StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Right. I remember the armored trains now.

It seems more logical for China to go south anyways. Myanmar and Vietnam grow a lot of rice (though I can't really see China running out of food, since their agriculture isn't very energy intensive and most of their current imports are for meat.

Warsie wrote:About the nukes thing and the FedGov, do the FSU have nukes? I mean, it is logical that they would seize federal properties on their states.

Aircraft launched only.

January 20, 2048
Bihar, India


She was a Gyps indicus, an Indian vulture. Her species had nearly gone extinct only a few decades before. Her grandparents had been released from a zoo when the human world began to collapse, a desperate attempt by the zookeepers for the survival of the birds. It had been a very bad time for most creatures. The monsoons were failing more and more frequently. The zookeepers had died.

Her grandparents had waxed greatly.

The vulture colony was constructed in the ruins of what had been a mostly Hindu farming village. Her nest, where she sometimes laid more than one clutch a year, was built on top of what had been a government building. It was the tallest of the ruins, and in her avian way, she was quite proud of the position. Her last clutch had already left the nest, but there would be another soon.

She stretched her wings as she awoke to the warm winter day. It was clear and dry, perfect weather. Some vultures were already riding thermals into the sky, and she soon joined them in a lazy spiral upwards. As they rose, they searched for the sign that always meant good eating.

There, in the distance. A column of thick smoke, rising into the sky. No hurry. Carrion did not run away, and there was always plenty for all the scavengers.

Neither she nor the other vultures knew about recent human history, nor did they care about why the smoke always marked food. They would not have understood the concept of religious warfare anyway. Hunger they understood, deep within themselves, and if hungry they would instinctively fight over scraps in a desperate attempt for survival. It would be beyond them to comprehend the earthquake-damaged Farakka Barrage on the Ganges, and how the Indian army blew it out during a cyclone to flood out Bangladesh to keep the refugees from overrunning their country, though it amounted to the same thing on a much larger scale.

The vultures also would not have understood the subsequent three hour war between India and Pakistan that left most of the population of the latter dead or dying. The dead of Bangladesh and Pakistan were mostly Muslims, of course, and nearly 300 million of them still lived in India. They were vastly outnumbered and would receive no reinforcements, but they still had vast numbers, and everyone was hungry.

She soared towards the pillar of smoke, joining the line of scavengers. They passed over a dry riverbed. The monsoons had not entirely failed the previous summer, but the glaciers had all melted away, and precious water for drinking, for farming, was scarce. Maybe that had been the reason for the attempted raid. The vultures circled the battlefield.

The Muslims were losing, slowly but steadily being wiped out. They were killing just as many, on average, as they were losing, but the math was against them. The raiding party had been overwhelmed with sheer numbers and annihilated; neither side took prisoners. The Indian army dead, though, were given the dignity of a funeral pyre by their surviving comrades consisting of whatever was lying around and whatever the soldiers couldn’t carry off with them. That was the source of the smoke here. Sometimes it was a village, instead. It was all the same to the vultures.

She made a few passes, checking the area before descending. Experience had taught her to be wary if any humans were in the area. Even the small ones, not fully grown, could be dangerous if they attacked. But today, there were only a few stray dogs and other carrion birds, so she descended.

It was a good time to be a vulture.

And that was Amy's official addition to the story, with my full permission.

Mayabird wrote:It would be beyond them to comprehend the earthquake-damaged Farakka Barrage on the Ganges, and how the Indian army blew it out during a cyclone to flood out Bangladesh to keep the refugees from overrunning their country, though it amounted to the same thing on a much larger scale.

This is horrible, I read the passage and immediately started laughing. I keep picturing the staff meeting that lead to that, "How about we blow the dam during a cyclone and drown the whole country?" It sounds like something a Bond villain would come up with.

The vultures also would not have understood the subsequent three hour war between India and Pakistan that left most of the population of the latter dead or dying.

