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Cos Dashit wrote: Not only that, but he was also thinking he had no more need for a lightsaber anymore, as he 'destroyed' the Sith.

The Jedi Order thought (mistakenly, but that's irrelevant) that the Sith were extinct for a thousand years, yet they all still wielded lightsabers in defense of the Galactic Republic.

The existence (or lack thereof) of the Sith has no bearing on the Jedi traditions surrounding lightsabers.

Cykeisme wrote:

Cos Dashit wrote: Not only that, but he was also thinking he had no more need for a lightsaber anymore, as he 'destroyed' the Sith.

The Jedi Order thought (mistakenly, but that's irrelevant) that the Sith were extinct for a thousand years, yet they all still wielded lightsabers in defense of the Galactic Republic.

The existence (or lack thereof) of the Sith has no bearing on the Jedi traditions surrounding lightsabers.

And indeed, they become a staple of Luke's Jedi Order as well, even among Jedi much less indoctrinated by tradition.

Cykeisme wrote:

Cos Dashit wrote: Not only that, but he was also thinking he had no more need for a lightsaber anymore, as he 'destroyed' the Sith.

The Jedi Order thought (mistakenly, but that's irrelevant) that the Sith were extinct for a thousand years, yet they all still wielded lightsabers in defense of the Galactic Republic.

The existence (or lack thereof) of the Sith has no bearing on the Jedi traditions surrounding lightsabers.

I apologize for the confusion, I did not mean a lightsaber would be useless now that the Sith were gone. I meant he would not need it anymore as he was fleeing the Second Death Star.

Cos Dashit wrote:

Cykeisme wrote:

Cos Dashit wrote: Not only that, but he was also thinking he had no more need for a lightsaber anymore, as he 'destroyed' the Sith.

The Jedi Order thought (mistakenly, but that's irrelevant) that the Sith were extinct for a thousand years, yet they all still wielded lightsabers in defense of the Galactic Republic.

The existence (or lack thereof) of the Sith has no bearing on the Jedi traditions surrounding lightsabers.

I apologize for the confusion, I did not mean a lightsaber would be useless now that the Sith were gone. I meant he would not need it anymore as he was fleeing the Second Death Star.

How was Luke supposed to know that he wouldn't run into any resistance? For the three seconds (or so) which would have been required to pick up his lightsabre, he would have been able to competently defend himself against anything. Without it, he would have been far less able to defend himself, and indeed might have had a hard time getting out before the DS2 went kablooey. Indeed, it's possible that he did have to do some fighting on the way out, and we just didn't get to see it.

By the way i did at some point see a drawing of the Emperors Tower being locatet at the "North" pole of the DSII, And in the movie Luke's shuttle clerly takes off from the mid rim docking bays.. thats some distance to drag a body, though i guess it would make sense the the Emperor had a lift going dirrectly from docking bay to his "office".

Good observation, Aquatain. It's quite a distance from the Emperor's throne room tower at north pole to the (at least 636.4km, in a straight line) equatorial docking bays.
You're probably right, too, about the Emperor probably having some sort of private transit system from one to the other, so Luke would only have run into troops before entering the system and after exiting it. By the time he was exiting the hangar end, from what we see, apparently the damage to the station had reached the point where the troops were too disorganized to offer any resistance.

Cos Dashit wrote:I apologize for the confusion, I did not mean a lightsaber would be useless now that the Sith were gone. I meant he would not need it anymore as he was fleeing the Second Death Star.

Ah, I see.. but still, he would need it to defend himself from possible resistance from Imperial troops on the station.

Not only that, it simply wouldn't be logical to leave behind his lightsaber when he could so easily pick it up (with or without TK.. let's not speculate about such mundane details). Don't forget that Jedi have more of a connection to their personal weapon than most folks do.

Deleted Scene:

Lando: Hey Luke, while we were blowing up that reactor something landed on the hull of the Falcon. I think you dropped this.

Luke: Thanks pal! *accepts lightsaber*

Kurgan wrote:Deleted Scene:

Lando: Hey Luke, while we were blowing up that reactor something landed on the hull of the Falcon. I think you dropped this.

Luke: Thanks pal! *accepts lightsaber*

What a conincidence, was this on the 'deleted scenes' section of the DVD or did you find it elsewhere?

