupied because of a second invasion of Israel in 1967 (the first of course being 1948). When these people tried to establish something in Jordan, they were massacred by King Hussein of Jordan. The same happened in Syria under Assad.

The current conflict is a secular one.

Well thank you for the Israel history lesson. So you can read and copy from a book, big shit! You seem to forget the ideology of zionism. If the problems in Israel are purely secular then why didn't the Israelis accept a chunk of Africa as their homeland?

[AdmiralKanos]

Well thank you for the Israel history lesson. So you can read and copy from a book, big shit! You seem to forget the ideology of zionism. If the problems in Israel are purely secular then why didn't the Israelis accept a chunk of Africa as their homeland?

Or Germany. It always makes me laugh how Israel's apologists pretend that the formation of Israel was some kind of reparations for the Nazi Holocaust; what sense does it make to punish Palestinians for what the Germans did?

There is one and only one reason to situate Israel where it is, and that is pure religion. The ongoing dispute over Jerusalem is proof positive of that.

[lgot]

There is the religious justification (hence there was a huge movimentation of jews to that area prior to the WW ) but you know they selected various place to give to Israel, where they would just come and live and do not care for what the host country would care. They even selected a piece of land in the middle of Brazil for it...^^
Bad international politics and feeling guilty let that happen and let Israel keep doing what they do.

[Newtonian Fury]

Any religion with a holy book is bound to degenerate into violence and other kinds of danger. Afterall, evil people will try to pervert the intentions and interpret the text in their favor.

[Setzer]

Christianity

It takes the Hate of Judisim, Refeins it and leaves enough loose ends unlike Islam so that anything can be justifed through the Bible
The Koran at least containts a DEFINATE set of Rules and Regs for the Muslims to live by

Meanwhile the Bible leaves everything up in the air, like I said so that anythign can be justfied and specifcly provides that
Jews
Witchs
Homosexuals
Adulters
Rapests and thier Victums
All manor of Crimals
Belivers of other faiths
Are to be killed Via Burning/Stoning/Free-style

Also the Bible provides that taking Slaves is Ok

And beating slaves to Death is OK to as long as they don't die the same day of the Beating

What other religion says not only is it ok to kill anyone who is not a memeber but you can ALSO take them as Slaves if you want?

Slavery wasn't a racial issue in Jesus time.Some people sold themslves into slavery to get out of debt. The Book of Leviticus states that slaves were to be released every 7 years.

[Setzer]

Fundy Muslims and Fundy christians.

Both have their moderates that are ok people. But between them they've produced some of the worst relgiously inspired atrocities.

Extremism in any religion is bad. The important factor is balance.

[Mr Bean]

The Book of Leviticus states that slaves were to be released every 7 years.

Yes and also According to Leviticus if you beat you Slaves to Death you had to pay a fine

Seven Years and the guy can kill me whenever he wants? Ok Sliight better than perment forever slavery but thats still pretty bad

[C.S.Strowbridge]

Well thank you for the Israel history lesson. So you can read and copy from a book, big shit! You seem to forget the ideology of zionism. If the problems in Israel are purely secular then why didn't the Israelis accept a chunk of Africa as their homeland?

Or Germany. It always makes me laugh how Israel's apologists pretend that the formation of Israel was some kind of reparations for the Nazi Holocaust; what sense does it make to punish Palestinians for what the Germans did?

Couple of points:

1.) The 'Palestinians' killed Jews too. In 1920, 1921, 1929, 1936-39 hundreds of Jews were killed in riots. So they were hardly completely innocent.
2.) The Arabs were allies of the Nazis, while thousands of Jews fought and died fighting the Nazis. To the victor goes the spoils.
3.) It wasn't Arabic territory at the time, it was British. And if they wanted to devided the land between the Arabs and the Jews it's their right.
4.) A Jewish homeland wasn't established as some kind of reparations for the Nazi Holocaust, cause it was established in 1917 under the Balfour Declaration. British territory in the Middle East was to be turned into a Jewish Homeland. In 1922 the land was divided amoungst Jews and Arabs under the Hashemite solution, 77% of the land going to the Arabs. It was then divided again in 1948 with an additional 10 percetage points going to the Arabs. So of the orginal 120,000 square kilometers only 15,000 sqkmwere to be Israeli territory. The Arabs rejected this and attacked and lost 10,000 sqkm in the following war.

There is one and only one reason to situate Israel where it is, and that is pure religion. The ongoing dispute over Jerusalem is proof positive of that.

While religion is the greatest reason, culture and history also plays a part. Think of it this way, if Newfoundlanders decided they wanted to be an independant nation again they wouldn't go to central Saskatchewan to do it. They'd return to their ancestrial homeland.

[Master of Ossus]

There is the religious justification (hence there was a huge movimentation of jews to that area prior to the WW ) but you know they selected various place to give to Israel, where they would just come and live and do not care for what the host country would care. They even selected a piece of land in the middle of Brazil for it...^^
Bad international politics and feeling guilty let that happen and let Israel keep doing what they do.

The reason all the Jews fled to Israel was because the Muslims there accepted and tolerated them when everywhere else shut its doors (including Britain and the United States). It is ironic how the Israelis repaid their kindness by taking their land.