That was a longer war than I would expect. It really sucks to be Pakistan, guys can't get a break. They try to get nukes to even out the strategic parity, and the Indians just go ahead and get twice as many.

Adrian Laguna wrote: That was a longer war than I would expect. It really sucks to be Pakistan, guys can't get a break. They try to get nukes to even out the strategic parity, and the Indians just go ahead and get twice as many.

The proliferation of ABM meant that it was probably fought primarily by dispersed attack squadrons with short-range nuclear attack missiles.

Adrian Laguna wrote:

Mayabird wrote:It would be beyond them to comprehend the earthquake-damaged Farakka Barrage on the Ganges, and how the Indian army blew it out during a cyclone to flood out Bangladesh to keep the refugees from overrunning their country, though it amounted to the same thing on a much larger scale.

This is horrible, I read the passage and immediately started laughing. I keep picturing the staff meeting that lead to that, "How about we blow the dam during a cyclone and drown the whole country?" It sounds like something a Bond villain would come up with.

What? Think about it. They're having famines in India and everywhere else. Bangladesh is already being swamped by rising sea levels, and now a massive cyclone is bearing down on the country. What crops there were will be destroyed by the cyclone and the surge, and those few hundred million people will go fleeing anywhere for survival. India can't keep its own population fed, much less another couple hundred million refugees swarming over the border and eating whatever they come across. The generals probably had a rush meeting once they found out the cyclone was going to hit and looked at their options and decided that genocide was basically their only hope of survival. Blowing up the dam would be faster than lining up the army at the border and shooting everyone, too.

Things were THAT bad for them to even consider it.

Just for the official record there have been 2 billion excess deaths in 2033 - 2048 in this universe due to disease, famine, and war out of an initial population of about 8 billion, so that the world population in 2048 is (since it's still trying to grow) now around 6.5 billion.

Adrian Laguna wrote: This is horrible, I read the passage and immediately started laughing. I keep picturing the staff meeting that lead to that, "How about we blow the dam during a cyclone and drown the whole country?" It sounds like something a Bond villain would come up with.

Blowing up dams is a time honoured tradition, Adrian.

On a more serious note, I liked how the narrative here was constructed. Using an actual factual vulture as the central character is both unusual and clever, given the tone of things.

Would you actually start to see some successful states emerge over the decades from the brutal chaos in Africa by this time? By successful, I mean "strong enough to massacre any of the starving hordes threatening to swarm over valuable farming lands and other resouces so that the state can hold itself together". I think of it almost as massive selection pressure for states that can actually hold onto the agricultural land.

I wonder, with all this war going on all over the place, have mercenary armies made a comeback? I'd wager not, mercenaries you have to pay, conscripts you only have to feed, but I still wonder.

Mayabird wrote:Things were THAT bad for them to even consider it.

I know, the problem is that I'm finding the whole thing incredibly amusing.

So here is my promised segment:

December 12th 2047
Hanover, Maryland, FedGov
Military District of Columbia


Robert King was freezing. Well not literally because there were plenty of folk who were freezing, hell freezing to death at this moment all throughout the whole region. One certainly didn’t want to dwell too long on the subject since it didn’t bear thinking about. Moreover Robert’s whole job was to make sure supplies could get where they were going so others wouldn’t freeze to death.

All that didn’t take away the wind which was nice and brisk on a clear Maryland day. If he stopped long enough it would certainly be possible to think back to running around the woods behind his parent’s house on a day like today and creating miniature forts with fallen logs to play a game of Americans versus Terrorists. He almost longed for those days because certainly 50 years earlier he wouldn’t have been nearly as tired from all the work he was doing now.

The log forts had been the beginning and a lifelong love of either electronics or other toys had constantly led him in the direction of engineering. He was recruited by a couple top programs around the country and was studying for a degree in civil engineering at home in College Park when things changed. His father died and he had no money left to keep going to school. The same day a Marine recruiter mentioned that dependents (including his largely house bound mother) would be covered by military benefits. Over the course of the next two and a half decades he ran a brilliant career eventually rising to Chief Warrant Officer – 5 for Engineer Equipment Operations. Then he came home. Along the way he got himself a wife, three kids, a house, lost another parent, lost one sister, and lost more than a dozen friends dead in combat.

