StarDestroyer.Net BBS

It seems like Caesar's goal was just to help Kim avoid getting power taken away by the Brits. He's not a moron, and has to know he should best be just a figurehead for Kim. Maybe he could her with certain strategic thinking such as remembering that the river is not a defensive structure.

Aw man, this chapter rocked. Between Julius Ceaser putting Two-Para in their place, Belial staring in shock at the total curbstomping Satan just received, and Beelzebub realizing he has been completely obliterated....

Yeah, Stuart, this chapter was absolutely worth the wait.

Duchess:

Wherever you mention .50-caliber HMGs, might it be possible to upgrade to the GAU-19 .50-caliber gatling on a 1-1 basis? There are 3-barrel and 6-barrel versions, and they are light enough to be mounted on a Hummer. As for ROF, I have seen data for the weapon that indicates it has a cyclic rate of between 1300 and 8,000 RPM.

Mike Garrity

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote: Never mind that. There's now a gigantic sucking void at the top of the infernal command structure.

What makes you so sure Satan is actually dead?

The Duchess of Zeon wrote: Well, existing AEGIS radars may already be capable of doing this, since radar clearly has the same effect on Harpies.

Peak power of SPY-1 is about 4-6 megawatts, but only for a tiny fraction of a second, the sustained power rating is only around 60kw, which is not going to make for a particularly effective death ray with that energy spread over a wide area. If you want to death ray things then look to continuous wave illuminators, some of the old ones we had for Terrier and Talos could output over 1 megawatt, and even newer ones are still very powerful.

Michael Garrity wrote:Duchess:

Wherever you mention .50-caliber HMGs, might it be possible to upgrade to the GAU-19 .50-caliber gatling on a 1-1 basis? There are 3-barrel and 6-barrel versions, and they are light enough to be mounted on a Hummer. As for ROF, I have seen data for the weapon that indicates it has a cyclic rate of between 1300 and 8,000 RPM.

Mike Garrity

Cheap, easily manufactured, exists in large numbers. M2. This is about mass production. This is why we are using existing hulls or minimally modified ones. Even my proposed modified Cyclone class (increase length by 11ft, beam by 3ft, and draft by 2ft) of about 400 tons (guesstimated, I confess) is really to damned small for the role that's being asked of it, but I think they'd be built because the alternative is designing an entirely new small hull. The OHPs, LCS, Legend-class, and Burkes are the newest hulls we have around that fit the right roles, so we revive them and modify as necessary, and thus as proposed here.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Remember, if he's telling the truth, Caesar is commander of the largest military force in hell at this point, even if its just men with sticks and swords.

Yeah but, the demons were bigger men with slightly better sticks and swords, and had larger numbers. And we know well they are doing.

Sea Skimmer wrote:

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote: Never mind that. There's now a gigantic sucking void at the top of the infernal command structure.

What makes you so sure Satan is actually dead?

Even if Satan was away from his palace, the casually absolute annihilation of the biggest and most ancient edifice of demonic engineering in the history of Hell is going to slightly weaken his power base, if only through sheer damage to demonic morale.

Sea Skimmer wrote:

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote: Never mind that. There's now a gigantic sucking void at the top of the infernal command structure.

What makes you so sure Satan is actually dead?

Well, sure, he might've survived the massive overpressure of the shockwave coming up through the floor of his palace. He might also have survived the hurricane of debris generated by the blast. He might also have survived the mass of his palace crashing down on top of him, and rubble falling quite a few stories towards the floor of the caldera. It is remotely possible that he might be still alive, crushed and both slowly bleeding and suffocating to death while reflecting on his life. It's even possible that demonic rescue teams might be able to pick their way down unstable, debris-laden slopes, locate and dig him out before he expires. Though as demonic medicine seems to be limited to "rely on demonic regenerative capabilities," he may just die anyway, before his rescuers can complete the equally dangerous ascent back out of ground zero.

Or else, he might've been somewhere else in Dis, buying a cart of delicious human children when he heard the bombs go off and went "OMG WTF!!??" Come to think of it, that's probably the only way Satan could still be alive and in any shape to give orders to anybody.

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote:Or else, he might've been somewhere else in Dis, buying a cart of delicious human children when he heard the bombs go off and went "OMG WTF!!??" Come to think of it, that's probably the only way Satan could still be alive and in any shape to give orders to anybody.

I think that would probably be a horrible cop out though, seeing as how he has never left his palace throughout the entire fic.

Or Satan is simply powerful enough and resistant enough to survive at some distance from the main blast points?

The hyperreal, clinical narrative of the bomb effects was both interesting and classic Slade. That stuff would get tedious quickly if overdone (I suppose it's the literary equivalent of bullet time), but it's very effective (not to mention educational) in short bursts.

