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evilcat4000 wrote:Pulse disruptors do seem to be more powerful than beam phasers. In "Rascals" an ancient BOP was able to drop the Enterprises shields within seconds using pulse disruptors only.

How can we compare pulse disrupters to phasers in terms of time taken to drop the Enterprise's shields when, IIRC, we haven't seen Federation phasers striking the Ent-D?

We did see Voyger strike the Equinox with phasers and photon torpedoes. Even after five torpedo hits and numerous phaser blasts the much weaker Equinox still had shields.

evilcat4000 wrote:

That or Klingon disruptors can deliver more firepower than Fed phasers.

Pulse disruptors do seem to be more powerful than beam phasers. In "Rascals" an ancient BOP was able to drop the Enterprises shields within seconds using pulse disruptors only.

Actually, there were two B'Rels*, and they damaged the E-D before Worf fully powered the shields.

Btw, how did starship disruptors and phasers come into this? I thought people were comparing a hand-held disruptor's effects on a GCS warp core ("Heart of Glory") to Torres' phaser fire in "Dreadnaught"?


*In spite of Okuda's B'Rel--scout, K'Vort--cruiser rationalization, those classes are the same size. "Rascals" simply reused a shot of K'Vorts attacking the E-D from "Yesterday's Enterprise."

seanrobertson wrote:

evilcat4000 wrote:

That or Klingon disruptors can deliver more firepower than Fed phasers.

Pulse disruptors do seem to be more powerful than beam phasers. In "Rascals" an ancient BOP was able to drop the Enterprises shields within seconds using pulse disruptors only.

Actually, there were two B'Rels*, and they damaged the E-D before Worf fully powered the shields.

Btw, how did starship disruptors and phasers come into this? I thought people were comparing a hand-held disruptor's effects on a GCS warp core ("Heart of Glory") to Torres' phaser fire in "Dreadnaught"?


*In spite of Okuda's B'Rel--scout, K'Vort--cruiser rationalization, those classes are the same size. "Rascals" simply reused a shot of K'Vorts attacking the E-D from "Yesterday's Enterprise."

Do we know they're the same size? Is there a comparison shot? Because I've seen shots where a BOP was flying between the camera and a Negh'var and wasn't even the size of the bridge section. And others with BOPs that were clearly close to the E-D in size (based on shots past the E-D at the BOPs). So BOPs do come in various sizes. Are you saying otherwise, or just that the two episodes above used the same class? Obviously they intended the ships to be the same if they used the same shot, but writers' intent doesn't override canon evidence to the contrary if there is any.

Obviously they intended the ships to be the same if they used the same shot

I wouldn't be surprised if someone just said "Hey, we've already got some footage of BOPs attacking the Enterprise from Yesterday's Enterprise, let's just recycle that."

Metrion Cascade wrote: Do we know they're the same size? Is there a comparison shot?

Yes, ma'am, we do

The exterior shots of the BoPs in "Rascals" were stock footage from "Yesterday's Enterprise."

A quick comparison...

From "Y.E.":



Obviously, it'd be pointless to scale the Bird closest to the camera. The one in the distance, however, is ~290m wide (lower-limit) to the E-D's 470m beam.

From "Rascals":



Though this shot is closer-up, it's the same drill and same results.

Uraniun235 wrote:

Obviously they intended the ships to be the same if they used the same shot

I wouldn't be surprised if someone just said "Hey, we've already got some footage of BOPs attacking the Enterprise from Yesterday's Enterprise, let's just recycle that."

That's exactly what they did

I'm also quite certain that much of the battle in "Redemption pt. I," including what we see on Bortas' viewscreen, re-used "Y.E." footage.

Opps!

Chris OFarrell wrote:snip

Chris, I think your targeting system's damaged. Shouldn't this be in the 'Origins of the Scimitar' thread?

Batman wrote:

Chris OFarrell wrote:snip

Chris, I think your targeting system's damaged. Shouldn't this be in the 'Origins of the Scimitar' thread?

*smashes head against wall*
Thats what you get with two monitors with SD.net windows open on both

seanrobertson wrote:

Metrion Cascade wrote: Do we know they're the same size? Is there a comparison shot?

Yes, ma'am, we do

The exterior shots of the BoPs in "Rascals" were stock footage from "Yesterday's Enterprise."

A quick comparison...

From "Y.E.":

*image removed*

Obviously, it'd be pointless to scale the Bird closest to the camera. The one in the distance, however, is ~290m wide (lower-limit) to the E-D's 470m beam.

From "Rascals":

*image removed*

Though this shot is closer-up, it's the same drill and same results.

Perhaps Worf was wrong then. Those two BoP are the same size as K'Vort class Cruisers!

Alyeska wrote:

Gandalf wrote:The only other thing I can think of as a hull strength indicator is when a Jem' Hadar ship blasts a docking arm off.

Nope, never happened.

IIRC no Federation ships died of a core breach in the fleet engagements either.

So, the Fed's safety procedures cant be that bad.

Besides, if a core did go off in all that close fighting, end of battle I would think.

My theory about the Cardassian ship, is that it's warp systems were not active due to it just leaving DS9. So, it's warp systems may have been isolated from the rest of the ship at that time to prevent a core breach, should an explosion occur.

Just my 2c.

My theory about the Cardassian ship, is that it's warp systems were not active due to it just leaving DS9. So, it's warp systems may have been isolated from the rest of the ship at that time to prevent a core breach, should an explosion occur.

That is possible. In the Voyger episode about rogue holograms it is indicated that warp engines need some time to power up.