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Stark wrote:

Vympel wrote:Does anyone give a fuck about those guys anymore? The only ones who are even remotely relevant nowadays are Peter Molyneux, John Carmack, and of course Will Wright (Will Wright! Pee on Us!).

Shit that's all good stuff. Not current enough for today's kiddies, I think. Fucking Will Wright. Fucking Peter 'Everything I Say Is A Lie' Molyneux.

You're just jealous because SPORE redefined gaming.

(it was just like black & white was before gamespot said it wasn't ever good)

Wow, Chris Roberts produced Lord of War. Good for him, that was a good movie.

Starglider wrote:
Bioware are genuinely overrated. The Baldur's Gate series was only good because it could draw on a huge base of D&D material that had never been done competently in a computer RPG before. Ditto KOTOR. They have been going downhill since then; NWN was incredible blandness and substandard graphics saved only by user modules. Mass Effect was wildly overrated. The plot was unoriginal and boring, art was bland, the gameplay mechanics were pretty awful, it was horribly repetitive (or rather, padded) etc. It's conceivable but not likely that the sequel will fix most of that.

People forget for some reason that the Baldur's Gate games were done in conjunction with Black Isle (Now Obsidian), a team that did have some of the best writing talent in the industry (They did Planescape Torment for example, and Fallout). Nowadays though, as Obsidian they can't make a working, finished game (Kotor 2, which wasn't their fault, but also Vampire TM: Bloodlines, and some other game whose name escapes me, not Arcanum).

Stark wrote:Fucking Peter 'Everything I Say Is A Lie' Molyneux.

I think the Neux is an interesting example. It's fairly obvious that he really wants to deliver on his promises, and that he has ambitious, at times inexplicable, design goals which his team are entirely incapable of meeting. He's really earnest about it all, too. You obviously can't believe what he's got to say, because a lot of the time he's just speaking complete jibberish. That said, a man whose stated goal for Fable II was 'to make the player feel love' cannot be called bad. Just ... delusional?

I've gotta go with Bioware, they just can't move away from their stupid design choices that crippled KotOR and were still making the same fucking mistakes in Mass Effect.

Good v Evil mechanics (I'll ignore the stupidity of the moral choices), where you can't be a middle ground without getting punished because you don't have the abilities afforded by the extremes.

Level design that means that any single level is in fact 2-6 disjointed, interconnected bits filled with pointless empty space and non-reactive NPCs. Here's a hint. Put everyone in one fucking level and kill all the pointless fucking walking around.

Having to talk to everyone in your crew after each mission. Because you need to know their stories. Because. Just because. Never mind that half of my crew I'd toss out the airlock in Mass Effect first chance I got, I have to talk to these people. I hope there's an option to tell that racist human bitch that you only fucked her because she was easy once you nail her. I'd take my fucking renegade points for that.

Should I go on? I won't... I'll give Bethesda an honourable mention for completely removing the fun from a game with surgical precision. Ambition will only get you so far - one day you have to make a giant fucking world that actually works and doesn't lose companions when you fast travel, breaking your quests. And that is actually interesting to inhabit. I love Fallout, but it's not like it was your idea.

I am going to say Bioware.

I love and still play many of their games. The BG series was gold and I still play through a campaign once every two years. But then came NWN, which just sucked. NWN2 - the same. KOTOR was fun, but only because of the setting not because the story was something new - since BG2/NWN they just recycled them. Then Obsidian screwed up the sequel. Result: I own 6 Bioware games. And I only really liked 2 - and those were the first ones I bought.

After reading the previews for Jade empire, I decided not to buy it, same with Mass Effect. But both got high ratings, which puzzles me. So yeah, I have to go with Bioware.

weemadando wrote:Having to talk to everyone in your crew after each mission. Because you need to know their stories. Because. Just because. Never mind that half of my crew I'd toss out the airlock in Mass Effect first chance I got, I have to talk to these people. I hope there's an option to tell that racist human bitch that you only fucked her because she was easy once you nail her. I'd take my fucking renegade points for that.

I'm pretty sure that, to complete the main quest, you don't actually have to talk to your party. That said, why would you complain about them? They're pretty much the only sequences which you can describe as competantly written and delivered. Even Ashley's dribbling is worthwhile just to hear Sheppard reply to her. He sounds pretty neutral but it's obvious that he thinks she's a complete nutcase, even when using the nice responses.

Vympel wrote:Chris Roberts, there's a weird one - was so obsessed with doing movies, he turned his games into them, then went off to produce films, or some shit.

Speaking of movies, there's always Hideo Kojima. Wasn't Metal Gear Solid 4 something like half an hour of cutscenes before you even start playing?

