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NecronLord wrote:

Darmalus wrote:Looks like Abigor's only hope is to fall on his knees the moment he steps across the Hellmouth and surrender, hoping for the best.

Here's hoping they're not going to walk into a literal minefield.

Ouch! I hadn't thought of that. But that is unlikely. I'm under the impression that we plan on using it to move large forces across ourselves, so it will need to be at least partially unobstructed.

I just got this mental image of Abigor hanging a white sheet off of his trident, sticking it across the Hellmouth and waving it madly before walking across.

I doubt the demons have that tradition. I'd imagine that Yahweh's armies use white flags.

Abrigor, you better do the smart thing, mang!

Fuck Satan.

Bye bye, Abigor, nice to have known you.
An excellent chapter, Stu. Satan still doesn't seem to get that this time he may have bitten off more than he can chew. If he leaves the reinvasion too long then humanity will have been able to concentrate overwhelming resources. 5 million demons is not going to be enough to overcome the massed resources of the major world powers, IMVHO.

Btw, you've got mail.

Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

I predict the defection of Abigor.

So basically Abigor has been told that he's to march into a death trap with all of his friends and family, after having seen just how bad it is?

Yeah, pretty much walking out there and falling to their knees before the humans grovelling for mercy is the only chance they have at survival, although I'm sure they probably feel that their long term prospects aren't that great. Still, since they fear that they face oblivion and that being tortured for all eternity is better than that, a couple extra days of existence would seem nice to them.

And unless Satan decides to drop that 5 million baldrick army all across the globe, I believe that that sort of thing would paint a rather largish target for a nuclear attack, especially if the humans know that these guys are the elite troops and utterly annihilating them would tremendously damage Hell's capacity to train up their militias.

If Satan does just march the poor bastards out the Hellmouth, then the slaughter after that will convince him that he's in over his head and to stop acting like he has for thousands of years. Too bad he'll have already lost something like an eighth of his forces by then.

I wonder if it occured to Asmodeus that perhaps the smart thing to do in this instance would be to put the veteran in charge.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

I predict the defection of Abigor.

How quickly is this new demon army going to be sent through the Hellmouth? From what Satan has said, at least from my interpretation, is that he wants the reservists trained first and there is 'no rush'. If he takes too long then Humanity will have had plenty time to build up its conventional defences in the region.
I can imagine that the Americans may have added a few extra divisions to the force, that the British have sent the rest of 1st (UK) Armoured Division and also possibly 3rd (UK) Division (depending on how the training of 2nd, 4th, 5th and 6th is coming along) and the Russians and possibly French and German contingents may have arrived, never mind a big Chinese one.

We might not need nukes if we assembled a several million strong military force.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:snip

I predict the defection of Abigor.

Only way he will survive is surrender, assuming he and his don't get killed the moment they step over the hell mouth... or he forms a resistance movement in Hell against Satan. Satan, unless he personally learns a vivid lesson in human capabilities, may find his throne on dubious foundations methinks.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

I just realized this too when I saw the numbers given -- considering the Predator strike that took out the parade reviewers when Abigor was marching out, though, is some sort of preemptive strike through the Hellmouth to disrupt/stall for time the only chance that MNF-I without nukes? I have never heard of a human conflict with this many in one (tactical) engagement, although maybe strategic.

Hell definitely has a mobility advantage in terms of "dimension-dropping" personnel; arming the population is mitigation at best, as it doesn't actually stop Hell from committing these strikes. Either way, Hell has a bit of a win/maybe situation... either Hell is still able to fuck with the civilians (it gets worse with en masse attacks), or Hell overruns MNF-I if nukes aren't used.

One of the survivors wrote:Follow him. Follow him till the end of your story.

Up until this point, I would have said FUCK YEAH... now, not so much, especially as I'm guessing that even Asmodeus wasn't immediately ready to abandon Abigor to die (“But Sire. What about Abigor?”).

I'd love to see the following:
1. Abigor's mates/kidlings... no resistance move though, thanks.
2. The training of the three commanders' (Asmodeus, Beezlebub, and Dagon) armies, and I suppose perspectives from their underlings/rank and file, considering that now Abigor's failure is known, and perhaps the rumor mill flies...

(Yes, I'm definitely enjoying reading the demons' parts far more than the humans' parts.)

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

Or chemical weapons.

Also, I wonder if Abigor has the means to make some kind of transmission to people on Earth, before having to lead this poor unfortunate demon horde out into the killing fields.

I wonder if any of the grieving-widow-demons are going to want to fight... Humm.

NecronLord wrote:I wonder if any of the grieving-widow-demons are going to want to fight... Humm.

That's what I'm looking for here.

Who's words were those, the ones that talked to Abrigor in his head?

“Would that we could.” The words were not spoken but formed in Abigor’s mind. It wasn’t Satan speaking but he didn’t know who it was. “Our mages have been trying with all the energy they can command. It is no use. We cannot close it. It may decay on its own, in time, but we cannot close it. It is as much a fixture now as the very walls of Dis itself.”

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Who's words were those, the ones that talked to Abrigor in his head?

“Would that we could.” The words were not spoken but formed in Abigor’s mind. It wasn’t Satan speaking but he didn’t know who it was. “Our mages have been trying with all the energy they can command. It is no use. We cannot close it. It may decay on its own, in time, but we cannot close it. It is as much a fixture now as the very walls of Dis itself.”

It reads like the words come from Memnon.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

I predict the defection of Abigor.

Thermopylae, anyone? As Abigor said, the demons would simply be slaughtered until they blocked the portal with their corpses.

