Re: Mass Effect 3 (Spoilers)
Posted: 2012-03-13 05:25pm
The whole time Harbinger was telling us in ME2 that the reapers are our salvation, I figured it would turn out to be true. I actually hoped it would.
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Uh oh. Someone didn't pay attention to a MAJOR PLOT POINT and a few kinda important missions in Mass Effect 2. Oh man.Anacronian wrote:Hey dimwit what about you fucking play the game and understand what the fuck is going on, Reapers can not shut down any relay without the fucking citadel otherwise don't you think they would have shut down the Charon relay when they came for Earth.. Jesus Havok i know this is a site meant to make "mockery of stupid people" but do you have to jump to the front of the line on every possible opportunity?Havok wrote:My guess is dumb? Not knowing that the Reapers can shut down the relays to everyone but themselves is pretty dumb.
The council got control of opening and closing the ward arms and that's all, And you're entire argument is refuted by the fact that the reapers swoop in and take the citadel later in no time.[/quote] Yeah, there was no fleet there to protect the Citadel for one, and two the Citadel was almost taken by a lone Reaper, Sovereign, (with a little Geth help) if it hadn't been for Act of Sheppard.The Reapers didn't take the Citadel because the Council got control of it as others have already stated.
Holy fucking shit... you don't pay attention to the game OR what people post.This is utterly bullshit - you have no way of guessing the reapers motives to not taking the citadel, Hell you don't even know what is the exact nature of the crucible-catalyst-reaper relationship.Which brings up a point FOR the Reapers knowing about the AAI and not wanting to endanger it as to why they left the Citadel alone and only made a move on it when the AAI was in direct danger from the Crucible plan.
All you and anybody else can judge is what actually happens in the game - Fuck you don't even know if the reapers are aware of the catalysts existence, But keep making shit up it's pretty fun to read.
It would have been an actual complicated moral dilemma to put Sheppard in instead of the basic one they ended up doing. I am assuming you are referring to the dark energy plot that was completely dropped.Galvatron wrote:The whole time Harbinger was telling us in ME2 that the reapers are our salvation, I figured it would turn out to be true. I actually hoped it would.
Yep, what you were talking about.Galvatron wrote:I don't know if this has been addressed yet (or even if the following is true), but I just read that the reapers were originally intended to be explained as having been created to serve as a defense against extragalactic dark energy causing all the stars in our galaxy to die prematurely (e.g. Haestrom's star). That's why we had so many references to dark energy in ME2.
Apparently, the reapers acted as giant energy sinks which is why they loiter outside the galaxy for 50,000 years: to act as a giant shield. However, as the centuries pass, the amount of dark energy increases so they need to harvest more species to create more reapers, hence the vicious cycle.
The end of the game would have given Shepard the choice of either destroying the reapers and hoping that the advanced races of the galaxy can eventually come up with a new way to stop dark energy OR bargaining the reapers down to just harvesting humans to make a new reaper, thus sparing everyone else.
I dunno... people that pay for movies or book that they end up not liking don't get to get an ending change. This site would be a whole lot rosier if they did.Vendetta wrote:What's interesting to me is how the gaming press is pretty much all rallying around to support Bioware, and trying to put down the complaints by claiming that gamers are 'entitled' (a codeword for "spoiled crybabies")
Turns out more mainstream press isn't quite on board with that. But then I guess Forbes doesn't rely on EA's marketing dollar quite so much...
Except when they do....Havok wrote: I dunno... people that pay for movies or book that they end up not liking don't get to get an ending change. This site would be a whole lot rosier if they did.
The thing is, digital media is a different animal and endings can be changed. Did they really change the ending of Fallout?
I think this isolates the major problem I have with the ending, I don't mind if Shep sacrifices himself to make the reapers go away (Though I like teh proposed idea of it being a giant off switch for thier shields) it's jsut we don't get closure, ME 1 and ME 2 had closure, after teh big choice we got to see what happened immedetly afterwards, talk with the Council/Anderson and Udina/TIM and whatever.Galvatron wrote:I thought this was a good summation of the problem with the ending (posted on the Bioware forums)...
What is wrong with the ending to ME3
PeZook wrote:Aren't the choices you are given determined by the number of ships that you bring to the battle, too?
How many of those are after the fact and changed because of fan say so and not because of the creators already having them in place someway?Vendetta wrote:Except when they do....Havok wrote: I dunno... people that pay for movies or book that they end up not liking don't get to get an ending change. This site would be a whole lot rosier if they did.
The thing is, digital media is a different animal and endings can be changed. Did they really change the ending of Fallout?
I don't know what any of that means.And yeah, they changed the ending of Fallout 3 if you have Broken Steel installed so that Fawkes could start the purifier (previously he would just refuse for no adequate reason so that you had to be Post Apocalyptic Jesus and die for everyone's sins.)
