Bush Upsets Some Supporters....

[Stormbringer]

I've discovered the source of all this .....

Bush daughter's Satanist agenda revealed!

I do believe that's the longhorns sign. Or she might just think it is.

[Kamakazie Sith]

However, what I was initially trying to say is in order for Kerry to win he would have had to be more dishonest than he was. I'm not sure what you thought I was saying.

Why do you say that? I think if he'd had defended himself sooner against the Shit Boats, and layed out his policies, he'd have won...

I think he lost the election because he failed to appeal to the beliefs of the religious majority.

Though, those other reasons you mentioned certainly hurt his campaign.

[Stormbringer]

However, what I was initially trying to say is in order for Kerry to win he would have had to be more dishonest than he was. I'm not sure what you thought I was saying.

Why do you say that? I think if he'd had defended himself sooner against the Shit Boats, and layed out his policies, he'd have won...

I think he lost the election because he failed to appeal to the beliefs of the religious majority.

That's not entirely accurate. There are other groups than that. His big problem was he alienated so many other groups that could have pushed him over the top. As people like Glocksman have said groups like gun nuts and others could well have done the same.

Kerry lost because he simply couldn't convince enough people that he was the lesser evil.

[Kamakazie Sith]

That's not entirely accurate. There are other groups than that. His big problem was he alienated so many other groups that could have pushed him over the top. As people like Glocksman have said groups like gun nuts and others could well have done the same.

Kerry lost because he simply couldn't convince enough people that he was the lesser evil.

A good point.

He managed to piss off a lot of other large groups besides the religious.

[Kamakazie Sith]

Perhaps you could explain what "either you're dishonest or you're not. There's no 1-10 scale, dumbass" in light of your apparent belief regarding Kerry.

BoredShirtless wrote:

Yes there is, dumbo. In general, nuns are less dishonest then politicians.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wrote:

Yeah, your right.

*should be you're*

[Howedar]

I've discovered the source of all this .....

Bush daughter's Satanist agenda revealed!

I do believe that's the longhorns sign. Or she might just think it is.

She's right.

[Chmee]

I've discovered the source of all this .....

Bush daughter's Satanist agenda revealed!

I do believe that's the longhorns sign. Or she might just think it is.

She's right.

The AFA isn't fooled, they know what it's 'code' for.

[Stormbringer]

I do believe that's the longhorns sign. Or she might just think it is.

She's right.

The AFA isn't fooled, they know what it's 'code' for.

Go back under your bridge.

[Stormbringer]

A good point.

He managed to piss off a lot of other large groups besides the religious.

It's not that he pissed people off, though he did. It's that he simply failed to persuade people that wanted to vote for him. Whether through insensitivety or just plain not bothering he didn't get a lot of votes that he really could have.

[Durandal]

Interesting interview on NPR today with some people who've talked to Bush administration insiders. Bush is definitely a fundie personally, but it's NEVER been a big part of his political agenda. Before 9/11, he was concerned with taxes and education. Afterwards, add neoconservatism. But social issues, he apparently has his opinion, but they're not important enough for him to spend political capital on them.

Another interesting tidbit: Laura Bush apparently has a big role in moderating him socially. Lately, so have the twins. You notice the Marriage Amendment is being left to quietly fade into the background right when Bush is at the height of his power and influence--the longer he waits, the more of a lame duck he becomes. Similarly, no noise about Roe v. Wade, even though now would be the time to make a move against it if he wanted to. Sure, he could try to appoint justices to SCOTUS to overturn it, but without preparing the public for it, he's looking at a huge backlash against his own party--60% of the country wants abortion to be legal, after all. Bush is, by all appearances, telling the fundies what they want to hear in public and then following the advice of his family, all more moderate than him, in deciding on what his legislative agenda should be.

No real argument here, just a fact I thought was interesting.

That's very interesting. All in all, I think the religious right is getting what they deserve. They turn out in huge numbers to plop their boy in office, convinced that he'll put down those damned faggots and return the country to God's good graces.

And what did they get instead? A politician, who as it turns out, was just blowing smoke up their asses. And at the end of the day, the South is still getting screwed out of its best economic interests by voting for a party that only gives a shit about the upper 1%.

[Petrosjko]

Bush has always been deft at straddling the fences and making appeasing noises to the base. That goes back to his days as governor. The current governor is more of the same.

[Mayabird]

The AFA isn't fooled, they know what it's 'code' for.

Go back under your bridge.

