Empire: Total War review - experience thread

[ray245]

Colour me shocked, it's the same game again on a new engine with boats on land naval battles, didn't see that one coming!

Why do you hate CA's freedom to produce broken, unfinished games? I lol'd when I found out instead of a new engine it's just Rome 1.5 with new Boat Action, even with that AA thing still there.

BCG, that firepower stat shit fucking shits me. Heaps of games do it, and it means you get a totally misleading number that may represent some ideal time-averaged dps but doesn't tell you shit about how many of it's guns are good against xyz or allow you to make a decision beyond 'somehow this is better than this other one'. I know, CA obfuscating unit stats is unheard of.

One reason may be due to an lack of competition in this kind of genre, which makes them has less incentive to actually improve on their total war series.

[Stark]

Grow up, idiot. Stop drooling and defending your precious CA; the trend BCG and I are talking about is present in ALL KINDS OF GAMES, especially RTS games, and NOT JUST TOTAL WAR GAMES. They hide statistics because they can't design interfaces for shit, same reason they can't make a tutorial that actually teaches you to play the game. The answer might just be that CA are a pack of retards.

Relic might make bad games, but at least they're clearly TRYING.

[Thanas]

Grow up, idiot. Stop drooling and defending your precious CA; the trend BCG and I are talking about is present in ALL KINDS OF GAMES, especially RTS games, and NOT JUST TOTAL WAR GAMES. They hide statistics because they can't design interfaces for shit, same reason they can't make a tutorial that actually teaches you to play the game. The answer might just be that CA are a pack of retards.

Relic might make bad games, but at least they're clearly TRYING.

Stark, I think you misread his post - what he was saying was that CA has little competition in that market sector, thus no real incentive to change. Ray is far from being a mindless CA supporter and has been quite critical of the game.

[Stark]

Really? Oh. My post was making fun of CA for sucking, I'm not sure how 'no competition' means it's not funny they're so hopeless. Even said, there is a small genre of TW-alikes around, but due to nerd brand loyalty and the need to play the same game over and over with different skins, nobody plays them. Biggest strategy release of year = biggest strategy release of 2005 with a mod over the top... that's pretty funny to me. Sorry if I misunderstood, Ray.

[PeZook]

Actually, all TW alikes are even more horrible than current crop of TWs.

[Stark]

Doesn't surprise me (I've seen the box art) but they certainly exist. I guess if anyone thought it was worth it they'd enter the market, but nobody really competes with civ either and it's shit and a nerd favourite too.

[Resinence]

Doesn't surprise me (I've seen the box art) but they certainly exist. I guess if anyone thought it was worth it they'd enter the market, but nobody really competes with civ either and it's shit and a nerd favourite too.

The cult of Sid Meier is great, literally every game with his name on it made in the last decade is a remake of a remake.

So if I understand right, in empire the "firepower" stat is completely misleading and your supposed to take into account the number of men instead? Because it seems like "teh uber" rangers and sniper teams longmusket men get torn to shreds by basic line infantry. Also in an all skirmisher army made for ambushes the "leader" unit can't conceal them self at all, no matter the terrain. Players wanting to use alternative tactics? Fuck'em, they can use line infantry spam like they should!

I also had 7 sloops pummeling a pirate fluyt for like a minute and never managed to sink it - the stupid attack AI tries to enforce "duels" and it sunk every single one. Fun I guess?

I am trying to enjoy this game but it's just... I don't want to say anti-fun, but I enjoyed MTW much more than this game.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Fluyts and galleons are stupidly unbalanced right now; I don't bother fighting them unless I have an entire squadron of frigates. Also, don't just click to attack, I don't know why that's even a "feature" - it's useless and encourages a very flawed approach to naval combat. In almost all circumstances you want to form your vessels up line astern and maneuver your line around as a cohesive unit so that as many of your guns as possible get their arcs on enemy targets.

