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If I get one IP Address for each computer, can I ditch my router and just use a switch?

Dominus Atheos wrote:If I get one IP Address for each computer, can I ditch my router and just use a switch?

If you have a DSL or cable connection, you will still need a router to do protocol conversion and session management (though this is not technically IP layer routing). If your Internet service is delivered over Ethernet then probably yes, unless your ISP has some special rules about local gateways. This is generally the case when you co-locate a bunch of servers; Internet connectivity is supplied as an Ethernet connection and you just need to supply a switch to tie together the equipment in your rackspace.

Dominus Atheos wrote:If I get one IP Address for each computer, can I ditch my router and just use a switch?

Yes, although I would prefer the safety of having a hardware firewall that a router provides over any software solution.
when I had PPPoE I had the switch plugged into the dsl modem, I know my friend who had 4 ips on a cable modem (was cheaper at the time then buying a router) he had a switch inbetween the computers and cable modem.

Lisa wrote:when I had PPPoE I had the switch plugged into the dsl modem

It's virtually impossible to get a DSL modem with a single ethernet port here. They're all either USB, or have an integrated ethernet switch (usually four port). But even if it has only one ethernet port, for consumer devices it's almost always acting as a router rather than an ethernet bridge; the encapsulation happens at the IP level and the 'modem' is set as the gateway on the local subnet. It just isn't doing NAT. To genuinely dispense with IP-level routing for WAN connections you have to be using some sort of frame relay connection.

Starglider wrote:

Dominus Atheos wrote:If I get one IP Address for each computer, can I ditch my router and just use a switch?

If you have a DSL or cable connection, you will still need a router to do protocol conversion and session management (though this is not technically IP layer routing).

I have cable internet from Comcast.

Starglider wrote:It's virtually impossible to get a DSL modem with a single ethernet port here. They're all either USB, or have an integrated ethernet switch (usually four port). But even if it has only one ethernet port, for consumer devices it's almost always acting as a router rather than an ethernet bridge; the encapsulation happens at the IP level and the 'modem' is set as the gateway on the local subnet. It just isn't doing NAT. To genuinely dispense with IP-level routing for WAN connections you have to be using some sort of frame relay connection.

Nonsense. Some DSL modems are capable of running in bridging mode. Mine, for instance, runs that way to get a static IP. If I wasn't running an internal NAT network, I wouldn't need a router at all. Oh, and it's a standard consumer device with only one ethernet port.

Darth Holbytlan wrote:Nonsense. Some DSL modems are capable of running in bridging mode. Mine, for instance, runs that way to get a static IP. If I wasn't running an internal NAT network, I wouldn't need a router at all. Oh, and it's a standard consumer device with only one ethernet port.

He does live in the UK, where things might be different.

Starglider wrote:To genuinely dispense with IP-level routing for WAN connections you have to be using some sort of frame relay connection.

Verizon used to run frame relay over DSL but later switched to ATM; their modem/router combos can still run in bridge mode, however.

phongn wrote:He does live in the UK, where things might be different.

I read Starglider's post as a general statement, not something UK-specific (except for the first bit I quoted). If he meant the latter, I'll defer to his personal experience.

Most DSL modems actually have a fairly wide range of options on what you can do with them and what sort of protocols you use. Most of them can also be configured as either bridge or router wrt the WAN. Default setting tends to be a NAT configuration these days but plenty of old modems did not have that option. Most come with the integrated 4-port switch, but single port stuff is still available here.

Darth Holbytlan wrote:I read Starglider's post as a general statement, not something UK-specific (except for the first bit I quoted). If he meant the latter, I'll defer to his personal experience.

I have never seen a UK DSL connection that runs in bridging mode; in fact every one I've seen routes IP over PPPoE. However virtually all ADSL in the UK is provided by one wholesaler, British Telecom, which frame-relays the PPPoE to the ISP that unpacks it and provides the actual Internet connectivity. As such everyone else was forced to adopt their technical choices, which may not hold elsewhere. Ethernet bridging mode is inherently impractical for this kind of reselling though.

Starglider wrote:

Darth Holbytlan wrote:I read Starglider's post as a general statement, not something UK-specific (except for the first bit I quoted). If he meant the latter, I'll defer to his personal experience.

I have never seen a UK DSL connection that runs in bridging mode; in fact every one I've seen routes IP over PPPoE. However virtually all ADSL in the UK is provided by one wholesaler, British Telecom, which frame-relays the PPPoE to the ISP that unpacks it and provides the actual Internet connectivity. As such everyone else was forced to adopt their technical choices, which may not hold elsewhere. Ethernet bridging mode is inherently impractical for this kind of reselling though.

The ones we have have the options of IP over PPPoE, IP over ATM (most DSL networks are ATM, but e.g. the ISP I work for is switching to Ethernet-based stuff), but there is a wide variety of stuff the devices can do. We have it fairly good with the selection of devices, since there are a couple of very good domestic manufacturers of ADSL routers (A-Link and Telewell). Besides those, the most common other brands are Zyxel and D-Link, but compared to the current Telewell devices, all of the rest suck ass in the user friendliness (never mind tech support side if you need to configure them).