Now here he was on another stretch of the Capitol Subdivision or, as it was now under FedGov direct ownership, Washington-Baltimore Subdivision 2. He was here to supervise yet another rebuilding effort like he had been doing every winter and summer for the last five years, ever since the Virginians had taken Fredrick and began pummeling the rail lines into Washington in the FedGov state of Columbia. Ever since the surrounding Virginia suburbs had counter seceded and been hammered into a new province along with what used to be the District of Columbia the Virginians had been trying to cut the city off and take it by siege. Five years ago they had successfully crossed the Potomac and then run smack into a wall of resistance as virtually ever troop who could be handed a rifle (and most of whom weren’t even given that much) were thrown into the gap to save Baltimore and Washington.

With its powers the new government had yanked Robert back from retirement to oversee the massive combat construction work and reconstruction work necessary to maintain the fighting forces in the area. No one there cared that he had never held commissioned rank, what mattered was that he was alive and had the knowledge so the rest was academic. At first he had every type of heavy tractor and earthmoving gear a person could ask for and certainly his defensive line along the Liberty reservoir was a marvel of 21st century know-how applied to a crap load of dirt and an awful lot of concrete. Nowadays the near total absence of fuel meant the only equipment he could get supplies to run were the cranes necessary to actually lift the supports for the catenary.

That was the job now, keep the rail lines running so that Washington and Alexandria don’t starve. With the Eastern Shore still producing and still the best source of chicken this side of the Appalachians the difficulty was with getting the food into the cities. Certainly they were luckier than most, as Maryland was one of few states where Nuclear Power never quite died out so there was power to run the rails and heat homes…so long as you didn’t mind having your neighborhood shelled at least once a year.

“Watch the goddamn rail crew Wilson,” he had to yell to be heard since without radios they were using just hand signals and a jury-rigged system of basically tin can phones. “That beam is swaying too much in the breeze and I do not need another goddamn letter from the District Commandant bitching that I’m killing too many of the laborers off.”

While saying this King signaled down to the guide and motioned for a slow descent without any more lateral. Even as he did so the operator, Wilson, cut back his turn smoothly enough and the ground crew were able to finally stop the beam from swaying, thankfully without coming close to any member of the rail team who kept on working as if they hadn’t had a 5 ton piece of metal hanging over their heads about to crash down.

That crew proceeded in its task with almost mind numbing clockwork. A crew of ten were constantly grabbing new rails and laying them out onto the ties. Immediately a crew of six began bolting the new rail onto the old segment, welding being too complex for the vast majority of the available workforce. In the meantime another crew of twelve began wrenching the clips to link the rail to the ties. With practiced speed they moved down the line and behind them another two dozen began bringing up wheelbarrow loads of ballast to fill in between the tracks and ties. All told it took something like fifteen minutes from the moment the rail hit the ties.

In the meantime Robert’s linesmen were putting up yet another line tower to support another stretch of catenary. Getting the beam in place and buckled down was only the first step in getting the wires hung, tested, and connected to the seven miles of track and overhead they had put down the last four weeks going back as far as the newly reformed wye at Relay. All told King would have hoped for better.

The problem wasn’t manpower as the conscript labor battalions were damned good at moving a shit load of rocks to reform the track bed. It wasn’t the crews hanging the catenary, even if Wilson was still touchy with the crane. It also wasn’t the maintenance, for which, again, there were conscript laborers to literally jack the rails back into place and reset the rail bed. The problem was his survey and tie-laying crews, as it would invariably be, actually getting the damn ties and bed level enough to lay the rails and get to work. The crew of forty was usually shuttled between both track projects (the other being Washington-Baltimore Subdivision 1 or the old Northeast Corridor) to actually lay the rail while the surveyors and laborers struggled to keep moving.