It's called a joke. It's meant to be laughed or just snickered at.

[Broomstick]

President Bush came under fire from some social conservatives yesterday for saying he will not aggressively lobby the Senate to pass a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage during his second term.

Bluntly - he can't be re-elected, so he doesn't need the Fundies anymore. He got what he wanted from them, now they can go twist in the wind. Dumbassess - Bush has done this before to other people (like the Democrats), why should they be an exception?

"I believe there is no more important issue for the president's second term than the preservation of marriage."

just

Want to preserve marriage? Don't get divorced. What fucking idiots.

[sarcasm]"Oh, sure, the economy has tanked, money is useful only for wallpaper and it takes a wheelbarrow full to buy a loaf of bread, the only jobs left are minimum wage and unemployment is 50%. And, oh yes, there were those 14 terror attacks in May, that was bad... but at least we preserved the sanctity of heterosexual monogamous marriage. Tell that to your kids... assuming the radioactive fallout hasn't sterilized you yet"[/sarcasm]

In the Post interview, Bush, for the first time, said senators have made it clear to him the amendment has no chance of passing unless courts strike down the federal Defense of Marriage Act, which protects states from recognizing same-sex marriages conducted elsewhere. Challenges to the act are pending in state courts from California to Florida.

Well, yes, because if the DoMA is sustained then we don't need an amendment to accomplish the rather dubious goal of outlawing "gay marriage".

"It was not articulated that way in the campaign," Perkins complained.

What a fucking naive attitude - this man is an adult? They let him out unsupervised? Does he think Bush is Santa Claus?

Social conservatives who helped stoke record turnout for Bush in the 2004 election expressed concern that he is dropping the issue he passionately touted during the campaign now that he has been reelected.

Again - he doesn't need them anymore. So fuck them.

"The president is willing to spend his political capital on Social Security reform, but the nation is greatly conflicted on that issue," said Minnery, vice president of public policy for Focus on the Family. "The nation is united on marriage.

Well. gee, if the "nation" as a whole was united on the issue then when wouldn't need an anti-gay law in the first place. It's BECAUSE there is division on this issue that it IS an issue.

>Does Nelson laugh<

Ha-Ha!

Ditto.

[Tommy J]

Enclosed is article by MSNBC who interviewed him. I don't see the Marriage Amendment nor Roe v. Wade in their what so ever. Whomever said is wife and daughters are a moderator for him hit it dead on.

Bush's second term begins in prayer
Service is last inaugural event, then it's on to businessThe Associated Press
Updated: 11:19 a.m. ET Jan. 21, 2005WASHINGTON - President Bush on Friday started the first full day of his second term by attending a prayer service at Washington’s National Cathedral, following a tradition set by George Washington.

Instrumental and choral music filled the church and an interfaith lineup of Christian, Jewish and Muslim clergy helped celebrate through prayer the events of the day before — Bush’s swearing-in at the Capitol.

Offering one prayer, the Rev. Billy Graham said he believed God had a hand in Bush’s re-election.

“Their next four years are hidden from us, but they are not hidden from you,” said the 86-year-old evangelist, whom Bush credits with inspiring him to reaffirm his faith and give up drinking at age 40. “You know the challenges and opportunities they will face. Give them a clear mind, a warm heart, calmness in the midst of turmoil, reassurance in times of discouragement and your presence always.”

The hourlong ceremony was the last official event of his inauguration, which was steeped in religious overtones.

Bush’s second visit to church in two days brought together 3,200 invited family, dignitaries, administration officials and other guests in the majestic Gothic-style sanctuary of the cathedral.

On Thursday the president was on the go all day, from an early morning church appearance to hours in the cold watching the traditional parade down Pennsylvania Avenue to a late night dash through 10 black-tie inaugural balls. The only thing on the president’s public schedule for the first day of his second term was the prayer service.

List of priorities
But there will be little time for him to rest, with all the tasks he has named as priorities for himself and the nation:

Win a war on terror against shadowy, deadly networks.
Establish stability and democracy in Iraq, a deeply divided country where the American casualty rate has even fellow Republicans urging Bush to say more about how he will get the United States out.
Add private investment accounts to Social Security, through an as-yet-undefined plan that has many deeply skeptical.
Simplify a tax code bloated by thousands of provisions that special-interest patrons will be loathe to relinquish.
Limit medical malpractice and class-action jury awards.
Push a “guest worker” immigration plan that conservatives in his own party oppose.
For the immediate future, Bush’s list of most-pressing duties include naming someone to the powerful new post of director of national intelligence, watching the Jan. 30 elections in Iraq and mending still-frayed relations with Europe during his first overseas trip of his second term.

