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Crayz9000 wrote:

Sea Skimmer wrote:It flew through, employed weapons under constant human control with a steaming video feed no less, and then flew back.

I don't recall any Predators broadcasting demon porn from Hell... ever.

from Armageddon!! Chapter 5

The operator manipulated his controls, getting the vision head on the electro-optical pod to pivot around. The pictures swirled, grotesque and unfamiliar but still vaguely recognizable. The imagery was coming back, that had enormous consequences.

“Tell Washington, and everybody else, Phase One is complete. We got the bird in and we’re getting data out. There is something the other side of that gate and we can get at it.” The agent’s voice broke into a chuckle. “No huge letters of fire yet, now we’ll try and change all that.”

He played with the optical head again, looking for something important. He found it, at least it seemed important. Some sort of review stand at a far part of the field. The Predator was closing in on it, the trouble seemed to be that it was hard to judge ranges in the red-clouded murk. A quick flash with the laser rangefinder built into the Predator told him what he needed to know. The target was four thousand yards away, easily within range of the two Hellfire missiles hanging under the Predator’s wings. He locked their homing heads onto the stand and fired them both.

Bolding mine. They had a UAV inside the hellmouth and were able to not only operate it remotely, but receive real-time data and visual images.

Kodiak wrote:

Crayz9000 wrote:

Sea Skimmer wrote:It flew through, employed weapons under constant human control with a steaming video feed no less, and then flew back.

I don't recall any Predators broadcasting demon porn from Hell... ever.

...

Bolding mine. They had a UAV inside the hellmouth and were able to not only operate it remotely, but receive real-time data and visual images.

I don't think you quite read what Sea Skimmer miswrote and Crayz wrote, there. Take a second look.

Edit: Cut down the quoting a tad.

Sea Skimmer wrote:

Ted C wrote: Uhm... I dispute your conclusion. Portals do NOT pass electromagnetic radiation, because they had to run wire from the Earth side to the Hell side of the Iraq portal to establish communications. Further, the simple fact that a portal looks like a black ellipse rather than an elliptical "window" to the other side makes it obvious that visible light, at least, does not freely pass through a portal.

Visible light might not pass, but radio waves sure as shit do. This was explicitly demonstrated by the fact that the first human weapon to pass through the portal ever back in Armageddon was a radio controlled Predator drone. It flew through, employed weapons under constant human control with a steaming video feed no less, and then flew back.

Yep, I did go back and read Chapter 5 of Armageddon and confirm that at least some radio frequencies will cross a portal.

Baughn wrote:Well, you still have to explain why the wire doesn't fall apart, with the near-field electrostatic effect meant to keep its distinct molecules connected apparently (not) blocked.

We have plenty of ways of shielding against various wavelengths of EM radiation in real-life which do not nullify the near-field electrostatic effect. Why should we prefer this explanation for the fact that portals are black?

PhilosopherOfSorts wrote: Something that I have read, (I think on this board, actually) is that a good general must love his men, but a great general must be willing to destroy that which he loves.

I know for sure that something very simular to this line is in Enders Game by Orson Scott Card. (I can't recall if this line was in Killer Angels as well as it has been too long since I have read it.)

Darth Wong wrote:

Baughn wrote:Well, you still have to explain why the wire doesn't fall apart, with the near-field electrostatic effect meant to keep its distinct molecules connected apparently (not) blocked.

We have plenty of ways of shielding against various wavelengths of EM radiation in real-life which do not nullify the near-field electrostatic effect. Why should we prefer this explanation for the fact that portals are black?

Since nothing actually falls apart, high-frequency EM radiation is blocked and low-frequency is not, your explanation is obviously correct: The portal acts as a low-pass filter of some sort.

I'd never previously considered this, though. Putting it all together, it implies that a portal cannot be a traditional wormhole, or anything resembling one; those are just pieces of joined-up space-time, and should locally (ignoring the edges) act just like any other piece of space-time, perhaps with high gravitational gradients or some such.

A low-pass filter.. there are plenty of materials that act as such, yes. My surprise comes from the portal not being a material, as such. It implies a considerably richer set of laws governing how portals work than what would be required for mere wormholes.

Yeah, as I said above, the only way I can see it working is for the portal to be a region of space with weird physical constants. Or, now that I think about it, having some kind of structure that interacts with EM radiation passing through.

...holy crap. Did we just go over a day with *no* posts to this thread?!

That's gotta be a first...

Yes, and we were trying for two. Thanks a lot.

OK, So I've been on vacation I'm back now and the next part should be up over the weekend unless something horrible happens.