It was all in Robert King’s hands as it had been for the last 5 years and probably would be for the next 5 if the way things were going continued.

His superiors were idiots at best and no matter that he now technically held the rank of Brigadier General in the Federal Army Corps of Engineers his voice went unheard in every strategy meeting since the beginning of the fighting. Nobody wanted to hear about his thoughts for troop movements or supply they just wanted him to fix the damn railroads and build them fortifications. If he didn’t like it they could always strip his commission and send him amongst the labor gangs as a shift supervisor working his 56 year old back until it gave out alongside the men he had to work half to death on half rations as it was.

At least he wasn’t dead, but freezing cold with half the family knocking on death’s door wasn’t that much better.

“That beam is swaying too much in the breeze and I do not need another goddamn letter from the District Commandant bitching that I’m killing too many of the laborers off.”

Ah, the spirit of the Wild West lives on .
Great pair of chapters, Maya, Wilken .

Mayabird's use of a birds eye view of the battle was a nice touch.

Although I am curious about one thing. Of all the places in India how would someplace as unlikely as Bihar be besieged by a large muslim attacking force ? Where did such a large number of attackers come from ?

Sarevok wrote:Mayabird's use of a birds eye view of the battle was a nice touch. 8)

Although I am curious about one thing. Of all the places in India how would someplace as unlikely as Bihar be besieged by a large muslim attacking force ? Where did such a large number of attackers come from ?

Not everyone in Bangladesh died, and they were probably trying to fight their way through to other Muslim groups.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote: Aircraft launched only.

Didn't most of the Air Force also side with the FSU, correct? Also, aren't there nuclear missiles and ICBMs in FSU territory?

Also, I just wondered. Why not send the people who killed the Jew to the front lines instead of execution? Armies in the past have been made heavily of criminals; and I don't think the FedGov really cares given its' apparent past actions.

Also, you portray France is fascist, is that a joke and a snipe at Nicholas Sarkozy's right-wing policies? How is Germany doing?

And about the status of blacks in the FSU, you mention that several thousand of them were killed after the rebellion in Louisville. Are the FSU states racist, or are they okay and they made significant claims towards fixing the problem and there is little racism in the FSU.

And for the anti-semitism by African-Americans, how bad is it? Is it pogrom-level and pogrom-style; heavy due to African-Americans still angry at the Jews' role in their enslavement (riled up by people like Farrakan maybe or his successor?) Or a few isolated incidents.

Also, would many Afro-Americans side with the FSU given the religious nature of many Blacks in the USA, especially considering how Black America tends to stand on homosexuality and other religious issues; like the caucasian evangelicals (very similar). So would there be an increasing amount of Black Conservatives in the future as more Afro-Americans become middle class in this future, or they stop the old racial hate?

Warsie wrote: Didn't most of the Air Force also side with the FSU, correct? Also, aren't there nuclear missiles and ICBMs in FSU territory?

I doubt we'd have ICBMs in service by 2040, since they'd be useless, but to be safe my plans for the war involved a rush seizure by the Minnesota Guard of the fields in North Dakota anyway.

Also, I just wondered. Why not send the people who killed the Jew to the front lines instead of execution? Armies in the past have been made heavily of criminals; and I don't think the FedGov really cares given its' apparent past actions.

Because an example needed to be made of them to deter others in the security forces from doing the same. They took the problem seriously, one of the few compliments I'd give to their government.

Also, you portray France is fascist, is that a joke and a snipe at Nicholas Sarkozy's right-wing policies? How is Germany doing?

Uh, no, my only problem with Sarkozy is is liberalization of the French economy; on most issues I"m actually quite conservative myself. I meant for the Front Nataional to be literally controlling the country. Since Germany and Italy gave up their nuclear reactors, their power generation is all located in French territory, which means that the French completely control Germany and Italy as subject states (as well as the low countries, but for sea level rise reasons). That, along with occupied Britain, forms the territorial extant of Fascist France.