To be honest, I doubt they'd, with the exception of the royal guards, offer any resistance. Guy dressed in black, helping a greivously wounded Lord Vader around? I wouldn't think 'rebel assassin' I'd be thinking 'oh shit, that's Vader, crippled. We're screwed.'

Nightbringer wrote:

Kurgan wrote:Deleted Scene:

Lando: Hey Luke, while we were blowing up that reactor something landed on the hull of the Falcon. I think you dropped this.

Luke: Thanks pal! *accepts lightsaber*

What a conincidence, was this on the 'deleted scenes' section of the DVD or did you find it elsewhere?

Um. You do realize Kurgan was being facetious, right?

Nightbringer wrote:

Kurgan wrote:Deleted Scene:

Lando: Hey Luke, while we were blowing up that reactor something landed on the hull of the Falcon. I think you dropped this.

Luke: Thanks pal! *accepts lightsaber*

What a conincidence, was this on the 'deleted scenes' section of the DVD or did you find it elsewhere?

POOMA, actually. Or maybe he just swiped one of Sideous/Vader's lightsabers that was in the shuttle hold and just retuned it. Also, POOMA, just in case there was any doubt!

NecronLord wrote:To be honest, I doubt they'd, with the exception of the royal guards, offer any resistance. Guy dressed in black, helping a greivously wounded Lord Vader around? I wouldn't think 'rebel assassin' I'd be thinking 'oh shit, that's Vader, crippled. We're screwed.'

I always wondered why no-one stopped to help Luke and Vader. You'd think there'd be at least one guy there wanting to suck up to someone like Vader, get a little extra insurance when it comes to 'someone's made a mistake' time and Vader's on a tear looking for someone to blame.

NecronLord wrote:To be honest, I doubt they'd, with the exception of the royal guards, offer any resistance. Guy dressed in black, helping a greivously wounded Lord Vader around? I wouldn't think 'rebel assassin' I'd be thinking 'oh shit, that's Vader, crippled. We're screwed.'

This is what I was basing my point around. What are a couple storm troopers versus a Vader-killer?

Crazy_Vasey wrote:

NecronLord wrote:To be honest, I doubt they'd, with the exception of the royal guards, offer any resistance. Guy dressed in black, helping a greivously wounded Lord Vader around? I wouldn't think 'rebel assassin' I'd be thinking 'oh shit, that's Vader, crippled. We're screwed.'

I always wondered why no-one stopped to help Luke and Vader. You'd think there'd be at least one guy there wanting to suck up to someone like Vader, get a little extra insurance when it comes to 'someone's made a mistake' time and Vader's on a tear looking for someone to blame.

Well, there is always the chaos that disrupted the rest of the fleet when Palpatine died and Declann dropped his meditation. Perhaps the crews of the Death Star got an extra dose of dispair for being so close to the death, and thus really stopped caring about anything except getting off the station. The few officers you see in the background on the hangar deck look very, very paniced.

This is what I was basing my point around. What are a couple storm troopers versus a Vader-killer?

As someone pointed out, a couple thousand. There's a big difference, and its been conclusively shown that even the most powerful Force users are volunerable to massed and concentrated fire.

Cos Dashit wrote:

Oh okay, the Imperial Guards. Yes, they would have fought Anakin, but it was shown in RotS that you could take them out easily with the Force. Also, the novelization of RotS shows that Jedi-mind tricks work on them.

Imperial guards are force sensitive and armed with high powered blasters. Just because Yoda can pound them effortlessly does not mean Luke can. Taking you only weapon, would make a great deal of sense.

There is at least one other lightsaber to account for, namely the one Luke used after losing his father's lightsaber in The Empire Strikes Back and building his new one in Shadows of the Empire (all of the stories in which he uses this lightsaber are in the Marvel comics). It is commonly accepted that this was the lightsaber previously used by the Baron Tagge, which Luke may have taken after having killed him in 1980's "In Mortal Combat!"

As it happens, his sister also has a handful of lightsabers, including the Galactic Emperor's lightsaber, which she stole from him on Byss in Dark Empire.

Spartan wrote:Cos Dashit wrote:

Oh okay, the Imperial Guards. Yes, they would have fought Anakin, but it was shown in RotS that you could take them out easily with the Force. Also, the novelization of RotS shows that Jedi-mind tricks work on them.

Imperial guards are force sensitive and armed with high powered blasters. Just because Yoda can pound them effortlessly does not mean Luke can. Taking you only weapon, would make a great deal of sense.