“I’m looking forward to putting my heart and soul into this job for four more years,” he said, making no mention of the legislative battles ahead over taxes, expanding immigration laws, Social Security, the burgeoning budget deficit, judges and more.

Senate went to work Thursday
Eager to begin, the GOP-controlled Senate convened at midafternoon Thursday and confirmed Mike Johanns as secretary of agriculture and Margaret Spellings as secretary of education, the first of Bush’s nine new second-term Cabinet officers to win approval.

Senate Democrats are delaying confirmation of Condoleezza Rice as secretary of state, originally expected on Thursday, until next week. The inauguration, they said, was only a brief respite in their battle against the GOP majority.

Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., chairman of the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, told supporters in a fund-raising e-mail that “when the inauguration bands stop playing and Congress comes back into session, we Democrats will be on guard and ready to fight against the Republicans’ extreme policies once again.”

Bush’s inaugural address was light on specifics and heavy on high-minded symbolism. He pledged to reform “great institutions to serve the needs of our time.”

He talked of the spread of freedom and liberty as the oldest ideals of America, and said, “Now it is the urgent requirement of our nation’s security, and the calling of our time.”

Freedom and liberty cited often
Bush promised that U.S. relations with other countries would turn on how decently they treat their own people. He used the word “tyranny” five times, “liberty” 15 and “freedom” 27.

“We are led, by events and common sense, to one conclusion,” Bush said. “The survival of liberty in our land increasingly depends on the success of liberty in other lands. The best hope for peace in our world is the expansion of freedom in all the world.”

The only reference to Iraq was indirect. “Our country has accepted obligations that are difficult to fulfill and would be dishonorable to abandon,” he said, mindful of impatience on Capitol Hill and in the public.

Instead, he left it to his State of the Union address, due for delivery to the nation in less than two weeks, and his new federal budget, due to Congress on Feb. 7, to flesh out in more detail his second-term goals and how he intends to achieve them.

© 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

[McC]

My opinion of Bush went up a whole lot when I heard about this. I think it's funny as hell that he used the fundamentalists' bigotry and then just dropped them when he was done with them.

Fucking brilliant.

[Alex Moon]

My opinion of Bush went up a whole lot when I heard about this. I think it's funny as hell that he used the fundamentalists' bigotry and then just dropped them when he was done with them.

Fucking brilliant.

Bush's position seems to be that he supports defining marriage as between a man and woman, but that he has no problem with gays being given a similar legal contract such as civil unions. The main problem is that he has to deal with the radical social right in his party which see homosexuality as a disease and homosexuals as less than human.

I'll reiterate, pushing the FMA when he did is probably the best thing Bush could have done for the Gay marriage movement.

[Glocksman]

Well whatever Bush is, he's a consumate politician. The religious Right at worst is not going to come out to the polls as much, but they are never going to go vote for the Democrats, so why beat your head against the wall for them?

We gun nuts heard a similar ('where can they go?') opinion expressed in 1992 by Bush administration insiders after Bill Bennett stabbed us in the back.
As Pappy Bush found out, we can either simply stay home on election day or vote 3rd party for President.

GWB has to give at least the appearance of playing to the fundies or the same thing can happen to the Repubs in 08 that happened between gun owners and Bush v1 back in 92.

[McC]

Bush's position seems to be that he supports defining marriage as between a man and woman, but that he has no problem with gays being given a similar legal contract such as civil unions. The main problem is that he has to deal with the radical social right in his party which see homosexuality as a disease and homosexuals as less than human.

I'll reiterate, pushing the FMA when he did is probably the best thing Bush could have done for the Gay marriage movement.

His personal preference is largely irrelelvant, IMO. A politician is entitled to feel however they want about something personally. It's how they act on it publicly that matters. Bush gave lip service to something that, when one looks at it through unclouded vision, is clearly bigotted in order to get the vote of the bigots. He succeeded. As long as he stays true to his agenda now and just sort of lets the FMA die, he gets points from me for doing to bigots exactly what should be done: use them when they can help and then throw them away again to keep begging for scraps.

I'm sure many will groan when I bring this up, but when Kerry explained his stance on abortion (personally against it, but unwilling to legislate his beliefs), I cheered, 'cause that's exactly what a politician should do.