And about the status of blacks in the FSU, you mention that several thousand of them were killed after the rebellion in Louisville. Are the FSU states racist, or are they okay and they made significant claims towards fixing the problem and there is little racism in the FSU.

You cannot typify the FSU based on the actions of any single state. Some are under leaders so charismatic they might as well be dictators, and/or parties completely insane; others remain democratic. The FSU is an alliance of states fighting for independence under looser terms than the Articles of Confederacy..

And for the anti-semitism by African-Americans, how bad is it? Is it pogrom-level and pogrom-style; heavy due to African-Americans still angry at the Jews' role in their enslavement (riled up by people like Farrakan maybe or his successor?) Or a few isolated incidents.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. A large number of the security personnel in large FedGov cities are actually former gang personnel, because the ideologues in the FedGov were dumb enough to believe them when their gang leaders insisted they had always been black power fighters from the start, and started treating them like respectable politicians. It's not a universal problem of the African American community but rather the fact that the gang bangers are in charge.

Also, would many Afro-Americans side with the FSU given the religious nature of many Blacks in the USA, especially considering how Black America tends to stand on homosexuality and other religious issues; like the caucasian evangelicals (very similar). So would there be an increasing amount of Black Conservatives in the future as more Afro-Americans become middle class in this future, or they stop the old racial hate?

In some states which don't openly preach a neo-confederate gospel there may be sizeable support for that state government--and also hostility to the idea of the FSU. The problem is that if they don't hang together, they'll certainly hang separately.

I thought the Muslims in Bangladesh would be more likely to march in Myanmar. After all, there's a lot of Muslims in the coastal areas there.

I doubt we'd have ICBMs in service by 2040, since they'd be useless,

k

but to be safe my plans for the war involved a rush seizure by the Minnesota Guard of the fields in North Dakota anyway.

the Minnesota Guard is loyalist, or FSU-allied?

Because an example needed to be made of them to deter others in the security forces from doing the same. They took the problem seriously, one of the few compliments I'd give to their government.

given the heavy losses, comparable to the USSR in WW2, wouldn't being posted to the front be equal to a death sentence? Penal batallions?

Uh, no, my only problem with Sarkozy is is liberalization of the French economy; on most issues I"m actually quite conservative myself.

okay.

I meant for the Front Nataional to be literally controlling the country.

how did fascism rise in France, of all places? Especially given hwo France is better-off? How would the French people accept that?

Since Germany and Italy gave up their nuclear reactors, their power generation is all located in French territory, which means that the French completely control Germany and Italy as subject states (as well as the low countries, but for sea level rise reasons). That, along with occupied Britain, forms the territorial extant of Fascist France.

k

You cannot typify the FSU based on the actions of any single state. Some are under leaders so charismatic they might as well be dictators, and/or parties completely insane; others remain democratic. The FSU is an alliance of states fighting for independence under looser terms than the Articles of Confederacy..

okay. How could they divide so loosely than? From a centralized government; a close Federation to that in how many years? Was the Oil Shocks strong enough to make people go more 'inward'? That people would stop identifying primarily as 'Americans' and back to their various states? Can you also explain that?

Were there several pulls for independence or more decentralization (grassroots; or by the legislature) before the second US Civil War; making the secession easier?

What is the Catholic Social Party composed of; given how many US catholics are "liberal" on homosexuality?

I also forgot, how would Southern Illinois do; would it voluntarily fight with the FSU; given Southern Illinis is much different than northern illinois and more "conservative" (it attempted to secede, or some rioting there during the US Civil War; would that be repeated? Illinois divided into two?

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. A large number of the security personnel in large FedGov cities are actually former gang personnel, because the ideologues in the FedGov were dumb enough to believe them when their gang leaders insisted they had always been black power fighters from the start, and started treating them like respectable politicians. It's not a universal problem of the African American community but rather the fact that the gang bangers are in charge.