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote:He might also have survived the mass of his palace crashing down on top of him, and rubble falling quite a few stories towards the floor of the caldera. It is remotely possible that he might be still alive, crushed and both slowly bleeding and suffocating to death while reflecting on his life. It's even possible that demonic rescue teams might be able to pick their way down unstable, debris-laden slopes, locate and dig him out before he expires.

Satan does have the benefit of (probably) stronger telekinesis than any other demon in hell. That wouldn't help one jot against the actual blast, due to the impossibly fast reaction time required, but it could theoretically help with the rubble if he was far enough from the epicenter to survive the initial shockwave (and remain conscious). I don't think that's likely - he was probably in the throne room and utterly dead - but it's possible.

Darth Ruinus wrote:

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote:Or else, he might've been somewhere else in Dis, buying a cart of delicious human children when he heard the bombs go off and went "OMG WTF!!??" Come to think of it, that's probably the only way Satan could still be alive and in any shape to give orders to anybody.

I think that would probably be a horrible cop out though, seeing as how he has never left his palace throughout the entire fic.

I don't know about that. The total in-universe time we've seen Satan probably adds up to less than a few hours. Perhaps Satan likes to engage in a nice, relaxing game of golf, or trap-shooting with his trusty trident while listening to the wailing and gnashing of teeth of the damned when he's not managing the byzantine levels of treachery, haranguing his minions, brooding in his fortress of solitude, and disintegrating his palace staff.

Peptuck wrote:Aw man, this chapter rocked. Between Julius Ceaser putting Two-Para in their place, Belial staring in shock at the total curbstomping Satan just received, and Beelzebub realizing he has been completely obliterated....

Yeah, Stuart, this chapter was absolutely worth the wait.

Beelzebub's still got a significant force. He can't go on offense, but at this point, the only offensive Earth can launch is a strategic bombing offensive backing an insurgency with deep-penetration commando units.

Can't wait to see a bunch of demons meet up with JP233, napalm, and cluster bombs.

Did anything new get posted? I'm seeing 66 as the title, but I can't find the fic...

Back one page, Shep. You'll enjoy it, shit breaks.

Sea Skimmer wrote:What makes you so sure Satan is actually dead?

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:Or Satan is simply powerful enough and resistant enough to survive at some distance from the main blast points?

Indeed, it's suggested in the chapter that demons in the rubble wouldn't be killed right away, due to their Hellish constitutions - that they would die slowly.

Satan is mentioned as being telekinetically powerful enough to smear a Greater Demon to paste against a wall with one good shove.

I wouldn't be so sure as to place a bet that he's actually dead - I suspect he might burst his way out of the rubble soon afterwards, VERY angry.

Caesar's name doesn't appear to be causing confusion, I wonder why.

From what I understand, the magical language translator thing works in such a way that you can hear the language the other person is speaking in, and yet you somehow understand what the other meant. Failures to comprehend thus occur only when the speaker means something that the listener has no concept of. Thus names would inherently be rendered as spoken, unless the speaker knows the meaning of their name, is trying to convey it, and it means something the listener can understand. For example, the word "esperanza" in Spanish means "hope", it is also a woman's name. "Mi nombre es Esperanza" would probably be heard as, "My name is Esperanza" by an English speaker. If she goes on to say, "Esperanza significa esperanza", would be heard as "Esperanza means hope".

How would this lead to confusion? Caesar is pronounced as if it were written Kaisar, thus when the man himself says it, everyone else would be hearing that, not "See-sahr". There is also the minor issue of "Julius", it might be said as written now days, or it might be said as a modern speaker would render the original "Iulius", the Romans used the "I" for both sounds.

I suppose that by the time he meets the 2nd Para Colonel, Kim has explained to him how to render it in modern English, so in that exchange it wouldn't be an issue.

Incidentally, "ave" is pronounced "aue", Latin had no "v" that's their "u".

KlavoHunter wrote:Satan is mentioned as being telekinetically powerful enough to smear a Greater Demon to paste against a wall with one good shove.

A feat which is, in turn, insignificant next to the power of those bombs.

I wouldn't be so sure as to place a bet that he's actually dead - I suspect he might burst his way out of the rubble soon afterwards, VERY angry.

It's possible, but there's no particular reason to think it is so.

PS. Stuart, I believe that "more than 1,250 miles per hour" figure is a typo, and should be "more than 250 miles per hour".

We can hope something good comes of the pissing match over who commands Free Hell. If it becomes an issue (which it will I'm sure. The Brits aren't going to want to back down on this.) the bigwigs will finally have to work out a real arrangement.

