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Anderson, Rusch and Hambly really blew it all. One of the highlights of reading the NJO was to watch all those YJK characters bite it. Apparently KJA is upset about the whole NJO and LotF business, but that's too bad, considering what he did to Dune.

I didn't like Wolverton, but that was mostly because of the Hapans. Too bad that Imperial plague didn't spread a little wider.

Traviss and Kube McDowell weren't too bad, they were just mostly forgettable.

Stackpole and Allston's fighter wank was annoying, but not where as bad as the others.

Pelranius wrote:Anderson, Rusch and Hambly really blew it all. One of the highlights of reading the NJO was to watch all those YJK characters bite it. Apparently KJA is upset about the whole NJO and LotF business...

This coming from the guy who offed Crix Madine is priceless. And Anderson should know better; this is one of the consequences of playing in a shared universe.

from what he said i an interview it was more "I personally don't like it, but eh. It's not my call." He's not overly offended about it, but yeah it is kind of hypocritical

He should be happy that one of his original monstrosities of a character was brought back (Daala, by another hack writer). The fact that no one has offed Kyp yet still surprises me.

I'm going to put Troy Denning down as a honorable terrible writer; he wrote some decent books, but his shit books outnumber them by a large amount.

I liked Denning but not much as Zahn or Stover, couldn't find too much at fault with him (though when I started reading his first SW books, I was just coming off of the "Dune sequels" so anything seemed decent in comparison). He doesn't seem to warrant getting excited about.

His swarm trillogy is just Traviss minus shrieking fans should be gutted.

I was stupid enough to buy all three books of the Swarm Trilogy (sort of because I have a major Pellaeon fixation, one of my guilty EU pleasures).

I had problems with Swarm War and Invincible. Dear Waru I had problems with Invincible. His Fate of the Jedi book was a return to form, so he's currently at 5 non-shitty books, 4 shitty books by my count.

Best: Allston's X-Wing books. His NJO weren't bad but not as good comparatively. Not read his LotF/FotJ books but those series are apparently crap. Lesson here? Let Alston do his own thing and do bog him down with 'epic plot' shit.

Also Micheal Reeves (sometimes in combination with Steve Perry) good fun and usually concentrating on original or minor characters which is nice way for the expanded universe to actually expand. Though Coruscant Nights weren't as good as I hoped partially because of seeming lack of will to do what made Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter so good: Killing off your good guys in droves.

Worst: Sean Williams and Shane Dix, the only NJO book I failed to finish was Remnant. I didn't attempt their other two 'Force Heretic'

Crazedwraith wrote:Worst: Sean Williams and Shane Dix, the only NJO book I failed to finish was Remnant. I didn't attempt their other two 'Force Heretic'

True, but at least they gave us my favorite Pellaeon line of all time:

"You may win the occasional battle against us, Vorrik, but the Empire will always strike back."

JME2 wrote:

Crazedwraith wrote:Worst: Sean Williams and Shane Dix, the only NJO book I failed to finish was Remnant. I didn't attempt their other two 'Force Heretic'

True, but at least they gave us my favorite Pellaeon line of all time:

"You may win the occasional battle against us, Vorrik, but the Empire will always strike back."

Actually that is always something that has bothered me in various novels, the constant references to real world discussions. How many times have we heard references to Han shooting first or the Empire Strikes Back? It takes away from the universe in my opinion.

Darth Hoth wrote: I would, however, add the infamous (?) Lando Calrissian trilogy by L. Neil Smith. It reads like it was written on drugs, introduces some of the most ridiculous stupidities in the EU (Waru is fairly benign by comparison), and - for me, at least - just feels unreal when read.

I honestly quite liked that trilogy; I guess it was a bit trippy, but after years of reading bland, shit EU books, to return to something like that where there was actual imagination was quite refreshing. So much else these days just feels like it's been forced into a straightjacket of preexisting ideas. That was one of the things I liked so much about Brian Daley's Han Solo trilogy - it wasn't trying to fit into the mold of existing Star Wars material.

As a side note, I was absolutely infuriated (though not particularly surprised) when I found that on Wookieepedia the Sorcerers of Tund are described as an ancient order of Sith mages. This is part of the problem, the tendency nowadays to try and pigeonhole everything into existing categories of knowledge, in this case of pegging anything potentially "supernatural" as the Force. Rokur Gepta is loads better a villain when you have simply no clue what he is. When he's just another dark-sider he's not really anything special.