Hmm. The Gang Leaders probably relied on their past actions on how the Black Panthers ended up becoming gangs after COINTELPRO, the Blackstone Rangers, the original Crips, etc. That, and the unification of gangs into a cease-fire before the Rodney King trial and subsequent uprising, supported by many said gangs. Many of said gangs' ideologies tended toward Black Power, so it's likely they did that (or said gangs continued services to the community).

In some states which don't openly preach a neo-confederate gospel there may be sizeable support for that state government--and also hostility to the idea of the FSU.

okay. Even for the neo-confederate governments, would they be per se racist? Were ANY FSU members deliberately racist, or displaying "southern pride" (IIRC many Blacks have worn Confederate regalia and consider it regionalism or rebellion; the same rebellion that made the US)

And, hostility to the idea of the FSU? For the hostiles, are they loyalists, black separitists, black nationalists, etc? Did they not want any connection to the FSU?

The problem is that if they don't hang together, they'll certainly hang separately.

lol considering that's probably literally.

Also, did you use the term 'Walker Regime' intentionally? That's a good referene to the Walker: Texas Ranger show.

And the defection of the military: Did the majority of forces side with the FSU either due to regionalism (many of the troops living in FSU territory); due to both having 'conservative' ideologies like a majority in the military, or both?

Was there a Cascadia movement in the Pacific Northwest, and that was quashed or the FedGov managed to keep them in line by tending to their demands? Same for the California Republic, how was that kept in line? And we knoe the Mormons were quashed; did they form a Republci of Deseret before their smashing?

And what is the status of the national guards of the loyalist states? Did said defecting unite of the former Nat'l Army end up joining each state they once lived at, were all the troops divided equally, etc.

And we know the God's Will is fundamentalist; but can you tell me more of them?

Sorry for this long post

Warsie wrote:okay. How could they divide so loosely than? From a centralized government; a close Federation to that in how many years? Was the Oil Shocks strong enough to make people go more 'inward'? That people would stop identifying primarily as 'Americans' and back to their various states? Can you also explain that?

Were there several pulls for independence or more decentralization (grassroots; or by the legislature) before the second US Civil War; making the secession easier?

What is the Catholic Social Party composed of; given how many US catholics are "liberal" on homosexuality?

I also forgot, how would Southern Illinois do; would it voluntarily fight with the FSU; given Southern Illinis is much different than northern illinois and more "conservative" (it attempted to secede, or some rioting there during the US Civil War; would that be repeated? Illinois divided into two?

I can answer some of this as some of the backgroun that I sent to get cleared for my segment relates. Also some of it is covered by Marina's posts earlier in the thread. For starters the FSU was a loose organization mostly devoted to the idea that "we can't let the North win again" but was centered on much more of a states rights platform. As Peak Oil came about and Canada and the US merged (with the later surrendering an awful lot of power in the process) draconian central government measures started coming into force and a goodly portion of the southern states didn't like the over-regulation. In turn this led to multiple states taking up statements that the US government had abandoned the constitutional promise to provide each state with a republican form of government and had thus voided the Constitutional requirements of unity.

In turn the states which seceeded banded together mostly because the FedGov had the money and prestige of the old US and Canadian governments so international legitimacy was rather lacking at first. However, as is currently the case, the US military teneded ever more southern and ever more conservative. In turn this meant that with most bases already in the south and most members already inclined to support the states in the viewpoint that FedGov had voided the US constiution they immediately gained enough fighting power to be relevant but that firepower was still dispersed amongst the states so the FSU serves essentially as almost a NATO rather than an actual government. It is a mean of negotiating joint military action for joint self-defense.

Part of the currently unpublished background for my subsegment (which should come up later and has come up in regards to Kentucky taking Virginians prisoner) deals with how the siege of Washington has been held on and off mostly because Virginia still can't get the rest of the FSU to committ to totally reducing the city and thus has mostly been making due with their own local forces.

As to Illinois I'm pretty certian it has been mentioned that God's Will aprty controls the sourthern half of the state (along with the southern portions of Ohio and Indiana) so it is divided.