Would NATO be of use to resolve such bullshit? I can see the Americans and Russians having such problems in the future which could lead to lots of people dieing.

What the humans need is a general like Eisenhower who can get everyone to work together and play nice. (And the American and British Generals under Eisenhower still had epic pissing matches of their own in WWII.)

Duchess, would those 25mm Bushmasters be mounted on the older Mk.38 MGSes, or on stabilized remote operated Mk 38 Mod 2 MGSes? The remote operated mount can receive input from a fire control radar (or it can be aimed using its electro-optical sights), and target tracking is easier when mounted on a smaller vessel (Which was the reason for developing the Mod 2 version). Like the Mk 38 MGS, the MK 38 Mod 2 MGS does not penetrate the deck. However, the Mod 2 MGS can only elevate between -20 and +45 degrees while the Mod 0 MGS can elevate between -20 and +55 degrees (couldn't find any information on the Mod 0's traverse, the Mod 2's is +/-160 degrees. The Mod 2 is of course heavier than the Mod 0 (less than 1000kg compared to 567kg).



edited grammar

Darth Wong wrote: PS. Stuart, I believe that "more than 1,250 miles per hour" figure is a typo, and should be "more than 250 miles per hour".

No way; with a 30,000lb bomb!? Grand Slam was a 22,000lb weapon dropped from about 21,000ft and 280mph and it fell at supersonic speed already. Add 8000lb extra weight, twice the release altitude, more then twice the release speed and all with a bomb that has a smaller diameter and its hard to think how it couldn’t be traveling at that kind of velocity. You aren’t going to pierce 130 feet of rock with a grenade launcher velocity 250mph bomb, thats for sure.

Sea Skimmer wrote:

Darth Wong wrote:PS. Stuart, I believe that "more than 1,250 miles per hour" figure is a typo, and should be "more than 250 miles per hour".

No way; with a 30,000lb bomb!? Grand Slam was a 22,000lb weapon dropped from about 21,000ft and 280mph and it fell at supersonic speed already. Add 8000lb extra weight, twice the release altitude, more then twice the release speed and all with a bomb that has a smaller diameter and its hard to think how it couldn’t be traveling at that kind of velocity. You aren’t going to pierce 130 feet of rock with a grenade launcher velocity 250mph bomb, thats for sure.

Fair enough; that was based on something I'd seen earlier but hadn't bothered crunching numbers for. Given the high density of the bomb, a very high terminal velocity makes perfect sense as you point out.

Duchess:

Since you have made the decision that all .50-caliber HMGs will be the single-mount type (for the reasons you mentioned in a previous post), may I suggest that each weapon be the M3 variant of the .50-Cal?
The M3 was that weapon carried by USAAF aircraft during WW2, it's main advantage over the standard M2 was that it had a cyclic rate of 1,200 RPM; pair this with a water-cooled jacket for the barrel, and you will have an even more murderously-effective weapon system.
In another matter, of all the various guns you mentioned on that table of ships, what are the applicable ammunition types for the larger guns (25-mm & up)? For those .50's, I suggest a diet of SLAP or Raufoss...

Mike Garrity

Michael Garrity wrote:Duchess:

Since you have made the decision that all .50-caliber HMGs will be the single-mount type (for the reasons you mentioned in a previous post), may I suggest that each weapon be the M3 variant of the .50-Cal?
The M3 was that weapon carried by USAAF aircraft during WW2, it's main advantage over the standard M2 was that it had a cyclic rate of 1,200 RPM; pair this with a water-cooled jacket for the barrel, and you will have an even more murderously-effective weapon system.
In another matter, of all the various guns you mentioned on that table of ships, what are the applicable ammunition types for the larger guns (25-mm & up)? For those .50's, I suggest a diet of SLAP or Raufoss...

Mike Garrity

The problem is less one of what's ideal and more what can be mass produced.

RH: It depends on production rates--expect some weight-critical ships (The Cyclone's) to use the older Mk.38 as well as some larger ships when there aren't enough Mod 2's.

Note this is still just proposed. It might be possible to add some more armament, anyhow, to some of the vessels.

Darth Wong wrote: PS. Stuart, I believe that "more than 1,250 miles per hour" figure is a typo, and should be "more than 250 miles per hour".

The terminal velocity of a MOP is 2,750 mph but there isn't enough altitude for it to reach that speed. From 29,000 feet, it actually hits somewhere between 1,100 and 1,250 mph, way supersonic. It's not the first bomb of its kind to do that; the WW2 Tallboy and Grand Slam bombs also arrived supersonic (they had the same problem, not enough altitude from drop to build up to maximum speed.