Is it lying or just having poor writing and having no idea what good writing is?Also, in most movies you don't have producers outright lying about what the endings will entail before release. (Casey Hudson actually said in interviews that ME3's ending wouldn't just be a standard videogame ending where you pick from a couple of things and would reflect the majority of your choices up to that point, oops, it actually is and almost nothing you do in the game is reflected in it or the scenes leading up to it)
This choice would seem initially hard to justify, but you could push this as the Illusive Man's POV by allowing the Reapers to reveal the Protheans aren't dead. By being "harvested" their collective consciousness has been preserved. Not only are they alive, but they all have eternal life. Thus making this option even more attractive by throwing in an immortality for all angle.Havok wrote:
Allow the Reapers to perform their function and doom the current civilizations, yet save the galaxy and future civilizations.
Now THAT is a complicated moral dilemma.
Yes, but this is already after they also started attacking the homeworlds of the other Citadel races, so the ships originally guarding the Citadel would have been pulled off guard dutyAnacronian wrote:Yeah well it took the reapers very short time to defeat the citadel fleet, Capture the citadel and transport it to Earth in ME 3 - in fact it was done of screen while Shep were clearing out a Cerberus base, So i don't really think the reapers had any fear of the citadel fleet, Especially if they showed up in full force.
Except that's not true. In the case of the Protheans it was explictly stated back in ME2 that their DNA was too complex to Reaperize. That's why they created the Collectors instead - which are essentially Protheans who were indocrtinated into pure slavery.CaptHawkeye wrote:This choice would seem initially hard to justify, but you could push this as the Illusive Man's POV by allowing the Reapers to reveal the Protheans aren't dead. By being "harvested" their collective consciousness has been preserved. Not only are they alive, but they all have eternal life. Thus making this option even more attractive by throwing in an immortality for all angle.
No, you fucking moron. You're again lying because again, the EXACT dialogue I linked says it straight out: The machines were not created by the Protheans. They were created by another race called the Zha.Havok wrote:
NOTE THE ORDER OF EVENTS and what he says. "Very early WE" THEN "Rebeled against US", THEN "unite all organic life within OUR empire".
I do not have to prove that "Organics and synthetics can ALWAYS live together in harmony".Really... so not every example of synthetics/AI in ME hasn't involved either them trying to destroy their creators or their creators trying to destroy them? Is that your contention? REALLY? I mean, go ahead and say that...
Yeah, I mentioned this earlier. It's a more logical ending, but I still think it's a bit ham-fisted as they're trying to make us sympathize with a bunch of genocidal machines.Galvatron wrote:I don't know if this has been addressed yet (or even if the following is true), but I just read that the reapers were originally intended to be explained as having been created to serve as a defense against extragalactic dark energy causing all the stars in our galaxy to die prematurely (e.g. Haestrom's star). That's why we had so many references to dark energy in ME2.
Apparently, the reapers acted as giant energy sinks which is why they loiter outside the galaxy for 50,000 years: to act as a giant shield. However, as the centuries pass, the amount of dark energy increases so they need to harvest more species to create more reapers, hence the vicious cycle.
The end of the game would have given Shepard the choice of either destroying the reapers and hoping that the advanced races of the galaxy can eventually come up with a new way to stop dark energy OR bargaining the reapers down to just harvesting humans to make a new reaper, thus sparing everyone else.
And then they replaced Drew Karpyshyn with Mac Walter, who gave us ME3.
Take it FWIW.
Must have done something wrong somewhere as she got killed in the facility run by her fatherBlock wrote:What happened to Miranda? She survived in mine as far as I know.dragon wrote:over all greatg game though ending kind of lame as well as what happens to Miranda. What really pissed me off was the scripted fight with the assassin in the temple. I hated scripted fights that you have no chance of winning.
You need to warn her about Kai Leng and complete her loyalty quest in ME2 for her to survive. And I think you need to take the Paragon/Renegade interrupt on the dad.dragon wrote:Must have done something wrong somewhere as she got killed in the facility run by her father
edit I chose synthesis merging organics and inorganics into one was kind of interesting to see Joker with circuitry all over.
Uh, what the hell are you lying about now? It was established way back in ME1 that the Citadel did enable to shutdown of all relays. The only other way to mess up the relays is to either make a special relay (i.e. Omega) which also has suicidal defenses right past it, or to blow it up (which Shep did) - but the Reapers don't necessarily want the latter since they apparently use the relays too.Havok wrote:MAJOR PLOT POINT and a few kinda important missions in Mass Effect 2. Oh man.
Does someone else want to field this? I'm getting tired from hitting all these softballs.
Uh, right. This is literally the fourth time you ignore the fact that he said he created the Reapers as the solution to the problem, and that he frowns upon destroying them because it claims that it will cause the cycle to continue. That's not "no propensity to help the Reapers" when the ONLY solution that he has qualms about is the one that results in their destruction.And how would the Reapers do anything with the Citadel if it closed and they no longer had remote access to it? Especially considering the AAI has shown no propensity to help the Reapers.
And yet you keep foisting this bullshit notion that "The Catalyst can't control the Reapers!" on us. There is actually nothing to support your notion that the Catalyst has no control over the Reapers either. In fact, the implications that it was able to make a control mechanism for Shepard means that it does know how to control the Reapers - otherwise no "Control" scenario would be possible.This is utterly bullshit - you have no way of guessing the reapers motives to not taking the citadel, Hell you don't even know what is the exact nature of the crucible-catalyst-reaper relationship.