Also, I take back what I said about firepower. It is completely broken beyond recognition. I attacked a bunch of Moroccan galleys and light galleys because the fucking retarded AI was just sitting there blocking movement into the Mediterranean (stupid). That's all they have - just a dozen and a half fucking galleys and light galleys. I've got a 2nd rate, 3 3rd rates, and 2 5th rates to escort them... turkey shoot, I says.

Silly me.

My admiral's 3rd rate was the first to sink, followed swiftly by the 2nd rate. I just quit the program at that point. An 86 gun ship getting sunk by a bunch of... 4-gun boats? It's like a carrier group being attacked and sunk by a bunch of Somali pirates in motorboats.

I knew something was seriously, seriously wrong when the first pass of my line left my 2nd rate in yellow health and only 3 of the first 6 light galleys had surrendered.

[Thanas]

The firepower stat is broken because CA likely did forget a variable when concerning the damage effects of the galley guns. When you take that in account, it makes sense. Galleys have a firepower rating of 256 - which is also the same as a 3rd rate. So bear in mind that the game calculates your ships getting a full broadside of a 3rd rate everytime the cannons hit - and that the game calculates a 100% hit rate due to 4 cannonballs always hitting a target that size - and it makes sense.

Sheer laziness, as usual. I cannot believe this never came up in a beta test. Or CA simply did not do any beta test at all.

The mediterranean blocking thingy has happened to me several times (before the AI turn bug killed my savegames), forcing me to essentially declaring war on my allies several times because otherwise I couldn't move troops around.

[ray245]

Doesn't surprise me (I've seen the box art) but they certainly exist. I guess if anyone thought it was worth it they'd enter the market, but nobody really competes with civ either and it's shit and a nerd favourite too.

Hell, you know how many total war fans even complained about ETW when it was announced? That the different era means their old tactics cannot work so well, and the only total war game CA should be focusing on is Rome 2 Total war, followed by Rome 3 total war and etc.

[Stark]

I certainly do, and I'm not going to defend idiots and their conservatism. CA is still allegedly a software maker, and when it just plain doesn't work right that's their fault.

Thanas, these says we don't call it 'beta testing', rather it's 'marketing exercise' in the modern phrase. Most 'betas' these days are finished games they let some people play to build buzz, and CA is far from the only developer that misses obvious giant flaws in their game. Ever play Sins?

[Thanas]

Thanas, these says we don't call it 'beta testing', rather it's 'marketing exercise' in the modern phrase. Most 'betas' these days are finished games they let some people play to build buzz, and CA is far from the only developer that misses obvious giant flaws in their game. Ever play Sins?

Nope, but then I only buy about 2-3 computer games per year so the state of the industry really escapes me.

I first thought the huge problems with M:TW 2 were just CA failing to adapt to a new engine...then I remember that it is essentially the same engine as Rome had...and then I remember that compared to ETW, MTW2 was freaking golden when it came to stability and balancing etc.

But hey, I guess SEGA needs cash infusions fast.

[ray245]

I certainly do, and I'm not going to defend idiots and their conservatism. CA is still allegedly a software maker, and when it just plain doesn't work right that's their fault.

I would think that both groups are at fault. I have to wonder, how many months does it take for us to have enough patches for a stable game?

In regards to balancing, I would think those mods made a better job at balancing that CA themselves.

[Stark]

'Both groups are at fault' is a meaningless statement. How do you apportion blame? Why does it even matter? If I build a wall that falls down who gives a shit how many chicks with huge tits said it was fine that way? CA games have always had problems and bugs, end of story. The historical element is connected to their laziness but doesn't impact actual gameplay as much as the bugs, lack of polish and interface issues. If you want to prove CA are even average on the scale of 'games developers making broken games', prove it, don't piss about with 'oh but nerds like it anyway'. Halo Wars was the highest selling game in Australia the week it came out; doesn't change the fact it's simplistic nonsense with awful script-based missions.

