ISD Judicator (I dig the name) Vs. V Ger (W/ship)

[NecronLord]

If Roddenberry authorized it, why wouldn't it be canon?

Because Paramount now has 0 respect for him, and milks his creation for cash only. And they set the canon policy. He didn't just authorise it, apparently it isn't even ghost-written, he wrote it. (And it's better than the film.)

[The Kernel]

If Roddenberry authorized it, why wouldn't it be canon?

Because Paramount now has 0 respect for him, and milks his creation for cash only. And they set the canon policy. He didn't just authorise it, apparently it isn't even ghost-written, he wrote it. (And it's better than the film.)

Why should we take Paramounts word over Roddeberry's? At the time, he was the one who controlled the Star Trek franchise and he wrote the film script as well as the novelization. I'd say that gives his novel canon status.

[Ma Deuce]

Also remember, that it's entirely possible Enterprise-Nil's Self Destruct would have been enough to cripple V'Ger itself (at least Kirk was hoping it would)

Sad isn't it? The end-all-be-all Trek non-Divine Super-Ship/Being can't even bother and ISD

It should be remembered that the Enterprise was deep inside V'Ger when the self destruct command was ordered. Also, Kirk bluffed the Ilea probe to get V'Ger to bring the Enterprise as close to the ship's "central brain complex" (as Spock described it) as possible, presumably because he wanted to engage the self destruct there. Even an ISD would take far less firepower to destroy from the inside than from the outside.

Truth is, we have absoultely no idea how tough V'Ger is: It could possibly be felled by one HTL blast, but on the other hand it could even be immune to them, so I'm going to echo Howeder's sentiment in the vote: using V'Ger's demonstrated firepower upper limit, this battle will never favor V'Ger, but it could possibly favor the ISD so I'll vote for the ISD.

On the other hand, If we use V'Ger's firepower from the novelization...

[Chardok]

On the other hand, If we use V'Ger's firepower from the novelization...

Which some of us agree overrides movie (Kernel et al. with the 2 AU quote) Then...what does that imply?

[DaveJB]

Which some of us agree overrides movie (Kernel et al. with the 2 AU quote) Then...what does that imply?

That Roddenberry was pissed off with not getting the writer's credit and decided to declare his novel canon to try and get one up over Livingston and the WGA?

Seriously though, if V'Ger could fire planet destroying blasts, why would it have needed to fire several blasts at Earth? Couldn't it have gotten by with just firing 1 or 2 high-power blasts?

[Black Admiral]

Seriously though, if V'Ger could fire planet destroying blasts, why would it have needed to fire several blasts at Earth? Couldn't it have gotten by with just firing 1 or 2 high-power blasts?

It might just have something to do with the fact that V'Ger wanted humans off Earth; it did not however want to blow up said planet.

[DaveJB]

It might just have something to do with the fact that V'Ger wanted humans off Earth; it did not however want to blow up said planet.

I didn't mean V'Ger would destroy Earth, I meant that if it possessed the power implied in the novel, why would it bother with several blasts around the planet when it could simply fire a blast powerful enough to cause a global extinction, but leaving the planet itself intact?

[Ma Deuce]

It might just have something to do with the fact that V'Ger wanted humans off Earth; it did not however want to blow up said planet.

I didn't mean V'Ger would destroy Earth, I meant that if it possessed the power implied in the novel, why would it bother with several blasts around the planet when it could simply fire a blast powerful enough to cause a global extinction, but leaving the planet itself intact?

Think of it this way. Why do many ICBMs use 10 or so MIRV's instead of one big warhead? a bunch a small warheads spreads damage over the surface more efficiently than one big one (you have to increase a warhead's yield 10x to double it's blast radius). If your trying to utterly annihilate a planet, then one big blast bould be the way to go.

Large single-warhead ICBMs are used against hardened targets, like the 20 megaton, single warhead versions of the SS-18 the Soviets had targeted at such "hard" installations as NORAD command at Cheyenne Mountain. the MIRV'd versions were targeted at spread-out, softer targets like cities.

[NecronLord]

I didn't mean V'Ger would destroy Earth, I meant that if it possessed the power implied in the novel, why would it bother with several blasts around the planet when it could simply fire a blast powerful enough to cause a global extinction, but leaving the planet itself intact?

Said devices were, in the novel, described as only affecting organic life forms. Like neutron bombs writ large. It wasn't going for surface destruction, it was going for "Clense the organic scum!" It may be the limit of the power of that particular weapon, or it may be that at higher levels, true life forms would be damaged by the attack.

[Darth Wong]

Why should we take Paramounts word over Roddeberry's? At the time, he was the one who controlled the Star Trek franchise and he wrote the film script as well as the novelization. I'd say that gives his novel canon status.

If we go by Gene Roddenberry's public statements, then DS9 and Voyager are not canon, nor are the recent Trek movies. His policy was that nothing is genuine Star Trek unless he gives it his personal stamp of approval.

Not that I have a problem with that (it's quite frankly the only acceptable policy when dealing with Darkstar acolytes, who insist upon the most restrictive possible interpretation of George Lucas quotes), but you'll never get the majority of Trekkies to throw DS9, Voyager, and all the TNG movies out of the canon.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

Ok noob question: what does Castrate Straha mean?

It means I should be running really fast, while wearing a groin cup.

Don't worry. We'll give you some crystalized ginger--you won't feel a thing.