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Hey Beowulf, you mind if I make a port call to that base?

Raj, so you interested in the particle collider? The diplomatic communique has been sent.

SiegeTank wrote:It's 'no ships and only helicopters' now, but the fact is that once there's a base up and running there it'll be easy to expand it to include ships and fighters and who knows what else. The point remains: if you're unwilling to negotiate this point than as far as we're concerned the summit is a total farce and we might just as well not have convened it in the first place.

But if you want to play this in terms of carrots and sticks, I'll tell you what: you remove that base and I'll reduce the number of nuclear cruise missiles pointed at Tian Jiao.

Hey look! More threats of sticks! Here's a tip: force, or the threat of force, is always a stick. You obviously have nothing worth trading that strategically placed base for.

Lonestar wrote:Hey Beowulf, you mind if I make a port call to that base?

Sure. Considering the amount of time that's passed, it should be capable of taking ships now. Maybe not aircraft carriers...

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:I guess it is safe to say the summit has collapsed.

Indeed it has.

Beowulf wrote:Hey look! More threats of sticks! Here's a tip: force, or the threat of force, is always a stick. You obviously have nothing worth trading that strategically placed base for.

Potentially placing missiles would be a threat. That's not what this is. The missiles are already there. Pointing them somewhere else is the offer. But you're not willing to negotiate anyway, so that's a moot point. So if you'll excuse us we're going to walk out of the conference and order some more nukes and cruise missiles.

SiegeTank wrote:
Potentially placing missiles would be a threat. That's not what this is. The missiles are already there. Pointing them somewhere else is the offer. But you're not willing to negotiate anyway, so that's a moot point. So if you'll excuse us we're going to walk out of the conference and order some more nukes and cruise missiles.

What a bullshit offer that is. "Yeah we'll just point them in the opposite direction or stick them in storage in a warehouse conviently located near a launch site."

whoops

Fin, Beowulf didn't demand carrots IC, IRC.

Lonestar wrote:Fin, Beowulf didn't demand carrots IC, IRC.

I thought the current discussions were hammering out a final outcome? Back door talk?

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:
I thought the current discussions were hammering out a final outcome? Back door talk?

I thought that they weren't, because some people were comparing about the confusion it was generating with the summit going on.

Lonestar wrote:

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:
I thought the current discussions were hammering out a final outcome? Back door talk?

I thought that they weren't, because some people were comparing about the confusion it was generating with the summit going on.

Then what's the point of Coyote saying this:

Coyote wrote:The summit has become a non-event that is sucking my patience and creativity. Let's just post the egreed results in OOC and be done with it; I'm quite frankly tired of it and have no desire to pursue it any more

Either we do the dealing here or in-game. Otherwise, the summit isn't going anywhere.

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:
Either we do the dealing here or in-game. Otherwise, the summit isn't going anywhere.

Doh! As I was.

Who cares about that little base and Beowulf's posturing?

The Frequesue neutrality bullshit moratorium on strategic arms is considered null and void because the organization which signed it has ceased to exist. Beowulf knows it as do we all.

Strategic weapons, owned and operated by Frequesue powers, I believe, will be pointed not at worthless neocolonies like Tian Jiao which his Majesty Beowulf of course considers expendable, but at Beowulf himself so that he thinks twice before commencing any military operation against Baerne, Siege or Miratia.

Considering his Majesty's absolutely ignorant attitude towards the use of WMDs by rogue formations or failed states - call it how you like - against a fully legitimate government which is also a member of the CATO, I'd say there should be some sort of heavy nuclear deterrent established against Beowulf so that any attempt to assail a small nation in Frequesue would be met with strategic retaliation against MESS nations' mainland and their cities, because nothing else would possibly deter them at all.

That would be the result of the failure of the summit, and all MESS powers knew it before they just decided the proposals are not worth anything.

Consider this a political opinion of a former head of state. But I think I'm pretty spot on. Expect massive WMD orders and WMD programs by Frequesuan nations.

Alright, I guess I better make this clear now then: Any use of NBC weapons on the soil of Tian Xia proper rather than Tian Jiao will be considered by the OD to be a precursor to an attack on the MESS and the bombers will be scrambled. I really don't care about a nuclear exchange on the F-ing continent, but making threatening gestrures towards one of the anchors of the MESS is alarming.

By the way, having a gi-normous naval exercise in the middle of a summit wasn't conducive to me having a warm and fuzzy about CATO's intentions.

Lonestar wrote:Alright, I guess I better make this clear now then: Any use of NBC weapons on the soil of Tian Xia proper rather than Tian Jiao will be considered by the OD to be a precursor to an attack on the MESS and the bombers will be scrambled. I really don't care about a nuclear exchange on the F-ing continent, but making threatening gestrures towards one of the anchors of the MESS is alarming.

By the way, having a gi-normous naval exercise in the middle of a summit wasn't conducive to me having a warm and fuzzy about CATO's intentions.

Unreal time, Lonestar, unreal time. The exercise is either after or before the conference. I'm not sure which.