I too rather liked the Daley/Smith trilogies, on hindsight I suspect in no small part because they were written before there was an EU as we know it today and thus didn't have to take into account a trillion bits of information but could actually create from scratch. As per the OT the framework for Star Wars is essentially 1) there's an evil Empire, 2) interstellar smuggling is at least potentially profitable, 3) FTL travel is trivially easy, 4) there's shields and ray guns and on the high end those ray guns can blow up a planet, and-that's it. At the time those were published that pretty much WAS the framework for Wars novels, and frankly they were a lot better than most of the post-TTT stuff I've read.

the sorcers aren't quite the same level as the sith. they were founded by pureblood sith priests (the species, not the religious order) according to one of the newer guides, they were dark and somewhat...nasty, but by and large they were less cruel then the sith, did not actively tap into the darkside, and were more focused on mysticism then being meglomaniacal douchebags. As a result, the jedi were content to simply keep tabs on them. Till they were forced to leave

They're like another organization called the crucible, which despite having sith roots, ultimately gained enough of an identity to not really be considered sith.

James Luceno: One of the best authors in the EU. He wrote the excellent Labyrinth of Evil, as well as The Unifying Force (which was my second favorite NJO book after Traitor). On the other hand, he wrote the rather mediocre Dark Lord.

Matthew Stover: Good, but inconsistent. His novelization of ROTS is probably the best Star Wars novel out there, and certainly my favorite to read. Traitor was fascinating and different (with one of the most epic "last stand" chapters in the EU), but it doesn't seem to jibe with Lucas's vision of how the Force is supposed to be. On the other hand, Shatterpoint was bad, and (although I might get flamed for this) Luke Skywalker and the Shadows of Mindor was very forgettable.

Timothy Zahn: Better than most of the EU, but that's not saying much. Pretty legendary for his minimalism. I'm not too fond of the fact that all but one of his EU novels is about his pet character Thrawn in some way (whether Thrawn himself, rumors of Thrawn's return, or one of Thrawn's projects), but I did enjoy the "Hand of Thrawn" duology.

Karen Traviss: Enough said. She's terrible, and has left a rather unpleasant legacy on the EU. One thing that particularly annoyed me in her writing was how almost all of the characters had the exact same internal monologue voice.

Kathy Tyers: I mostly enjoyed The Truce at Bakura, although it was pretty retarded how the antagonists (who were struggling to conquer a single well-armed system) were portrayed as this dire threat to the galaxy.

Michael Stackpole: I really enjoyed I,Jedi, and I think it gets criticized too harshly. The novel was really a step-up in how it portrayed the Jedi Academy (over the shittiness that was the Kevin J. Anderson trilogy), which was the best part of the novel.

Aaron Allston: Entertaining, and good at cleaning up some of the messes left by other EU characters.

Troy Denning: Usually varied between mediocre and bad. I did like a lot in Star by Star, but the "Dark Swarm" Trilogy was abysmal.

Dave Wolverton: I enjoyed the Courtship of Princess Leia, although I think the plot was kind of silly. What really stood out for me was that it wasted a very interesting potential "B" plot in the Luke and Isolder journey together to find Han Solo. The novel really would have been much better if Isolder was Force-sensitive, and part of the novel had centered around Luke training a new disciple.

Kevin J. Anderson: Mediocre "Superweapon of the Week" trash, in the form of Sun Crusher and Dark Star. He also inflicted the rather unpleasant Admiral Daala on the EU.

There is one thing that I didn't like about Golden's contribution. She had Tahiri sleep with Darth Caedus. God I wish I was joking.

Darth Yan wrote:There is one thing that I didn't like about Golden's contribution. She had Tahiri sleep with Darth Caedus. God I wish I was joking.

Wait. Seriously?

I knew about the whole disgusting mess with Tahiri trying to seduce ben to get information out of him, but that's new. Good god. Even years after it's finished the LoTF series still finds ways to appall me with it's horribleness.

Darth Yan wrote:There is one thing that I didn't like about Golden's contribution. She had Tahiri sleep with Darth Caedus. God I wish I was joking.

