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2000AD wrote:Halo didn't even bring in co-op, Serious Sam did that and IIRC there were other co-op games before that as well.

EDIT: Hell i just remembered, there were FPS on the frickin Amiga that had co-op.

Do you remember Hired Guns? I sure do, you could have like 2 people on the keyboard and one person on a joystick and one on the mouse. Insane stuff. Yeah, Doom 1/2 and duke3d had coop play.

Oh, and just to remind everyone, Goldeneye had a tank you could drive in the singleplayer game, and that must be fucking old by now.

As for Halo 2, I'll wait and see. If the PC emulation is shit, I'll get an xbox in the future with both halo and halo 2.

Slartibartfast wrote:

Rogue 9 wrote:The Warthog is a crewed vehicle, genius. If you don't have a gunner, no one's going to fire the gun.

OMG REALLY??!!11
Hey genius, "you can't fire at all" -> you = the driver. Go ahead. Disprove me.

I don't see how it's a problem. In real-life, if you climbed into a Hummer, you wouldn't be able to fire the gun while driving because you need a second man to use the gun. If a game was made with a Hummer in it, would you rant that its vehicle model sucks because you can't do something which is impossible in real life, by simultaneously driving it and controlling its swivel gun?

Rye wrote:
Do you remember Hired Guns? I sure do, you could have like 2 people on the keyboard and one person on a joystick and one on the mouse. Insane stuff. Yeah, Doom 1/2 and duke3d had coop play.

Oh, and just to remind everyone, Goldeneye had a tank you could drive in the singleplayer game, and that must be fucking old by now.

As for Halo 2, I'll wait and see. If the PC emulation is shit, I'll get an xbox in the future with both halo and halo 2.

I was pissed off extremely when I heard Hired Guns 2 wasn't going to be completed ever.

Darth Wong wrote:

Slartibartfast wrote:

Rogue 9 wrote:The Warthog is a crewed vehicle, genius. If you don't have a gunner, no one's going to fire the gun.

OMG REALLY??!!11
Hey genius, "you can't fire at all" -> you = the driver. Go ahead. Disprove me.

I don't see how it's a problem. In real-life, if you climbed into a Hummer, you wouldn't be able to fire the gun while driving because you need a second man to use the gun. If a game was made with a Hummer in it, would you rant that its vehicle model sucks because you can't do something which is impossible in real life, by simultaneously driving it and controlling its swivel gun?

Yeah, but this is Teh Future (TM). Anyway I was just pointing out that I know that you can either fire or pilot the vehicle. Yeah, it may suck that you can only fire forwards in vehicles like airplanes or hovercycles but using the Warthog as an example of being able to fire in any direction when the gun is basically a separate device that needs a different player to fire didn't seem a fair comparison to me.

I think the hoopla about the Warthog and not being able to fire the gun comes form the solo status of the player. There were only a few times in campaign that I had a marine to jump in and gun. Likewise in multiplayer, it's usually a FFA, or even in teams you don't want two people hemmed up in that vehicle. So the point you have say the Ghost, the Scorpion and the Warthog, (Halo 2 you'll have the Banshee and other covenant vehicles) Out of those vehicles the Warthog is the only one you can't shoot with unless thieres someone else with you. Pretty much makes it pointless, why jump into something that makes you nothing more then a moving target.

Cal Wright wrote:I think the hoopla about the Warthog and not being able to fire the gun comes form the solo status of the player. There were only a few times in campaign that I had a marine to jump in and gun.

Take better care of your Marines. I never had a shortage, mainly because I didn't use them as meat shields and took pains to get as many out alive as possible. And while you don't want to tie up a third player in the passenger's seat in multiplayer, having a gunner multiplies the Warthog's usefulness greatly, and thus justifies the added risk of putting two players in the same (wildly maneuvering, if the driver is competent) place.

Rye wrote:

2000AD wrote:Halo didn't even bring in co-op, Serious Sam did that and IIRC there were other co-op games before that as well.

EDIT: Hell i just remembered, there were FPS on the frickin Amiga that had co-op.

Do you remember Hired Guns? I sure do, you could have like 2 people on the keyboard and one person on a joystick and one on the mouse. Insane stuff. Yeah, Doom 1/2 and duke3d had coop play.

IIRC wasn't Hired Guns made to be played by 4 people? The demo i played had a four-way split screen and if you were playing on your own it was a bugger as slomeone was bound to get killed while you were shooting with smeone else.

Also i remembr Gloom (the cheap Doom knock-off) having co-op

Rogue 9 wrote:

Cal Wright wrote:I think the hoopla about the Warthog and not being able to fire the gun comes form the solo status of the player. There were only a few times in campaign that I had a marine to jump in and gun.

Take better care of your Marines. I never had a shortage, mainly because I didn't use them as meat shields and took pains to get as many out alive as possible. And while you don't want to tie up a third player in the passenger's seat in multiplayer, having a gunner multiplies the Warthog's usefulness greatly, and thus justifies the added risk of putting two players in the same (wildly maneuvering, if the driver is competent) place.

YAY!! Another HALO player that doesnt use marines as glorified ammo and grenade holders.

Agent Fisher wrote:

Rogue 9 wrote:

Cal Wright wrote:I think the hoopla about the Warthog and not being able to fire the gun comes form the solo status of the player. There were only a few times in campaign that I had a marine to jump in and gun.

