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I could see that being a wacky ten minute adventure at the start. But why would one dedicate a film to Spock's need to get home and mate?

Spock wouldn't necessarily have to go back to Vulcan. He could just have sex with Uhura. Problem solved.

Darksider wrote:IIRC TUC is the next most successful and most fondly remembered Trek film after Wrath of Kahn, so I think they'll go there next.

But that means we'll miss the moment where Kirk kills God.

Lilgreenman wrote:I actually think that the next one will be their take on Amok Time - 2261 will be the right time for Spock's pon farr, which both Quinto and Saldana have said they want to explore; and they get to sex up the movie without having Kirk shout at a girl in lingerie for no reason.

No, the "After Darkness" comic is already taking care of the Pon Farr thing. They're already at New Vulcan to deal with it.

In comics... Where it belongs.

Gandalf wrote:I could see that being a wacky ten minute adventure at the start. But why would one dedicate a film to Spock's need to get home and mate?

Everybody buckle up for the soup being thrown into the hall in 3D!

Literally the least exciting scenario, I'd love to see the Doomsday machine, or maybe the planet of the apes one they did with the yangs and the constitution.

Or they could just go for A Piece of the Action.

I want a farcical big budget comedy.

Themightytom wrote:

Gandalf wrote:I could see that being a wacky ten minute adventure at the start. But why would one dedicate a film to Spock's need to get home and mate?

Everybody buckle up for the soup being thrown into the hall in 3D!

Literally the least exciting scenario, I'd love to see the Doomsday machine, or maybe the planet of the apes one they did with the yangs and the constitution.

The doomsday machine would be good. That episode is one of my favourites.

Edit: however, I don't want them to just remake old stories.

And yet you have seen both movies.

Havok wrote:And yet you have seen both movies.

Both have done some new things, and I don't care enough to boycott them over it.

What have they done new honestly? They tweaked things, but everything has ended right where it was supposed to be. (Even Vulcan being destroyed... I mean, who cares? They have NEW Vulcan now. ) I find the originality of what they are doing the least appealing, as to me, there isn't any.
As I have said, it is the new actors that are driving me to see the movies, not the rehashed stories in the slightest.

New things include the destruction of Vulcan (the survivors may have settled on a new planet but it's not Vulcan and their aren't a lot of them), Spock and Uhura's relationship, and Carol Marcus joining the Enterprise's crew among other things.

Fucking New Trek is even more illogical, inconsistent than Old Trek

Plot holes:
1) Warp speed from Earth to Kronos was in minutes (definitely less than an hour). What the hell?
2) Supposedly the Enterprise would park the Neutral Zone and bombard Kronos. Let's handwave and say the neutral zone is half the distance between Earth and Kronos. Since when did torpedoes (I don't care how "long range" they are) become ICBMs?
3) Earth is undefended. Ships can warp in unchallenged. Ships can crash into the fucking STARFLEET HEADQUARTERS. Why don't the Romulans/Klingons and just wipe Starfleet off the map??? After all, it would like maybe a grand total of ONE HOUR to assemble their fleet and another HOUR tops to warp to Earth and blast it into bits.
4) Five-year mission.... you got to be fucking kidding me. Since we can basically cover a substantial portion of the Alpha Quadrant (Earth to Kronos) in less than HOUR, where are we going to go? Visit the Borg in the Delta Quadrant perhaps??? Given the "speed" of New Trek drives, one can probably reach the Delta Quadrant in a month or two...

This movie just made me PUKE.

AndroAsc wrote:1) Warp speed from Earth to Kronos was in minutes (definitely less than an hour). What the hell?

Who knows. Warp speeds have always been inconsistent in Trek. Based on the fact that at warp 4.5 it took the NX-01 just four days to travel the distance, and presumably this E-new is going to be at least as fast as the E-nil, then hours makes sense.

AndroAsc wrote:2) Supposedly the Enterprise would park the Neutral Zone and bombard Kronos. Let's handwave and say the neutral zone is half the distance between Earth and Kronos. Since when did torpedoes (I don't care how "long range" they are) become ICBMs?