...

Scottish Ninja wrote:

Darth Hoth wrote: I would, however, add the infamous (?) Lando Calrissian trilogy by L. Neil Smith. It reads like it was written on drugs, introduces some of the most ridiculous stupidities in the EU (Waru is fairly benign by comparison), and - for me, at least - just feels unreal when read.

I honestly quite liked that trilogy; I guess it was a bit trippy, but after years of reading bland, shit EU books, to return to something like that where there was actual imagination was quite refreshing. So much else these days just feels like it's been forced into a straightjacket of preexisting ideas. That was one of the things I liked so much about Brian Daley's Han Solo trilogy - it wasn't trying to fit into the mold of existing Star Wars material.

That was exactly how I felt about the Han Solo books (Daley's original run), and no small part of the reason why I bought the Lando books in the first place (the other being my quasi-obsessive completism). However, for me the latter just had too many bad ideas in them, ranging from moronic villains over abysmal plots to the abomination that is the Oswaft, with all kinds of minor retardedness in between. A lot of it even seemed to be deliberate self-parody at times; the Lando trilogy is kind of the prequel trilogy to the Han Solo series, in more ways than one. Freshness was nice (and most especially when compared to the latter-day EU), but the ideas still need to be able to stand on their own. Smith's do not, in my book.

I did like the Rokur Gepta character most of the time, as well as the second book, which is not nearly as bad as the first and last ones. Smith can write fairly good scenes when he makes an effort; it is just that the overarcing plotlines and worldbuilding tend to be awful. Or so I think.

OK:

Brian Daley's Han Solo Trilogy. Captures the swashbuckling feel of a free trader quite well.

Tim Zahn's Thrawn Trilogy. It was the first EU to be published; and had a credible villian and credible threat to the New Republic -- the NR was still on very shaky grounds, trying to establish it's legimitacy; so a threat could still be mounted to said legimitacy from the Remnant. And the Imperials from what I remember were not the moustache twirling evil villians of other SW fiction.

There's also possibly the Han Solo Trilogy which ends with the famous meetup in the cantina. But I have not re-read the HST in a long time; so my impressions of it may be off.

As heretical as it seems i mostly liked the njo (Remnant was the worst and even that wasn't horrible. the only bit i couldn't stand was the Mezicanny's wave bullshit. I was 16 when I read it and knew jack all of physics and even I could tell it was bullshit.

Darth Yan wrote:As heretical as it seems i mostly liked the njo (Remnant was the worst and even that wasn't horrible. the only bit i couldn't stand was the Mezicanny's wave bullshit. I was 16 when I read it and knew jack all of physics and even I could tell it was bullshit.

I thought the idea of the NJO was ambitious and a interesting step away from stand-alones and trilogies. The Vong were problematic. Stupid black-hole ships.

Talhe wrote:

Darth Yan wrote:As heretical as it seems i mostly liked the njo (Remnant was the worst and even that wasn't horrible. the only bit i couldn't stand was the Mezicanny's wave bullshit. I was 16 when I read it and knew jack all of physics and even I could tell it was bullshit.

I thought the idea of the NJO was ambitious and a interesting step away from stand-alones and trilogies. The Vong were problematic. Stupid black-hole ships.

I at least I liked the Vong because it was a fresh breath of air after years of Imperial warlords and super-weapons. I'm also a fan of world-building, so it was interesting to see a new culture emerge unlike anything we'd seen in SW before.

I at least I liked the Vong because it was a fresh breath of air after years of Imperial warlords and super-weapons. I'm also a fan of world-building, so it was interesting to see a new culture emerge unlike anything we'd seen in SW before.

Oh, you're right about that. I just disliked the fact that they made biological analogues to everything.

Talhe wrote:

I at least I liked the Vong because it was a fresh breath of air after years of Imperial warlords and super-weapons. I'm also a fan of world-building, so it was interesting to see a new culture emerge unlike anything we'd seen in SW before.

Oh, you're right about that. I just disliked the fact that they made biological analogues to everything.

Yeah. I also wish they'd been more consistent in other areas. The extreme love of pain was only supposed to belong to Domain Shai, for example. Then the writers after Stackpole fucked up and applied it to all of the Vong.