Take better care of your Marines. I never had a shortage, mainly because I didn't use them as meat shields and took pains to get as many out alive as possible. And while you don't want to tie up a third player in the passenger's seat in multiplayer, having a gunner multiplies the Warthog's usefulness greatly, and thus justifies the added risk of putting two players in the same (wildly maneuvering, if the driver is competent) place.

YAY!! Another HALO player that doesnt use marines as glorified ammo and grenade holders.

I did that with Orignal Half-Life, once I somehow got every barney possible; even the one who you are supposed to find dead next to a scientist trying to revive him (by some stairs).

I've always felt a certain admiration for NPC's in FPS's that want to help you, it's just so rare IMO.

One of my biggest qualms with halo is how generally useless the marines are compared to you, the super soldier. You'd think they'd at least get shield generators or something.

On the subject of this post - My friend got Halo 2 to work on his xbox, and he was definatly displeased with it, he didn't play much of the campaign because of the french, and he didn't like the feel of the "new" multiplayer.

I'll have to give it a try myself, I've got that ps/2 adapter for the xbox coming in the mail, so I can play mouse/keyboard and acutally not suck.

Oh, and he said they turned off auto-aim, which I suppose is important when you use such an awful controller.

InnocentBystander wrote:One of my biggest qualms with halo is how generally useless the marines are compared to you, the super soldier. You'd think they'd at least get shield generators or something.

In the HALO-verse, the SPARTANS got shield less than a month earlier, and it can only be supported by their armor system.

Agent Fisher wrote:

InnocentBystander wrote:One of my biggest qualms with halo is how generally useless the marines are compared to you, the super soldier. You'd think they'd at least get shield generators or something.

In the HALO-verse, the SPARTANS got shield less than a month earlier, and it can only be supported by their armor system.

Alright the heavy looking armor plates are a component in the shield system, I'll buy it. I still think the marines could be outfitted a little better in combat, some sort of heavy squad support weapons, grenade launchers, something. Sure I suppose a ship's compliment of marines might not be as well armed as a standard army unit; guess we'll have to see what sort of heavy squad support weapons the army uses on earth.

The Marines had rocket launchers and would use them. HMGs were conspicuously missing from the arsenal, though.

Had the Marines been armed with Shotguns they would not have near so useless against the Covie.

Nah. Shotguns were pretty useless against Elites, unless you were REALLY close. Wasting a shell on grunts or jackals, though, was just that.

Alyeska wrote:Had the Marines been armed with Shotguns they would not have near so useless against the Covie.

Wait, none of the Marines had shotguns? Where do you get them, then? It's been a while since I played.

Rogue 9 wrote:

Alyeska wrote:Had the Marines been armed with Shotguns they would not have near so useless against the Covie.

Wait, none of the Marines had shotguns? Where do you get them, then? It's been a while since I played.

The only time you see Marines with shotguns is on the first level you meet the Flood.

InnocentBystander wrote:

Agent Fisher wrote:

Rogue 9 wrote: Take better care of your Marines. I never had a shortage, mainly because I didn't use them as meat shields and took pains to get as many out alive as possible. And while you don't want to tie up a third player in the passenger's seat in multiplayer, having a gunner multiplies the Warthog's usefulness greatly, and thus justifies the added risk of putting two players in the same (wildly maneuvering, if the driver is competent) place.

YAY!! Another HALO player that doesnt use marines as glorified ammo and grenade holders.

I did that with Orignal Half-Life, once I somehow got every barney possible; even the one who you are supposed to find dead next to a scientist trying to revive him (by some stairs).

I've always felt a certain admiration for NPC's in FPS's that want to help you, it's just so rare IMO.

One of my biggest qualms with halo is how generally useless the marines are compared to you, the super soldier. You'd think they'd at least get shield generators or something.

I'm a rather big fan of trying to save useful NPCs as well. I've had a lot of fun with Barney before letting him do my dirty work.

Remember the Barney you meet in Questionable Ethics who mentions the doors are locked and you need a scientist with security clearance? Well I had him tag along and he raked up the following kill count.

16 Marines
6 Headcrabs
4 Houndeyes
2 Bullsquids

I was rather impressed with Barney.

Alyeska wrote:

Rogue 9 wrote:

Alyeska wrote:Had the Marines been armed with Shotguns they would not have near so useless against the Covie.

Wait, none of the Marines had shotguns? Where do you get them, then? It's been a while since I played.

The only time you see Marines with shotguns is on the first level you meet the Flood.

What a remarkable coincidence.

Well I was somewhat pissed about getting no Marines out at the end despite doing everything possible to get them through. Ah well, at least the novels disagree with the game ending, and somehow Sergeant Johnson got off of HALO despite being next to the Pillar of Autumn when it went up.

Rogue 9 wrote:Well I was somewhat pissed about getting no Marines out at the end despite doing everything possible to get them through. Ah well, at least the novels disagree with the game ending, and somehow Sergeant Johnson got off of HALO despite being next to the Pillar of Autumn when it went up.

Ya, the first time I played through, I tried to keep 'em alive. I even took bullets for them and it turns out that they all die anyway. So after that, I just didn't care.