[GrandMasterTerwynn]

I should say "potentially harmful," since it might be unfair to dismiss these religions as unavoidably harmful.

I would go with a three-way tie between Christianity, Islam, and Hinduism; Christianity and Islam probably have an about equal track record of slaughter and violence, and the caste system of Hinduism makes Jim Crow look like racial paradise.

The caste-system tends to be pretty stable. Which is usually a good thing. The whole caste thing isn't so fair, but it tends to minimize violence.

And Islam actually isn't too bad . . . once you dispatch all the fundies to someplace where they can all be launched into LEO . . . such as the nation of France. The sciences actually made progress under Islam during the Dark Ages.

We've determined that Judaism is pretty evil. Well, at least when it's used to justify Israeli land-grubbing. And Christianity is also bad too. It's main text was set in stone in all of it's self-contradicting bigoted glory. And Christianity was responsible for such lovely things like the Inquisition, the Salem Witch trials and Manifest Destiny.

Sure Christianity has done some good. But even the worst person is capable of the occasional redeeming act.

[neoolong]

The caste system is only really stable if eveyone believes in it. If you got the people at the bottom not believing, and thinking that they are getting screwed they will rebel, and destablize the system.

[C.S.Strowbridge]

And Islam actually isn't too bad . . . once you dispatch all the fundies to someplace where they can all be launched into LEO . . . such as the nation of France. The sciences actually made progress under Islam during the Dark Ages.

Oh come on. Part of Islam is Muhammad lived a perfect life. So if Muhammad didn't do it, it's evil. Kind of limits progress.

Same thing happened in Post Confucius China. 'If Confucius lived without exploration, then we don't need it either.'

[Mr Bean]

Muhammad lived a perfect life. So if Muhammad didn't do it, it's evil. Kind of limits progress.

No see thats bull-shit Fundies right there The Koran acutaly said he lived the best life HE COULD not that was possible but its one of the nusances lost when translating from Arabic


Anyway

[C.S.Strowbridge]

Muhammad lived a perfect life. So if Muhammad didn't do it, it's evil. Kind of limits progress.

No see thats bull-shit Fundies right there The Koran acutaly said he lived the best life HE COULD not that was possible but its one of the nusances lost when translating from Arabic

Bull-shit Fundies or not, that's what was taught since the crusades.

[Knife]

So really it comes down to this,

Any organized religion is bad!

[Mr Bean]

Bull-shit Fundies or not, that's what was taught since the crusades.

Ahh you mean the Crusdaes when the Islamic culture(Just prio to the Crusades) was leading the world in a place for new ideas and techology? Then the crusades started and it was a little hard to have great centers for thinking when the memebers both former and possible where burtured by the invading Christians...

Also notice IN THE HOME OF ISLAM, Saudi Arabia that is not is what is taught, even BY the Bull-shit Fundies, Your thinking or Iran and Afaganstan/Pakistan where they never got off the ground or out of the stone-age

Well besides the McDonalds they built in those countries of course

[MattTheSkywalker]

next of Kin,

Well thank you for the Israel history lesson. So you can read and copy from a book, big shit! You seem to forget the ideology of zionism. If the problems in Israel are purely secular then why didn't the Israelis accept a chunk of Africa as their homeland?

Thanks! Maybe if you read books also, you'd know that most Zionists were against the idea of moving back to Israel. Most of them did not want to be there until the Messiah comes, whenever that may be.
According to strict interpretation of Judaic law, Jews should not be back in Israel until the Messiah comes (which according to jews is at the end of the world).

BTW please do not bring up the "protocols of the learned elders"; it has been proven fake hundreds of times.

So why israel? Well, simply put, Jews were not wanted anywhere in Europe. Europe's catholics were the enemies of Jews - throughout Europe, jews were rounded up in advance by the local populations for presentation to the Nazis. As for teh Protestants (largely Lutherans outside of england), read some Martin Luther. He was such a rabid Jew - hater that Hitler used his speeches as a rallying point for his people. (Of course, Germany has a large Lutheran population)

England simply did not want an influx of millions of jews, nor did America. even a cursory study of the postwar climate as it relates to Jews will demonstrate that the US and UK knew full well that creating Israel would cause great strife in the region, but it was preferred by the leaders at the time over alowing Jews to settle in their countries.

It is believed that some world leaders at the time expected the newly formed state to be overrun by the popuation already there (they tried, 1948), and the problem would solve itself.

Creating Israel was not done as a gesture to the jews, rather as a way for world powers to avoid Jews coming to their countries.

[C.S.Strowbridge]

It is believed that some world leaders at the time expected the newly formed state to be overrun by the popuation already there (they tried, 1948), and the problem would solve itself.

Hell, the US had a weapons embargo against Israel when it was first formed.

[neoolong]

Actually China let in a bunch of Jews during WWII. This is after they couldn't go to the U.S. or England. At least that's what I learned from the trailer to the documentary film, Shanghai Ghetto.

[Darth Wong]

Hell, the US had a weapons embargo against Israel when it was first formed.

Obviously, they've changed their minds since then.

Today, the right-wing fundie group in the US is the strongest bastion of Israel support, because the Bible prophesies that the Israelites must return to Israel before the Second Coming can occur. Since these donkey-fuckers want judgement day to come, they figure they're fulfilling prophecy by helping Israel defeat its enemies.