Random Stargate Universe FTL question

[Alyeska]

Predator, you didn't read my entire post did you? It would take the fastest SGC ship more than a hundred years to do what the Asgard could do in 18. Earth ships are significantly slower. And they don't necessarily know where the Destiny is.

If they want to bring Destiny home, there is a possible easier solution. See how friendly the Ori now are. Ask them for assistance. They have access to great power. Gate over a few Priors to the Destiny. They can help with repairs. Then gate over pieces of a supergate to Destiny. Use the supergate to get home.

[PREDATOR490]

Predator, you didn't read my entire post did you? It would take the fastest SGC ship more than a hundred years to do what the Asgard could do in 18. Earth ships are significantly slower. And they don't necessarily know where the Destiny is.

If they want to bring Destiny home, there is a possible easier solution. See how friendly the Ori now are. Ask them for assistance. They have access to great power. Gate over a few Priors to the Destiny. They can help with repairs. Then gate over pieces of a supergate to Destiny. Use the supergate to get home.

Since that lovely little Asgard Core was supposed to have the entire legacy of the Asgard in it with the bells and whistles super-advanced-tech slapped on as well...

Seems rather weird the Asgard didnt include designs for the hyperdrive they have been using to cross distances in speeds far greater than anything save Wormhole drive. Not to mention the Asgard core supposedly has a holo-thor that explains how to do shit.

Q: Hey Thor, tell us how your ships move so fast
A: Well... (blah blah blah)
Q: Tell me the steps to do this
A: (Blah blah blah)

*Poof*
Holy shiet... we can produce Asgard power systems and fly at insane speeds.
The power systems alone could be enough to power a gate connection.

As for not knowing where the Destiny is... WE dont know where Destiny is.
Rush and Co should have been more than able to call up some sort of navigational map system that charts how far Destiny is away from the start point. They even showed something like that early on but it panned off screen for us.

As for the Ori - Thats a complete unknown.

The Priors had SOME powers but their power came from Ascended beings that souped them up. There is no way to know if building a super-gate is within their abilities without the Ori to tell them how or potentially provide direct divine assistance. That said, one would think the power source used to dial a big super-gate like that could equally be used to dial a smaller gate over a longer distance. Even if it requires a rather amusing proximity to a black hole AND the logistics of trying to send supplies via a space gate > Destiny connection.

Then again, SGU has made a rather blatant attempt to cut itself off from SG and isolate any mentions of whats going on to the point of insanity. Wouldnt expect any mention of the Ori to occur let alone provide anything other than a token attempt to write out this particular point.

[Eternal_Freedom]

IIRC "Unending" correctly, the Asgard most likely gave them an improved hyperdrive anyway, seeing as how it took them much less time to get back than the three weeks it took them to get there.

Incidentally, was that three weeks at ZPM-powered speeds or normal speeds?

[Alyeska]

Since that lovely little Asgard Core was supposed to have the entire legacy of the Asgard in it with the bells and whistles super-advanced-tech slapped on as well...

You can give me the schematics to build a F-22. Doesn't mean I can build one. Knowledge does not equate an ability to build it. What Earth has is already probably to the limit of their ability. And without the Asgard to build or supervise installation, Earth tech might even regress without the Asgard experience and industrial base.

[Alyeska]

IIRC "Unending" correctly, the Asgard most likely gave them an improved hyperdrive anyway, seeing as how it took them much less time to get back than the three weeks it took them to get there.

Incidentally, was that three weeks at ZPM-powered speeds or normal speeds?

4 days for ZPM power, 3 weeks without.

[Eternal_Freedom]

Wait a moment though. I know it takes 3 weeks without/4 days with a ZPM to reach Atlantis, but in Unending they went to Ida not Pegasus. They presumably would have been going max safe cruising as the Asgard said it was urgent. Soooo....was that three weeks at ZPM powered speeds to reach Ida, or did they choose to travel slower and take 3 weeks

[NecronLord]

The priors retain their telekinesis without ascended beings; but the really important thing is probably their healing abilities; even without the ressurection-staff, that would be helluva useful on Destiny.