Heh. Someone just made some edits at the TVTropes article basically saying the story sucks for all the usual reasons. Oh, and we here at Stardestroyer.net have no concept of dramatic tension, too. Fairly blatant trolling.

You know you're riling up someone's feathers when some jackass starts trolling your TVTropes article.

<TWITCH> <TWITCH> <TWITCH>

god damn why do these trolls have to ruin a good site? Their probably christian fundies

Putting the "fun" in fundamentalism since...a long, long time ago.

If you want some real fun, go to the discussion page - just click the "discuss" button at the top. We've had a clutch of fundie morons (I've no objection to fundamentalists per se although I have grave doubts about any group who claim to have the absolute truth on anything but moronic fundamentalists irritate me), allf rom the same place - a mid-west university - turning up. It's painfully obvious that none of them have ever read the books and they've all been winding each other up. So let's wind them up some more

The point about them ruining good sites is very valid though, TVtropes is a truly great site; it's fun, informative and a joy to read. Seeing these sour-minded curmudgeons trying to spoil it is very dispiriting.

I love how the guy on the discussion page seems to think that just because Stuart has a few typos that that he isn't qualified to chew someone out on reading comprehension and bad logic.

Peptuck wrote:I love how the guy on the discussion page seems to think that just because Stuart has a few typos that that he isn't qualified to chew someone out on reading comprehension and bad logic.

And the really funny thing is that his own comments are typo-riddled. I'm not sure whether the current moron is one of the fundies; he's behaving a little differently from the average.

Not to be rude, but I have a lot of fanboy questions

Is Kathryn Branch gonna appear again?

Are the Baldricks gonna take part in the invasion of heaven, cause that would be so awesome, Hell getting their vengance.

Is Abigor gonna appear again?

How is North Korea's character arc gonna end?

Who in heaven is involved in the Old One's conspiracy, and which Chayot have they recruited?

Is heaven based on Dante's depiction in Paradiso?

Whew, glad I got that Nerdgasmic burst out of the way.

In answer to your questions - wait and see

We're only half way through at this point

why must you torture us you sick bastard why (just kidding, but seriously, the stress is annoying.

Darth Yan wrote:why must you torture us you sick bastard why.

Because I'm a sick bastard. What can I say? I'm just so good at it.

I'll tell you what, I'll give you one spoiler. Spoiler Actually, the "discussion" on TVtropes TSW Discuss is getting to be fun. I've just rat-trapped a fundie into position where he either admits that gods do not exist or he has to concede the argument. He'll probably try and weasel out somehow though. Come on over guys, this is fun.

PS just discovered the raving fundie is from Alabama. Why does this not surprise me?

With the apparent low-band pass effect of portals in mind, could one be used to block gamma radiation?

What happens to the radiation that's blocked, exactly?

sadly alabama is one of the shitholes of the US. and i'm gland branch shows up. Maybe she'll get ostraised. And I hope Yahweh is captured and put on trial. COnsidering all the pain he's inflicted, he so deserves it.

Stuart wrote:

Darth Yan wrote:why must you torture us you sick bastard why.

Because I'm a sick bastard. What can I say? I'm just so good at it.

Yan, he has a point, that is a self-answering question.

Baughn wrote:With the apparent low-band pass effect of portals in mind, could one be used to block gamma radiation?
What happens to the radiation that's blocked, exactly?

I'd guess that it must be usable to block gamma radiation, since a portal that blocks out the mid-frequencies without blocking the high frequencies would have to be even weirder. At a guess, the radiation that's blocked is absorbed by the portal, just like high frequency signals sent into a low-pass filter are absorbed by the filter. That may help to explain why having a nuke go off near a portal causes it to become larger: when the physical structure of the portal itself absorbs energy it grows.

[end of speculation]

Baughn wrote:With the apparent low-band pass effect of portals in mind, could one be used to block gamma radiation?

What happens to the radiation that's blocked, exactly?

It would be absorbed by the force structures around the portal with unpredictable but usually disastrous effects. However, in the case of the Naypayidaw initiation, the portal was closed before the device initiated so the question doesn't arise. By the way, to clear one point up, yes, one can radio through the portal provided one has a direct line of sight from transmitter through the portal to the receiver. No line of sight, no transmission. Also, there's a lot of inteference on the signal (think lots of white noise) and this makes high-quality transmissions dfifficult. The humans got really lucky when they sent the Predator in; it didn't go in far and got out quickly. For the sort of message volume that's needed now humans occupy Hell, laying fiber-optics comms lines is a much better and more reliable bet. Another spoiler for you
Spoiler