[ray245]

'Both groups are at fault' is a meaningless statement. How do you apportion blame? Why does it even matter? If I build a wall that falls down who gives a shit how many chicks with huge tits said it was fine that way? CA games have always had problems and bugs, end of story. The historical element is connected to their laziness but doesn't impact actual gameplay as much as the bugs, lack of polish and interface issues. If you want to prove CA are even average on the scale of 'games developers making broken games', prove it, don't piss about with 'oh but nerds like it anyway'. Halo Wars was the highest selling game in Australia the week it came out; doesn't change the fact it's simplistic nonsense with awful script-based missions.

You are right in saying CA's fault is far greater than the fans of course, given the fact they are developing a game with so many bugs that cannot be fixed by the modding community alone.

[Stark]

Even if it COULD be fixed by modders, CA still suck for making such a broken game to start with. I know it's old fashioned, but when I buy things I expect them to work. Software is a tricky case so there's leeway, but when you do a CA and take months to fix shit like 'cannons firing arrows' and such, that's absurd.

[wautd]

Also, I take back what I said about firepower. It is completely broken beyond recognition. I attacked a bunch of Moroccan galleys and light galleys

Yeah, I just found that out the hard way as well. Even if those galleys had above average sized cannons, they're doing a rediculous amount of damage. Adding insult to injury, they are pretty tough as well for there hard-to-hit size

[Acidburns]

The mediterranean blocking thingy has happened to me several times (before the AI turn bug killed my savegames), forcing me to essentially declaring war on my allies several times because otherwise I couldn't move troops around.

You can request military access for 5 turns or whatever the minimum is and your ships can then pass.

[wautd]

Instead of destroying the Maroccan navy with their galleys of doom, I just dropped an army in their desert. Marocco immediatly dispatched an army to intercept, but they got slaughtered by my superior, civilized soldiers. After their defeat, the Maroccan king offered me to become my protectiorate which I accepted because I thought it was kinda neat (I can't remember the AI offering/accepting to become a protectorate ever in the previous games).

Sadly, now the Straight of Gibraltar is still being blocked by some galleys, but at least I've carved trough Austria to have access to a mediterranean sea harbour.

[ray245]

Will auto-resolve produce a more reasonable result against the Maroccan navy?

[Resinence]

Assuming your force strength is higher then yeah it can win the fight for you and you take much less losses than having everything obliterated by doomships galley's. The problem is it's basically impossible to win with a smaller force because you can't simply outplay them like normal - they are just too insane, and the autoresolve will probably cause you to lose.

I tried BCG's tip of manually controlling my ships and attacking from astern, and yeah it seems to work much better then the attack AI which is friggen useless. But I'm finding that unlike previous TW's I'm really struggling to keep everything funded and I'm falling WAY behind when it comes to research. Is there some special thing I should be doing to speed it up?
At least now that I have my own unbalanced broken fluyt fleets I can keep them out of my ports, I like the Dutch' starting positions in each theater (island colonies, good navy, easy to defend) but it's basically compulsory to end up at war with spain and france which is a serious pain in the neck, they are MUCH bigger at the start of the game. Constantly dispatching groups to chase off their single militia raiding parties is getting really tedious.

[wautd]

I like the fact that galleys can use their ram though

[Thanas]

You can request military access for 5 turns or whatever the minimum is and your ships can then pass.

Have you ever tried it? Even getting them as protectorates does not work.

[Thanas]

I tried BCG's tip of manually controlling my ships and attacking from astern, and yeah it seems to work much better then the attack AI which is friggen useless. But I'm finding that unlike previous TW's I'm really struggling to keep everything funded and I'm falling WAY behind when it comes to research. Is there some special thing I should be doing to speed it up?

Send Gentlemen to universities of other countries and steal their research.

[wautd]

and I'm falling WAY behind when it comes to research.

I took some years before I realized that while I had a couple of universities, only the university of my main province was doing some research. I assumed it could be managed automatically (like taxes), but appearantly you have to manually start a research project when you conquer a new university.