Anyway, I voted Bungie. I almost picked Bethesda, since I've never actually seen anyone play their games. At least among the people I know, Morrowind is little more than a dicking around engine, usually involving playing the first few minutes of plot, break the magic system, create a save game, and then just occasionally log on and go on a rampage without saving progress since they would inevitably end up hitting an important plot character with 16 simultaneous fireballs.

My vote would personally go for Blizzard. Their games aren't bad, as such, but the fanbase surrounding them gets on my tits. Same with Bungie.

I wasn't aware anyone actually rated any of these guys particularly as developers.

They barely register on my radar when I think of good game houses except maybe valve.

But if I have to respond it has to go to Bethesda, I think i've played three of their games at various points and got bored.

At least I finish the Bioware games I have played.


Bungie just make standard shooters that I have enjoyed but are nothing special and Valve are the least overrated of the lot, their games are fun and engaging which is pretty much what a game should be.

Bungie.

Not because Halo is crap, i actually enjoyed it. I found the graphics and design style mediocre at best and the story was just irrelevant. But the gameplay was pretty decent which made up for that. All in all the Halos are fun games.
However, the games are so massively overhyped that Bungie easily makes the first place in a most overreated poll. Some of the other companies games might be worse than Halo but the hype around them doesn´t seem nearly as massive as the hype around Bungie.

Lord Woodlouse wrote:My vote would personally go for Blizzard. Their games aren't bad, as such, but the fanbase surrounding them gets on my tits. Same with Bungie.

My experience regarding Blizzard rep is actually the opposite. I find that they are more a target of hate than adoration. There are the people who don't play Blizzard games and consider them to be permavirgin factories that kill Koreans, and those who do who start shitting bricks whenever their WoW server hiccups.

Ford Prefect wrote:

weemadando wrote:Having to talk to everyone in your crew after each mission. Because you need to know their stories. Because. Just because. Never mind that half of my crew I'd toss out the airlock in Mass Effect first chance I got, I have to talk to these people. I hope there's an option to tell that racist human bitch that you only fucked her because she was easy once you nail her. I'd take my fucking renegade points for that.

I'm pretty sure that, to complete the main quest, you don't actually have to talk to your party. That said, why would you complain about them? They're pretty much the only sequences which you can describe as competantly written and delivered. Even Ashley's dribbling is worthwhile just to hear Sheppard reply to her. He sounds pretty neutral but it's obvious that he thinks she's a complete nutcase, even when using the nice responses.

I'll admit in Mass Effect they have some good ones: Wrex and Garrus are both interesting, but Kaidan and the Quarian are just walking, talking codexes thus far. Liara and Ashley may be interesting, but I was a bit let down by Liara as I did Noveria first and whacked her mum, then went and found her. Sadly my first dialogue option when finding her in the bubble couldn't be: "I just want to get this out in the open first, but I just killed your mother. Do you still want my help?"

In KotOR 1&2 and Jade Empire, most of your companions merely served to be annoyances and I really feel that the ones in ME are heading that way too.

Bioware's problem is that they so desperately want to portray the pen and paper type experience with a lot of depth and scope, but they instead become the most irritating rail-roading GMs because they have a story that they desperately want to tell you.

For example, my Shepherd looks about 40+ and is ravaged (lined face, scars etc) and is a Spacer/War Hero. I split points early on between Charm and Intimidate, but it just became so irritating because like all their other games the "renegade" was in fact "Fuck you, I want to drown your babies" which didn't play into the character I had in mind.

The prime example here is Noveria with the Rachni queen, you have to either kill it or release it. You can't hold off on the decision, or call the council for their input or anything - it's a false dilemma because there should be no timeframe to this decision. And it drives me nuts. Then when I let her go, Wrex remains steadfastly loyal and seemingly undisturbed by my actions, only grunting a few syllables of displeasure.

I went with Bioware. The only Bethesda game I played was Fallout 3 which I found surprisingly enjoyable considering how shitty FO2 was (I've never played FO1.) I haven't ever played more than a minute or two of a Bungie game so I can't really judge them. Valve's been producing a lot of shit lately but the original Half Life was pretty decent; not the great, revolutionary work of art that it gets hyped up as but a competently executed FPS nonetheless. Bioware, on the other hand, has simply never produced a game worth playing, nor has their sister company Black Isle.

Still, it doesn't matter too much as this poll is rendered completely invalid by not including Blizzard.

Bioware easily. They've won countless awards and praise from the industry all for ripping shit pretty much straight out of D&D source books, slapping "Star Wars" on it and calling it a game. Every time I hear someone say that KOTOR was "well written" I want to shoot myself. The story was basically ripped from the movies. Nerds hail KOTOR as "what the prequels should have been" and claim that "George Lucas should take notes". And why shouldn't they? It has everything EU fanwhores love. Self-indulgent plot, vague references to other worthless EU fan fictions, and astounding levels of wank for the characters etc.