The portal is a deathtrap, and there's no mountain goat trail leading around it, either.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Asmodeus, Beelzebub, and DAGON? We're fuxored in the short term. Short of tactical nukes, there's no way we can hold the portal against those kinds of numbers. The positions would be overrun.

I predict the defection of Abigor.

Thermopylae, anyone? As Abigor said, the demons would simply be slaughtered until they blocked the portal with their corpses.

The portal is a deathtrap, and there's no mountain goat trail leading around it, either.

I get all sorts of bad images in my head now that you have mentioned that. General Patreaus in leather speedo's yelling "Humans! Prepare for Glory!" is not an image I needed.

Considering that in the comic Leonidas was simply naked, I prefer the aforementioned image.

Can't be worse than my mental image of Petraeus cosplaying as Raoh....

I wonder how the Demons (and Angels) use human souls for energy. The demons torture humans and have them heal and...??? The humans excrete "soul radiation" that bleeds off into the environment of Hell? How do the Demons collect this? Do they have ancient and arcane machines that spiral into the sky like lightning rods to collect these soul harmonic energies? Great techno-confabulations of untellable age, burrowed deep within the sulfurous sands of Hell to absorb the seeping spirits of misery and human lamentation?

Academia Nut wrote:And unless Satan decides to drop that 5 million baldrick army all across the globe, I believe that that sort of thing would paint a rather largish target for a nuclear attack, especially if the humans know that these guys are the elite troops and utterly annihilating them would tremendously damage Hell's capacity to train up their militias.

If Satan does just march the poor bastards out the Hellmouth, then the slaughter after that will convince him that he's in over his head and to stop acting like he has for thousands of years. Too bad he'll have already lost something like an eighth of his forces by then.

It would have really been rather unrealistic to expect Satan and the rest of the Hellilsh forces to adapt so quickly that they throw away tens of thousands of years of tactics and traditions because of one disastrous battle.

Look at how long it took human forces to adapt to the invention of the machine gun. How many millions were thrown into the meat grinder in WW1, before we learned? And we're better at adapting than the Hellish forces, judging by their hidebound command and social structure.

And don't tell me that Satan is so "clever" that he would instantly see all of this. He's never done anything in the literature to indicate that he's so brilliant. His "cleverness" lies entirely in being able to lie to people, and taking Jesus up to a mountaintop and offering him power isn't exactly such an innovative idea that it merits some kind of accolades for genius.

Frankly, I'd just only wait until a few Russian armoured corps with NBC gear show up and nuclear shells for their howitzers (they should be there in a few weeks), and then the multinational force can invade Hell. We can always fall back to the Hellmouth to defend it--and we should build fortifications around it a thousand times more dense than the Hindenburg Line--if the invasion fails, but it seems very worthwhile to keep the Baldricks off balance by doing the unthinkable, invading Hell itself with fast moving armoured columns.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:Frankly, I'd just only wait until a few Russian armoured corps with NBC gear show up and nuclear shells for their howitzers (they should be there in a few weeks), and then the multinational force can invade Hell. We can always fall back to the Hellmouth to defend it--and we should build fortifications around it a thousand times more dense than the Hindenburg Line--if the invasion fails, but it seems very worthwhile to keep the Baldricks off balance by doing the unthinkable, invading Hell itself with fast moving armoured columns.

Does Russia still HAVE nuclear artillery shells?

CaptainChewbacca wrote:

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:Frankly, I'd just only wait until a few Russian armoured corps with NBC gear show up and nuclear shells for their howitzers (they should be there in a few weeks), and then the multinational force can invade Hell. We can always fall back to the Hellmouth to defend it--and we should build fortifications around it a thousand times more dense than the Hindenburg Line--if the invasion fails, but it seems very worthwhile to keep the Baldricks off balance by doing the unthinkable, invading Hell itself with fast moving armoured columns.

Does Russia still HAVE nuclear artillery shells?

Russia committed to eliminate its battlefield tactical weapons in 2002. Even if that has actually taken place, they produce more than enough nuclear material and probably have plenty of spare casings laying around. Not many, at first, but they would certainly be able to get nuclear shells to their advance forces in the numbers of a couple dozen, at least, in very short order.

Actually, I would be interested to see what the baldrick reaction to troops wearing NBC gear would be. One can only imagine their horror if the air itself becomes a choking miasma of death that they have never before imagined and suddenly these things start walking out of the killer fog, completely inured to its effects and looking bizarre and unnatural in their gas masks, and dispatching death to anything still kicking. The psychological damage to any survivors and the stories they tell would be interesting.

Of course, the blind bum fucking panic when an entire army vanishes under a nuclear fireball would be even worse for the baldricks I would think. Although a combined attack with nuclear bombardment followed by the deployment of chemical weapons would be pretty scarring to the bastards as well. Follow that up with missiles strikes into Dis and the baldricks would probably finally consider humans equals... unless of course they decide to launch a strike on Heaven for treachery because Heaven are the only guys who could have done/taught the humans such things.

You don't want to nuke hell and annihilate human souls.

I wonder, human forces would need incredible air-lift for such an endeavor. Would Ukraine be up to the task of producing more of those giant Antonovs?

Hell opened that portal. That's the difference here...Abigor isn't an idiot, and he knows he's been ordered to suicide-charge. BUT...he's got resources still. If he can open another portal to somewhere nearby, he can attack without going through the killing field. If he can, depending on the mechanics, a mass assault through multiple smaller portals around and on the ridge would be optimal. He's been ordered to take the ridge, and Satan meant that to mean a suicide-charge through the Hellmouth. Doesn't mean Abigor will read it that way, he's a smart guy.