Given that the Ori power source is probably inexhaustible (it even seems to be Arcturus related) it may be possible for an Ori ship to go out and rendezvous with Destiny. Ori ships can match speed with a ZPM-304 over long distance after all.

It'd be rather amusing to see the blue man group or the drones coming up against an organised SGC-Ori mission.

[PREDATOR490]

Somehow I suspect the Ori will have either:

A) Decided to forsake their technology and regress in repentence
B) Never be seen again like the Knox

There is no indication what actually happened to the supergate - It might have been destroyed by either side as a means to severe the link so the Ori might not even available now.

Would be more interesting to see the Ori-SGC encounter the folks that are responsible for making a planet. Alternatively just have a joint operation to build a super-ship to blitz a path to Destiny and then continue forward at faster speeds to wherever the thing is going. If the SGC is that keen on finding God... why skimp out on sending a run down piece of shit like the Destiny when you can slap together a brand new ship that dosent suffer from being millions of years old with systems you dont have a clue how to operate.

In theory Destiny is actually slower / on par with an X304 since it took a month to cross the void between galaxies as I recall. X304s are doing that in 3 weeks. ZPM powered ones are doing that in 4 days.
Asgard do it better
Not counting the obvious stopping and starting the Destiny frequently does to scout planets etc.

Between the Ori, Ancients and Asgard tech it really becomes increasingly silly for the SGC to have not produced better power systems. The Ori managed to train a medieval society to build ships that are equal to X304s. Somehow Earth is unable to replicate Ancient ZPMs or Asgard powersources despite having two MASSIVE respositories of knowledge.

[Eternal_Freedom]

I never got that either. Surely the first thing Rodney would have looked up in the Ancient database was "How to build a ZPM."

They must have had some way to build them, and it would make sense for it to either be on Atlantis, or listed somewhere. Atlantis after all left for Pegasus on her own, so she must have had a way to produce new ZPM's along the way.

[Batman]

Why? SGA managed to get her back to the Milky Way on 3 ZPMs they managed to scrounge, and didn't drain them. Now the Ancients naturally needed the means to build ZPMs, but that doesn't mean Atlantis can do so out of onboard resources, or even given onboard manufactoring using external resources (which Atlantis-either way-may or may not have as they still hadn't explored all of it by the end of s5). For all we know they simply stocked up on the things before leaving the Milky Way.

[Eternal_Freedom]

At any rate we know ZPM's are made, we know the Ancients built them and we know that there is at least some data in the Ancient database. Again, I would think a simple "How do I build a ZPM" question in the hologram room would suffice. Especially as they knew they needed ZPM's immediatly upon arrival.

If not that, asking (as was suggested earlier) the hologram of Thor in the Odyssey's Asgard Core "How do I build a neutrino-Ion generator" should also be a logical first thing you do.

[Batman]

At which point you're likely going to get a precise, detailed and thorough lesson on how to build a ZPM/neutrino-ion generator...using technology and/or resources you don't have.

[Eternal_Freedom]

So you ask them how to build it with current technology, or how to build a more effecient naquada generator or whatever.

[Batman]

Presupposes the databank has the knowledge for that. What if it doesn't? If memory serves mot of the Asgard technology Earth uses was given to them as a black box, not taught to work up to from a Tau'ri industry base.
They may have all of the Asgard/Ancient knowledge, (and frankly it appears they have a lot of headway to make to aceess leave alone understand it) that doesn't mean they know all the steps to get there and use it from a modern day Earth tech base.

[Eternal_Freedom]

I'll concede that.

Although I suppose the real-world reason is to avoid making it too easy for the characters.

[PREDATOR490]

Actually, Ark of Truth kinda made the premise the core was capable of 'filling' in the blanks if given sufficient input. It spat out a replicator no less.

Dont see why it wouldnt be able to spit out tools or materials when Unending showed it capable of producing lots of shit out of nowhere. Is it going to be unlimited - of course not. Do we actually know what those limitations are - No

Then again, nothing really stops someone from making ANOTHER robot army that can be used to automate construction. Blah blah, Replicators were bad not withstanding.

Even if it requires them to keep asking... how do I build that ?
Now how do I build the things to build the things needed to build this thing etc.