In light of how its going, though, its probably after...

Ryan Thunder wrote:

Lonestar wrote:Alright, I guess I better make this clear now then: Any use of NBC weapons on the soil of Tian Xia proper rather than Tian Jiao will be considered by the OD to be a precursor to an attack on the MESS and the bombers will be scrambled. I really don't care about a nuclear exchange on the F-ing continent, but making threatening gestrures towards one of the anchors of the MESS is alarming.

By the way, having a gi-normous naval exercise in the middle of a summit wasn't conducive to me having a warm and fuzzy about CATO's intentions.

Unreal time, Lonestar, unreal time. The exercise is either after or before the conference. I'm not sure which.

In light of how its going, though, its probably after...

No, the exercise was conducted not long after the incident in Costa. Stas' news report was an elaborate of a post I made some weeks back.

My delegation wouldn't literally be asking for carrots, but rather looking blankly at the NFT delegation, and waiting for them to actually negotiate, with a reasonable offer in return, rather than threatening with a stick, and promising to hide the stick they currently have waving in my direction. You know, something concrete, as opposed to meaningless gestures and threats. Random example: convince the UCSR to remove it's fleet base from Livorno. I mean, it's not as if I didn't repeatedly make reference to the ASFR, Livorno, the CSR's actions there, etc... I can't actually demand from the NFT that it get removed, because the NFT doesn't own the base.

Beowulf wrote:My delegation wouldn't literally be asking for carrots, but rather looking blankly at the NFT delegation, and waiting for them to actually negotiate, with a reasonable offer in return, rather than threatening with a stick, and promising to hide the stick they currently have waving in my direction. You know, something concrete, as opposed to meaningless gestures and threats. Random example: convince the UCSR to remove it's fleet base from Livorno. I mean, it's not as if I didn't repeatedly make reference to the ASFR, Livorno, the CSR's actions there, etc... I can't actually demand from the NFT that it get removed, because the NFT doesn't own the base.

To be honest, you can't expect people to read their minds, and silence can also be interpreted as refusal to negotiate. Either something more concrete, or back door dealing during a recess during the conference. Remember, you issued the insults first.

Beowulf wrote:<snip>

You rocked the boat by putting the base there. Livorno has been in place for a long time, AFAIK. You're in no place to make demands.

Lonestar wrote:Alright, I guess I better make this clear now then: Any use of NBC weapons on the soil of Tian Xia proper rather than Tian Jiao will be considered by the OD to be a precursor to an attack on the MESS and the bombers will be scrambled. I really don't care about a nuclear exchange on the F-ing continent, but making threatening gestrures towards one of the anchors of the MESS is alarming.

What should the Frequesuan powers do? Take it up the ass for you in case something happens? We're not talking about an all out CATO attack, but about a deterrent. If a couple of Beowulf's cities go up in flames in case he decides that he should say, remove Sidney Hank from the helm of NFT by rolling his tanks to his capital or shooting a cruise missile into San Dorado... he'd be less inclined to do something like that.

Lonestar wrote:By the way, having a gi-normous naval exercise in the middle of a summit wasn't conducive to me having a warm and fuzzy about CATO's intentions.

That exercise was quite a long time ago, it was journal article describing it. The exercise was conducted after the Costa crisis and somewhere along the time when Czech started moving his little nation for a "little victorious war" in Veleria.

Beowulf wrote:My delegation wouldn't literally be asking for carrots, but rather looking blankly at the NFT delegation, and waiting for them to actually negotiate, with a reasonable offer in return, rather than threatening with a stick, and promising to hide the stick they currently have waving in my direction.

So you actually make no demands? That's telling. You're fine with the mess you caused

Beowulf wrote:You know, something concrete, as opposed to meaningless gestures and threats. Random example: convince the UCSR to remove it's fleet base from Livorno. I mean, it's not as if I didn't repeatedly make reference to the ASFR, Livorno, the CSR's actions there, etc... I can't actually demand from the NFT that it get removed, because the NFT doesn't own the base.

It was a CATO summit and the Union delegation was there. Instead your delegates stared at whom, NFT representatives?

That's like looking at Taiwan and expecting the USA to remove the ABM from Poland. That's insane. What, did your diplomats shake in their boots so that they couldn't actually, um, tell President Shady about it? He was spending days at that conference. Farce, pure farce.

What happened to Czech, anyway? I was looking forward to seeing how that war would've turned out.

Looks like CATO activity scared him, he dropped off. Else, he just got bored.

P.S. Baerne I'm in your nation talking to UR head of state or whoever you decided to send to talk to me

Master_Baerne wrote:What happened to Czech, anyway? I was looking forward to seeing how that war would've turned out.

I think he buggered off when I pointed out that his OOB was a reeking pile of masturbatory horseshit. His way or he hits the highway, I guess.

About my recent non post in the game thread: Basically I had my president being in two places at once. i'll need to finish one diplomatic visit with him before I begin another!

Raj, I sent the diplomatic communique. GOing to reply?