Don't even get me and Stark going on Mass Effect.

I'll place Valve in a close second. Everyone loves them for basically publishing mods of Half Life 2 for the past 4 years. Not to mention managing to win nerd cum everywhere basically for making the most bog-standard FPS of all time.

Bioware. Even if their games were otherwise ok, which they aren't, they'd get my vote for always fucking up the morality system in their games (and still getting praised for it). Seriously, it's bad enough that those choices are poorly written and ridiculously black and white, but tying that whole fucking mess to the character's actual skills is something that never ceases to piss me off.

You were impolite to the Sith Lord! There goes your light side mastery!

No Japanese? I'm kinda stunned really...but that would make it too easy.

Of them, Bungie. At least with even Bioware I've found more enjoyment and their track record isn't "Make a slow FPS that sucks compared to PC games...and do it four times over for fanboys.". Even the RTS is shit.

What? No mention of Richard Garriott? Damm, I'm old.

but also Vampire TM: Bloodlines

Uhh, that was Troika. So was Arcanum. You've only mentioned one Obsidian game, that being KOTOR2.

For example, my Shepherd looks about 40+ and is ravaged (lined face, scars etc) and is a Spacer/War Hero. I split points early on between Charm and Intimidate, but it just became so irritating because like all their other games the "renegade" was in fact "Fuck you, I want to drown your babies" which didn't play into the character I had in mind.

I didn't think that at all. Every single Renegade choice that I can recall made perfect sense for someone who wanted to advance his legitimate interests and point of view from a completely amoral perspective. Renegade != Evil. There's not a single moment in ME that I can recall that had anywhere near the cartoonish level of villainy displayed in KOTOR.

Bioware.

I couldn't even get through the first chapter of Neverwinter Nights, I was so bored.

I haven't really played enough of those "B" companies' games to know. Actually aside from a couple of brief "hey you should try this" stints at Halo, I don't think I've played any of Bungie's, Bethesda's, or Bioware's games. I saw someone play Marathon once, but it looked like total shit (i think maybe the character animations looked off? i'm not sure exactly what rubbed me the wrong way, but it just looked awful to me, and I'm a dude who loves to play Doom now and again).

I think Valve sells fun games but they can be impossibly smug about their work. Just look at that picture of GRDONO FREEMAN looking down at you. He's looking down at you. Fuck his silent smugbeard face.


So all of them? I dunno.

But GORDAN FREEMON is the world's most overqualified lawnmower technician. How can you not like his complete lack of personality, or the uncanny valley-like behavior of Alyx, who SPELLS HER NAME WITH A Y and beats Episode 1 for you?

Also. How ever did we pick things up without the GRAVITY GUN, but only things that aren't alive. You know. 200 pound oil drums are fine, but not a 40 pound dog.

I voted for Bungie, I played Halo:CE and I haven't been interested in the franchise at all till ODST (and that looks like a bust). So despite all the hype around their games and universe the first one was just a bog standard corridor shooter and it failed to get me to pick the others up. I will at least play or buy games from the others on the list, many of which I really like.

So yeah, Bungie.

Vympel wrote:

but also Vampire TM: Bloodlines

Uhh, that was Troika. So was Arcanum. You've only mentioned one Obsidian game, that being KOTOR2.

For example, my Shepherd looks about 40+ and is ravaged (lined face, scars etc) and is a Spacer/War Hero. I split points early on between Charm and Intimidate, but it just became so irritating because like all their other games the "renegade" was in fact "Fuck you, I want to drown your babies" which didn't play into the character I had in mind.

I didn't think that at all. Every single Renegade choice that I can recall made perfect sense for someone who wanted to advance his legitimate interests and point of view from a completely amoral perspective. Renegade != Evil. There's not a single moment in ME that I can recall that had anywhere near the cartoonish level of villainy displayed in KOTOR.

I just wanted there to be a bit more definition, sometimes the "Renegade" option was just that touch too far past what I wanted or would automatically lead to combat. Goddamnit - I'm a war-hero rolling with Wrex and Garrus, my "intimidate" option should be: "you know this doesn't end well for you don't you?" or something similar to make them give up through threat of violence, not just "enough talk, let's fight."

The issue for me was that the 'renegade' options SHOULD have allowed you to end-run around their stupid story, but didn't because 'renegade' = 'say mean things'. When the cops pull guns on you in Noveria and force you to spend 15m walking around like an idiot, it is IMPOSSIBLE to just kill them. Fuckem. I'm extra-legal and they're stupid to stop me AND I don't want to play that ridiculous conversation 'adventure'. Blam blam I'm the sheriff now. It might have even allowed being a Spectre to mean something (ps it's irrelevant) and to allow the player to express their attitudes.

Do you think Saren put up with that shit? They'd never even have tried it, because they'd be potholed in seconds.