Long range warp torpedoes were established back in TNG.

AndroAsc wrote:3) Earth is undefended. Ships can warp in unchallenged. Ships can crash into the fucking STARFLEET HEADQUARTERS. Why don't the Romulans/Klingons and just wipe Starfleet off the map??? After all, it would like maybe a grand total of ONE HOUR to assemble their fleet and another HOUR tops to warp to Earth and blast it into bits.

The first movie established there were unseen defenses of some sort around Earth, and in this movie presumably the Vengeance was squawking the correct IFF codes to avoid being blown out of the sky.

TimothyC wrote:<snip>

AndroAsc wrote:2) Supposedly the Enterprise would park the Neutral Zone and bombard Kronos. Let's handwave and say the neutral zone is half the distance between Earth and Kronos. Since when did torpedoes (I don't care how "long range" they are) become ICBMs?

Long range warp torpedoes were established back in TNG.<snip>

Photon Torpedoes have warp sustainers and can travel in warp if launched at warp. They can't go into warp on their own.

They did have probes equipped with miniature warp drives according to the Tech Manual (and the probe K'Ehleyr used to get to the E-D in "The Emissary" was inferred to have its own warp drive), so it's probably not out of the question for the Abrams-verse to have miniaturized warp drives to the point where they can be placed into a photon torpedo.

AndroAsc wrote:Fucking New Trek is even more illogical, inconsistent than Old Trek

Plot holes:
1) Warp speed from Earth to Kronos was in minutes (definitely less than an hour). What the hell?

As has been said, warp speed is remarkably inconsistent throughout the run of the "old universe" Trek. Furthermore, it's clear that nuTrek's development of warp technology took a vastly different track than "old" Trek. The visuals are substantially different. (For example, nuTrek ships appear to leave fairy dust behind ... maybe they achieve all that extra speed because they're just brute-forcing the problem and leaving lots of pollution behind.)

2) Supposedly the Enterprise would park the Neutral Zone and bombard Kronos. Let's handwave and say the neutral zone is half the distance between Earth and Kronos. Since when did torpedoes (I don't care how "long range" they are) become ICBMs?

As has been said, torpedoes in "old" Trek could be fired at warp and stay in warp. Also, the torpedoes seen in the nuTrek film were special torpedoes. They've been specifically designed to carry out pinpoint strikes from ludicrous distances.

3) Earth is undefended. Ships can warp in unchallenged. Ships can crash into the fucking STARFLEET HEADQUARTERS. Why don't the Romulans/Klingons and just wipe Starfleet off the map??? After all, it would like maybe a grand total of ONE HOUR to assemble their fleet and another HOUR tops to warp to Earth and blast it into bits.

Nothing new here. Remember all those episodes where the Enterprise was the only ship available to deal with the quantum space-wedgie of the week? Also, it's unclear whether or not the Romulans or Klingons actually have the technical capability, strategic reserve, or political inclination necessary to carry out such a strike. For all we know, they're still puttering around with slow "old" Trek warp drives made from explodium.

4) Five-year mission.... you got to be fucking kidding me. Since we can basically cover a substantial portion of the Alpha Quadrant (Earth to Kronos) in less than HOUR, where are we going to go? Visit the Borg in the Delta Quadrant perhaps??? Given the "speed" of New Trek drives, one can probably reach the Delta Quadrant in a month or two...

The trip from Earth to the edge of Klingon territory was made (presumably) near the limit of capability of the Enterprise's warp drive (given the time-sensitive nature of the operation ... presumably if they took their sweet time getting into position, "Harrison" would've gotten away.) It also included no stopovers. A five year mission would probably not call on the ship to constantly be at "Ludicrous Speed," and would certainly demand that they stop and do things like investigate quantum negative space-wedgies, observe alien civilizations, participate in First Contact scenarios, build up star maps, and carry out Stargate Command's Starfleet's mission of seeking out new and useful technologies for Federation research and development.

