StarDestroyer.Net BBS

The Barrier Isles are there because... I dunno, I figure it'd look nice. they'd foresuredly festoon Frequesue's fundament frighteningly, filibustering Frequesean freedom in a finishing foreclosure - (un)fortutiously facilitating further fiendish Fu-Manchu foreign fucking-overs of Frequesue.

EDIT:

Goddamn that's an awesome alliteration!

Shroom Man 777 wrote:I'm sorry.

But it really looks like you're heaping all those new territories on everyone else but your long-time good friends the Messicans. The Old Continent and Frequesue did start the game with several NPCs already, while Messica never had a single NPC on their safe and distant land, and now the OCers and F-ers get MOAR NPCs.

It comes off a little bit like Partisan Planet Planning.

EDIT:

That's right. Festoon everyone else up their alopecias!

Look. That's not how it is. I just did you first because, as I said, you're Eurasia and therefore it's easiest to find inspiration. Messica doesn't have as many places to put stuff because Tian Xia, Shinra, and Wilkonia are all crammed together in the Capitalism Sandwich and I'm finding it difficult to find somewhere to attach something.

As far as stuff added to the OC goes, here's the tale:

Khitan got an expansion cause he just had this southern mountain range, like he expected to be wedged against another country and not placed as a peninsula. I rounded off an otherwise flat and strange-looking but of Japanistani and Egyptian coast with another NPC. Scandinavia and Denmark and Britain (which is where I've moved as the fee for doing this map, by the way) are there just to liven up the otherwise boring northern coast. Scandinavia seems to be universally hated, so I'm removing it entirely - but I'm keeping Denmark there because otherwise there isn't a proper Emmerian Channel.

F'king's isles I just put on the map to show they're not being entirely ignored. I'll fix those, after Messica. Which is what I'm doing right now.

Also, nice alliteration there. Some of it's a bit forced, but a remarkable bit of work nonetheless.

Shroom Man 777 wrote:I'm sorry.

But it really looks like you're heaping all those new territories on everyone else but your long-time good friends the Messicans. The Old Continent and Frequesue did start the game with several NPCs already, while Messica never had a single NPC on their safe and distant land, and now the OCers and F-ers get MOAR NPCs.

It comes off a little bit like Partisan Planet Planning.

EDIT:

That's right. Festoon everyone else up their alopecias!

Yes we only started with a nice neat ready to explode situation between myself and Phong that never took off along with the Shep/Lonestar faceoff in the Shepland continent. In other words the MESS started the game in a psoition where two of its nations were facing off across histroically disputed borders with nations known to be racing towards nuclear capability. Aside from Fin' (who also had the MESS umbrella at the time) none of the current nations making up CATO were in anywhere close to the same strategic position.

Short of adding an entire south america below the IRT any nation that would be placed into the Messamerican sphere of influence is almost certian to come immedaitely under either a) Steve's Pacific Union or b) The combined peacekeeping forces of Wilkonian and the IRT who have moved to an understanding regarding their nearest neighbors even if we still look at each other crossways.

I agree that its an awful lot of NPC nations to add to the OC (to the point that I would have added either Scandanavia or the British Isles but not both) but turning it into some sort of plot against you is just ranting into the wind.

Czechmate wrote:F'king's isles I just put on the map to show they're not being entirely ignored. I'll fix those, after Messica. Which is what I'm doing right now.

Oh no, please entirely ignore us, it is a good thing.

CmdrWilkens wrote:Yes we only started with a nice neat ready to explode situation between myself and Phong that never took off along with the Shep/Lonestar faceoff in the Shepland continent. In other words the MESS started the game in a psoition where two of its nations were facing off across histroically disputed borders with nations known to be racing towards nuclear capability. Aside from Fin' (who also had the MESS umbrella at the time) none of the current nations making up CATO were in anywhere close to the same strategic position.

Short of adding an entire south america below the IRT any nation that would be placed into the Messamerican sphere of influence is almost certian to come immedaitely under either a) Steve's Pacific Union or b) The combined peacekeeping forces of Wilkonian and the IRT who have moved to an understanding regarding their nearest neighbors even if we still look at each other crossways.

I agree that its an awful lot of NPC nations to add to the OC (to the point that I would have added either Scandanavia or the British Isles but not both) but turning it into some sort of plot against you is just ranting into the wind.

South America is something I tried to do the other night, but Tonkin's shape is just so cartographically grotesque that I tried five different outlines and just couldn't think of a way to make it work.

You guys -are- gonna have to get festooned, though, so start thinking of additions and tell me before I just start doing it on my own.

PS: You're super funny, Karmic. You should do standup.