Earth can already replicate X304s with Asgard technology including their highly advanced beam weapons which were supposedly brand new for the Asgard. Would be rather curious for Earth to be able to build cutting edge Asgard weaponary, sensors, shields but somehow they cant manufacture power systems of some higher calibre that we are seeing being deployed.

If Jack can cobble together a ZPM power source from shit lying around the SGC it seems rather insane the SGC cannot replicate better power sources years later with the wealth of two repositories of advanced technology.

[NecronLord]

Actually, Ark of Truth kinda made the premise the core was capable of 'filling' in the blanks if given sufficient input. It spat out a replicator no less.

I think the idea is that it already had replicator knowledge in it; the Asgard had detailed scans of Replicators as of season 4.

Earth can already replicate X304s with Asgard technology including their highly advanced beam weapons which were supposedly brand new for the Asgard. Would be rather curious for Earth to be able to build cutting edge Asgard weaponary, sensors, shields but somehow they cant manufacture power systems of some higher calibre that we are seeing being deployed.

The generators on an asgard warship are huge, it's that glowing spine-thing on the underside of the Beliskner-class Valkyrie here.

An Asgard warship power system is probably literally bigger than Earth's shipyard.

By comparison, the plasma beam generator is actually a rather small disk-like thing, at least externally; it's a dome thing you can see on the model (best shot is the supergate bit in Ark of Truth, as it's well lit) about one deck high.

Three meters.

Or a MILE LONG.

Also, I don't think they've ever been able to duplicate asgard sensors - asgard (and from Thor's mind, Anubis) had cloak-piercing scanners, something the 304s don't have.

[avatarxprime]

I never got that either. Surely the first thing Rodney would have looked up in the Ancient database was "How to build a ZPM."

For whatever reason, it really doesn't seem that easy. Everyone, even the Asgard, make a big deal out of actually finding anything useful from the Ancient Repository of Knowledge. Still, that doesn't mean they don't have an out. Since they have the Asgard core they should be able to perform the same trick that Thor did in New Order, Part 2 of linking the mind of someone who has downloaded the Repository's contents to a computer and get out the answers to some questions like "How to I build a ZPM?" or "How do I build an indexable version of the Repository for easy use?"

[Crazedwraith]

They already have an indexed version of the Repository. It's called Atlantis' database.

[adam_grif]

Earth can already replicate X304s with Asgard technology including their highly advanced beam weapons which were supposedly brand new for the Asgard. Would be rather curious for Earth to be able to build cutting edge Asgard weaponary, sensors, shields but somehow they cant manufacture power systems of some higher calibre that we are seeing being deployed.

Cores can make more cores, as well as most key asgard tech, which is the only way to explain the 304 fleets they've been building without just assuming that they loaded up a dozen cores and a bunch of excess beam guns onto the Odyssey when they first decked it out.

If Neutrino-Ion generators need Neutronium to run (however that works...) then that could explain why they don't build asgard power sources - they don't have the mining operations to support it.

[Stargate Nerd]

I don't quite get how everybody assumes that just because Asgard ships are fast, that they'd have the range to actually travel such distances. After all a Porsche doesn't necessarily have greater range than a Toyota Corolla just because it's much faster.

[avatarxprime]

They already have an indexed version of the Repository. It's called Atlantis' database.

Except it hardly qualifies under the "easy to use" part of my statement. If it was you'd think asking "How do I make ZPMs?" or "Where is the nearest ZPM production facility located?" would have been handled in the years the Atlantis Expedition was mucking about with the thing. Instead they've only found the odd bit of research into ZPMs that the Ancients did and are still pouring over information on how to remake them. I mean during the whole "Quest for the Sangrael" arc they needed an Ascended Ancient to come down and help Jackson find the answers he sought. That hardly speaks to the excellent indexing or ease of use of the database, especially compared to how quick O'Neill was able to use Ancient knowledge to make things happen.

[Cananatra]

Back to the original question, it could be that as they are tracking and recording a signal in real space, it would be inadvisable to use a hyperdrive which removes you from real space. You could miss some of that message you are trying to collect. Just a thought.