Yeah, the weirdest inconsistency of Into Darkness was the neo-DeLorean fairy dust that the warping Enterprise leaves behind. What was so wrong with the warp effect in the last movie that now we have to have blue steamers?

Lilgreenman wrote:Yeah, the weirdest inconsistency of Into Darkness was the neo-DeLorean fairy dust that the warping Enterprise leaves behind. What was so wrong with the warp effect in the last movie that now we have to have blue steamers?

It was to show off the 3D effect I think.

DaveJB wrote:They did have probes equipped with miniature warp drives according to the Tech Manual (and the probe K'Ehleyr used to get to the E-D in "The Emissary" was inferred to have its own warp drive), so it's probably not out of the question for the Abrams-verse to have miniaturized warp drives to the point where they can be placed into a photon torpedo.

So instead of a warhead they use warp drives? Probes are not torpedoes. If they use the same housing then of course they'd swap out the warhead for equipment needed for the probes.

If you're going to add warp drives to torpedoes then it won't have room for the warhead. If they can add warp drives to Photorps then they're more advanced than post-Voyager UFP.

Enigma wrote:If you're going to add warp drives to torpedoes then it won't have room for the warhead. If they can add warp drives to Photorps then they're more advanced than post-Voyager UFP.

Are the torpedo warp drives powered by anti-matter ?

If so, and your aiming at a planet with an atmosphere, you don't need a warhead. You just need the anti-matter containment to fail.

Enigma wrote:So instead of a warhead they use warp drives? Probes are not torpedoes. If they use the same housing then of course they'd swap out the warhead for equipment needed for the probes.

If you're going to add warp drives to torpedoes then it won't have room for the warhead.

K'Ehleyr's modified probe was launched from a starbase and accelerated to warp, and still had enough room left over for her and her life support system. That should be more than enough space and mass for a warhead.

Captain Seafort wrote:

Enigma wrote:So instead of a warhead they use warp drives? Probes are not torpedoes. If they use the same housing then of course they'd swap out the warhead for equipment needed for the probes.

If you're going to add warp drives to torpedoes then it won't have room for the warhead.

K'Ehleyr's modified probe was launched from a starbase and accelerated to warp, and still had enough room left over for her and her life support system. That should be more than enough space and mass for a warhead.

Yet it has never been shown nor mentioned in any ST series. Seriously, if it could be done then you'd have the Enterprise (whatever variant) staying still and peppering the enemy with torps without moving. Therefore, currently cannot be done.

Enigma wrote: Yet it has never been shown nor mentioned in any ST series. Seriously, if it could be done then you'd have the Enterprise (whatever variant) staying still and peppering the enemy with torps without moving. Therefore, currently cannot be done.

Theoretically, isn't that just the point where you're throwing around a warp core anyway, given the anti-matter safeties you'd need to hold the energy in and tap it for warp speed? It could, theoretically, be done since torpedoes are tactical matter/antimatter weapons anyway. You'd just be throwing around a relative nuke instead of a stick of tnt, if you don't mind the analogy. Hell they do detonate the warp core in Insurrection as an act of desperation after all.

Gaidin wrote:

Enigma wrote: Yet it has never been shown nor mentioned in any ST series. Seriously, if it could be done then you'd have the Enterprise (whatever variant) staying still and peppering the enemy with torps without moving. Therefore, currently cannot be done.

Theoretically, isn't that just the point where you're throwing around a warp core anyway, given the anti-matter safeties you'd need to hold the energy in and tap it for warp speed? It could, theoretically, be done since torpedoes are tactical matter/antimatter weapons anyway. You'd just be throwing around a relative nuke instead of a stick of tnt, if you don't mind the analogy. Hell they do detonate the warp core in Insurrection as an act of desperation after all.

Torps have warp sustainers which tap into the warhead to maintain warp. The longer it is in warp, the weaker the torp becomes when it detonates.

Detonating a photon (or quantum) torpedo is just the same as a warp core breach but on a smaller scale. Both involve M\AM interaction. Why make it super complicated?