EDIT: Try this on for size, lads - http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo24 ... 1247946336

But ranting at the wind is what I do!

Evil MESShead plot or not, it's still rather unbalanced and the sheer amount of NPCs is rather heavy. And the sausage islands around Frequesue's southern coast, that Barrier thing, man.

Wilkens wrote:Yes we only started with a nice neat ready to explode situation between myself and Phong that never took off along with the Shep/Lonestar faceoff in the Shepland continent.

But Phong is cool and is actually, y'know, sane. Not like... That Other Guy.


Serious Non-Bullshit Suggestions Time

Okay, my delusional nightmare-fueled ravings aside, the whole slew of NPCs is still unbalanced and heavy, especially since they're basically all lumped at Frequesue and the OC. I'd suggest that we take some (a lot) of those added NPCs off and... place them somewhere else.

If we enlarge 'Greenland', which is basically up North and between Messica and the OC, we would not unbalance the situation but instead make for something new and interesting. We'd have new land, we'd have new NPCs, but they won't be stuck in either Messica or OC - but IN BETWEEN. So we can have all sorts of plot opportunities with 'em.

Instead of FESTOOING FREQUESUE with sausage barrier islands... maybe an archipelago can instead be scattered in the waters between Frequesue and Tonkin? Maybe also upwards towards Zoria, to create a "Pacific Ring" of loosely scattered island-NPCs that span the empty oceans between the F-ing Continent and Messica/Tonkin?

The waters UNDER Frequesue, between it and the South Pole, are also very empty. Islands could be placed there. Even a small continent or something.

LIKEWISE with the ocean UNDER Velaria and Astaria. Also the waters BETWEEN Misteria and Czech's Emmeria.


These potential new NPCs don't need to be lumped entirely in Frequesue and the Old Continent. Both continents are rather pretty and I'm sure we've all come to like them (as much as we like North America ), and it'd be lousy to deface them.

There are a whole lot of other ugly empty spaces in the world map that can be prettied-up by filling 'em with stuff.

What say you, guys?

I think it's perfectly useless to go on a tangent about how continents were laid out at the start of the game. It could have perhaps been done in a better/more interesting fashion, but what's done is done and there's no way to turn back the clock on that, so let's just consider that water under the bridge and see about ways to make the map more interesting, shall we?

Shroom Man 777 wrote:But ranting at the wind is what I do!

Evil MESShead plot or not, it's still rather unbalanced and the sheer amount of NPCs is rather heavy. And the sausage islands around Frequesue's southern coast, that Barrier thing, man.

Wilkens wrote:Yes we only started with a nice neat ready to explode situation between myself and Phong that never took off along with the Shep/Lonestar faceoff in the Shepland continent.

But Phong is cool and is actually, y'know, sane. Not like... That Other Guy.


Serious Non-Bullshit Suggestions Time

Okay, my delusional nightmare-fueled ravings aside, the whole slew of NPCs is still unbalanced and heavy, especially since they're basically all lumped at Frequesue and the OC. I'd suggest that we take some (a lot) of those added NPCs off and... place them somewhere else.

If we enlarge 'Greenland', which is basically up North and between Messica and the OC, we would not unbalance the situation but instead make for something new and interesting. We'd have new land, we'd have new NPCs, but they won't be stuck in either Messica or OC - but IN BETWEEN. So we can have all sorts of plot opportunities with 'em.

Instead of FESTOOING FREQUESUE with sausage barrier islands... maybe an archipelago can instead be scattered in the waters between Frequesue and Tonkin? Maybe also upwards towards Zoria, to create a "Pacific Ring" of loosely scattered island-NPCs that span the empty oceans between the F-ing Continent and Messica/Tonkin?

The waters UNDER Frequesue, between it and the South Pole, are also very empty. Islands could be placed there. Even a small continent or something.

LIKEWISE with the ocean UNDER Velaria and Astaria. Also the waters BETWEEN Misteria and Czech's Emmeria.


These potential new NPCs don't need to be lumped entirely in Frequesue and the Old Continent. Both continents are rather pretty and I'm sure we've all come to like them (as much as we like North America ), and it'd be lousy to deface them.

There are a whole lot of other ugly empty spaces in the world map that can be prettied-up by filling 'em with stuff.

What say you, guys?

http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo24 ... 1247946336

Look at that, edit your post, give your brain a minute to digest, and then we can talk about where to put stuff. Alright?

PS: Emmeria relocated to the British Isles, along with an NPC of my design that has a complicated shared backstory. Like I said before, it's my fee for dealing with you guys and the inevitable disagreements.

The New Map is alright. With Finland gone and those Barrier Sausages gone also, it looks prettier.