Since when do Imperial Guards carry around blasters? I thought they carry vibro-swords exclusively. As for them being Force-sensititve, Yoda and Obi-Wan use their Jedi-Mind Tricks on four of them not problem in the RotS novelization.

The weapons of the crimson Royal Guards are referred to as "Force Pikes".. a sort of spear, but with some technological means of inflicting more damage than normal.
The Royal Guards may be somewhat Force sensitive with rudimentary training (probably a bit of precog), but they're clearly still no match for a Jedi Knight.

Nevertheless, it's ridiculous for Luke to leave his lightsaber behind. He spent all that effort building it, he's a Jedi with an emotional bond to his weapon, and it's just a few feet away.


As for troops, the Death Star interior is corridors and hallways, not a massive open battlefield. There's no way for thousands of stormtroopers to engage him simultaneously. If there were any engagements, they probably looked pretty much like Obi-Wan and Yoda taking on a couple of squads of the 501st outside the Jedi Temple two decades prior.

Also, as NecronLord pointed out, even in their post-deEmperorization confusion and panic, the troops would not identify a black-clad man who was clearly aiding Lord Vader as a foe, unless he attacked them first.

Cykeisme wrote:Nevertheless, it's ridiculous for Luke to leave his lightsaber behind. He spent all that effort building it, he's a Jedi with an emotional bond to his weapon, and it's just a few feet away.

He shouldn't have an emotional bond with it; it should have no sentimental value to him whatsoever. He should be able to leave it behind no problem.

Cos Dashit wrote:

Cykeisme wrote:Nevertheless, it's ridiculous for Luke to leave his lightsaber behind. He spent all that effort building it, he's a Jedi with an emotional bond to his weapon, and it's just a few feet away.

He shouldn't have an emotional bond with it; it should have no sentimental value to him whatsoever. He should be able to leave it behind no problem.

Why shouldn't he? That was the whole essence of the "Build your own lightsabre" doctrine.

Remember Obiwan lecturing Anakin?

Yeah, but who says any of that was given to Luke? He seems willing enough to toss aside his saber to make a point!

PainRack wrote:

Cos Dashit wrote:

Cykeisme wrote:Nevertheless, it's ridiculous for Luke to leave his lightsaber behind. He spent all that effort building it, he's a Jedi with an emotional bond to his weapon, and it's just a few feet away.

He shouldn't have an emotional bond with it; it should have no sentimental value to him whatsoever. He should be able to leave it behind no problem.

Why shouldn't he? That was the whole essence of the "Build your own lightsabre" doctrine.

Remember Obiwan lecturing Anakin?

Building your own lightsaber was simply a test for a hopeful Jedi to see if he was Force-sensitive. And yes, Obi-Wan lectured Anakin for losing his lightsabers, but not for sentimental reasons. It is a weapon that they need to protect themselves. Jedi should not have any emotional attachment to anything, besides perhaps their Padawan braid, they should only look at their lightsaber as a tool, nothing more.

Cykeisme wrote:As for troops, the Death Star interior is corridors and hallways, not a massive open battlefield. There's no way for thousands of stormtroopers to engage him simultaneously. If there were any engagements, they probably looked pretty much like Obi-Wan and Yoda taking on a couple of squads of the 501st outside the Jedi Temple two decades prior.

I just had the best image of Luke dropping Vader everytime some Stormtrooper squad comes up to him and before he attacks goes "Sorry dad, wait a sec."

Look, emotional bond or not, the point is, it's ridiculous to leave your weapon behind when it's so easy to pick it up, particularly when you're in the midst of a moon-sized enemy battle station.
It'd be ridiculous for Luke to have left it behind even if it was a blaster.

Ghost Rider wrote:

Cykeisme wrote:As for troops, the Death Star interior is corridors and hallways, not a massive open battlefield. There's no way for thousands of stormtroopers to engage him simultaneously. If there were any engagements, they probably looked pretty much like Obi-Wan and Yoda taking on a couple of squads of the 501st outside the Jedi Temple two decades prior.

I just had the best image of Luke dropping Vader everytime some Stormtrooper squad comes up to him and before he attacks goes "Sorry dad, wait a sec."

Either that or dashing into squads of stormies with Vader still slung over his back.. "hang on dad, here we go again!"

Maybe he used his dad's body as a battering ram to get through the troops, like something out of "The Simpsons" video game.