And what is the status of the national guards of the loyalist states? Did said defecting unite of the former Nat'l Army end up joining each state they once lived at, were all the troops divided equally, etc.

Speaking only for my sub-story the Maryland ANG stayed loyal to FedGov hwoever it was essentially wiped out in 2043/4 when the Virginia National Guard was able to mount a full air defense system tied to the Lake Ana Nuclear Power Plant.

Our internal maps seem to be different. I've got pretty much all of Ohio locked up in the FedGov as a bread basket, kind of with Cincinnati, Dayton, and Toledo being heavily garrisonned and forming a "line" with the FSU on the other side, along with the northern most tip of Kentucky along the Ohio River being tenuously held. I assumed Detroit, a bit further north, was a loyal city as well.

Of course, my segment and the one I have pending approval from Marina are deliberately not dated.

Thanks, everyone, for all your kind words. Hopefully this weekend I'll be able to finish my second story.

Pelranius wrote:I thought the Muslims in Bangladesh would be more likely to march in Myanmar. After all, there's a lot of Muslims in the coastal areas there.

Probably a lot did. The survivors that were closer to that border, anyway.

Sarevok: I picked Bihar because it has a pretty sizable Muslim population of its own, plus was the birthplace of two religions (Buddhism and Jainism) and important to the Hindus and Sikhs, so the religious warfare there is either quite ironic or strangely appropriate.

...sorry about drowning your country, man.

Sarevok: I picked Bihar because it has a pretty sizable Muslim population of its own, plus was the birthplace of two religions (Buddhism and Jainism) and important to the Hindus and Sikhs, so the religious warfare there is either quite ironic or strangely appropriate.

Well your story is quite plausible. There were fighting between Biharis and Bengalis in East Pakistan during 1971 war. Bengalis also deluded india in millions as refugees. However that was when India was an ally. I don't think the Indian border police, the BSF would be kind anymore. :d

Your story is correct though I would change Bihar to West Bengal if it were me. The reason is Bihar is far too hostile for Bengali insurgents. West Bengal has plenty of sympathisers and enemies clustered in one place. Perfect for infiltrators. Speaking of infiltration that raises another point. How would a large number slip past Indian defenses ? It would likely be a more terrorist type activity than a zerg rush.

...sorry about drowning your country, man.

Eh I had given up hope in this land a long time ago. Like Shroom in Philipines getting out ASAP is a priority.

Gil Hamilton wrote:Our internal maps seem to be different. I've got pretty much all of Ohio locked up in the FedGov as a bread basket, kind of with Cincinnati, Dayton, and Toledo being heavily garrisonned and forming a "line" with the FSU on the other side, along with the northern most tip of Kentucky along the Ohio River being tenuously held. I assumed Detroit, a bit further north, was a loyal city as well.

Of course, my segment and the one I have pending approval from Marina are deliberately not dated.

I've got the FedGov / FSU (kentucky in paticular) holding a line roughly from Indianapolis to Cincinnatti to Columbus then to Parkersburg (and thence on to Morgantown and into Maryland). This would mean control of the Ohio from Parkersburg north and then really iffy control by either side onwards to Cincinnatti (FSU meaning God's Will party in control but not really ocntesting passage). Anyway that is the situation I had in my background materials but I expect that any FedGov offensive designed to finally relieve St Louis (which should still be under seige IIRC) would probably try to gain total control of the Ohio as a precursor.

So anyway FedGov holding the entire Ohio R at least as far as Cinncy certianly makes sense by spring '48. Obviously if i'm just completely off base then I'm off base and many apologies to Marina since this is her playpen that I just got the chance to romp around in.

Yeah, me as well. I'm starting a serial following the characters I introduced in my first entry. I'm not actually all THAT concerned about dates and fine details of the setting. Where, exactly, the borders isn't terrifically important to the lives of my characters, though my plot I'm working on will involve it.