I am still against the expansion of Khitan though, it really constricts my nation's waterways.

Czech, could you take out the yellow and a bit of the grey bits that've been added on Khitan? Pretty-please?

EDIT:

Wait, you're now NEAR THE OLD CONTINENT?! NOOOO!!!!

Fine.

Shroom Man 777 wrote:The New Map is alright. With Finland gone and those Barrier Sausages gone also, it looks prettier.

I am still against the expansion of Khitan though, it really constricts my nation's waterways.

Czech, could you take out the yellow and a bit of the grey bits that've been added on Khitan? Pretty-please?

I'll give it a go.

Shroom Man 777 wrote:
EDIT:

Wait, you're now NEAR THE OLD CONTINENT?! NOOOO!!!!

Fine.

Though to be fair, I totally had no idea Emmeria got relocated though.

What happened to... Old Emmeria?

It's much better, but I'm still unsure about the island off the north-east coast of Frequesue. Could you size it down, and maybe move it farther west into the Pacific? And maybe shape it like it would fit into the shoreline of Sabika and the northern jungles? Its shape strikes me as oddly arbitrary right now.

It looks like a kidney.

I think those weird-shaped islands of yours should be moved a bit deeper Northwards, to form a "Pacific Ring" of islands in the empty spaces between Messica, Zoria, Frequesue and Tonkin.

Our geography is totally fucked up.

Shroom - Emmeria as it is right now is actually mostly neutral, because it's busy dealing with their autarkist secessionist northern neighbor. Old Emmeria got split into two island chains, one of which has a cool central lake with an island in it. They're terra incognita as far as I'm concerned.

Siege - *snip* whoops wrong island lol

EDIT: MESSICA FIRST GUYS COME ON KEEP WITH THE TOUR

Czechmate wrote:Siege - I actually shaped it to roughly fit against the Baernish and Costan coasts, but then I moved it out further and it's not as obvious.

No, I don't mean those islands, I rather like them (they have a kind of spinal column vibe to them). I mean the odd butterfly islands in the north-east.

EDIT: Ha! My reply trumps your edit!

Oh, -those- were supposed to fit against Indophal and Coilerburg but, again, got moved further out.

I still say those Kidney and Butterfly islands should be moved and used to form a Pacific Ring. So you guys can actually have a Pacific to Union. Well, for Steve at least. *shrug*

They can be our Micronesias.

Czechmate wrote:Oh, -those- were supposed to fit against Indophal and Coilerburg but, again, got moved further out.

I see. I'd still like to see them moved to the west a good bit though. In fact, I like Shroom's suggestion of an archipelago... Could you try removing Butterfly Island and adding in one or two island chains like the ones above Velaria, to see how that looks?

The idea of more pacific islands is great, but the map's divided wrong for it. Unless I 'rotate' it so that everything west of Langley is actually at the far left side of the map, making a map that has the Pacific and F'sue taking up most of the left side and Messica/impact archipelago/OC taking up the right.

Hrm... that's not really that bad, though. Being a bit left-heavy won't be too bad. You can balance it by adding more things to Velaria or something. Like, a landmass to its south!

http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo24 ... 1247948327

How's this?

That looks totally sweet . I also like the new islands a lot better. And interestingly enough the distance from Frequesue to Velaria seems a lot smaller than I originally thought it was...

Using Czech's map as of now, I put together this:

http://stgjr.com/sdnworld/mapproposal.png

Got rid of the direct link because it fucked the page up. I also see Czech's rotated the map. Czech, feel free to copy my Veleria and Astaria onto the master map.

It includes my proposal for a "southern" area below Veleria, it also colors Adabani with Cascadian-Alaskan green to show it as part of the forming PacUnion, colors Astaria into red and green zones, colors Astarian Veleria as well, shows Cascadia's Van Halstoff and Welles Coastal Territories in western Veleria, Japanistani Veleria, a blue line to show the Dragonsnake River as well as a small marker for Zoria's Port Adria, and divides al-Akharabat into the present Katangwa Free State and Caravoland (each a lighter version of Canissian and Japanistani color). Also, to prevent confusion between the PacUnion and Japanistan, Japanistani holdings have been recolored dark orange (as in HOI2, the color taken directly form a screenshot).

That's brilliant stuff, Steve. I'll copy it over onto the rotated map version.

For underwater geography, we can do things like make Astaria an extension of a landmass, partly submerged, that includes the right-turned New Zealand islands. We could even add small islands between them as part of this land mass. (Kinda like the RL Zealandia mass, a partly-submerged mass that includes New Zealand and reaches up to New Caledonia).

Another similar landmass could exist, almost entirely submerged, in the North Pacific, where all those island chains (including Misteria) exist.