[STGOD 2] Nations and Military

[Alyrium Denryle]

OOH! *goes to, but restrains self from hugging Raxmei*

[Thirdfain]

Department information has been updated. See State Ministry of Trade for trade information.

I just noticed: Your escorts are Cruiser-sized vessels, which are four times the size of most other escorts in the field. I hope that you reflect this in the number of Cruisers you field.... In other words, I would ask that you either scale down the size of your escort vessel considerably, or only field a much smaller fleet.

[Stormbringer]

Escorts had better be escort sized or they'll be counted as capital ships. Please keep them in line with that.

[Sea Skimmer]

Then I call in the air-support

Which gets gunned down by the SPAAG the unit is using to clear buildings with.

True, I cant mount much of that, but I do have walkers, and tanks to make up the difference...and orbital bombardments....

And without proper infantry support they all die really easily. Overuse of orbital bombardment is a bad-fucking idea, especially with such densely populated planets. The defender would have a firepower advantage anyway, since there surface-to-surface firepower isn't constrained in any way.

[Thirdfain]

The defender would have a firepower advantage anyway, since there surface-to-surface firepower isn't constrained in any way.

I don't believe that's the case. Orbiting warships can bring down fire pretty much on call- if a soldier on the ground can paint a target, an orbiting warship can shoot it.

And without proper infantry support they all die really easily.

True enough. I would reccommend that Alryium uses genetic modification to make his soldiers- a strain of larger, stronger warriors, better suited for combat on the scale which empires like the TSC or the Shadow Empire can wage.

Which gets gunned down by the SPAAG the unit is using to clear buildings with.

AA guns/missiles are not perfect- against a lone SPAAG, I would expect a wing of fighters to take few or no casualties before delivering their payload.

[Stormbringer]

I don't believe that's the case. Orbiting warships can bring down fire pretty much on call- if a soldier on the ground can paint a target, an orbiting warship can shoot it.

You might be able to, but all you'll have is a ruined world in the midst of a nuclear winter if you rely on orbital bombardment. And it still isn't perfect, with the kind of weapons used their will be collateral damage if you're too close and there will be some misses.

DON'T NEGLECT GROUNDWARFARE.

[Thirdfain]

You might be able to, but all you'll have is a ruined world in the midst of a nuclear winter if you rely on orbital bombardment. And it still isn't perfect, with the kind of weapons used their will be collateral damage if you're too close and there will be some misses.

DON'T NEGLECT GROUNDWARFARE.

It is quite possible to arm warships with antiplanet weapons which don't cause widespread destruction.

[Stormbringer]

Ships Classes

Capital Ships


25 - Swift Sword-class Battleship (1.8 km)

• 20 - missle tubes (15 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (600)
  40 - heavy x-ray lasers (5.5 megatons, 15 sec refire rate) (880)
  100 - point defense gatling lasers

25 - Shadow Hunter-class Battleship (1.9 km)

• 10 - heavy missle tubes (30 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (500)
  30 - x-ray lasers (15 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (900)
  120 - point defense gatling lasers

50 - Hearts Blade-class Fleet Battle Carriers (2.2 km)

• 10 - x-ray lasers (20 megatons, 20 sec refire rate) (600)
  120 - point defense gatling lasers
  
  400 - spacecraft (275 fighters, 125 bombers)

75 - Divine Wrath-class Battlecruisers (1.3 km)

• 50 - x-ray lasers (10 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (1000)
  5 - missles tubes (20 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (200)
  90 - point defense gatling lasers

25 - Long Sword-class Missle Cruisers (1.5km)

• 45 - long range missles tubes (25 megatons, 60 sec refire rate)(1125)
  100 - point defense gatling lasers

Escort Vessels


300 - Retribution-class heavy cruisers (900 m)

• 30 - x-ray lasers (5 megatons, 20 sec refire rate) (450)
  6 - missle tubes (15 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (180)
  70 - point defense gatling lasers

300 - Sabre-class light cruisers (820 m)

• 25 - x-ray lasers (5 megatons, 20 sec refire rate) (375)
  4 - missle tubes (15 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (120)
  60 - point defense gatling lasers

400 - Dagger-class destroyers (670 m)

• 16 - x-ray lasers (5 megatons, 20 sec refire rate) (240)
  4 - missle tubes (15 megatons, 30 sec refire rate) (120)
  50 - point defense gatling lasers

Will be updating this with the sheild numbers soon.

[Sea Skimmer]

I don't believe that's the case. Orbiting warships can bring down fire pretty much on call- if a soldier on the ground can paint a target, an orbiting warship can shoot it.

Not my point even remotely, I said SURFACE to SURFACE. As in fired from one part of the planet onto another. The defender can have a 400 square mile bunker filled with thousands of hypersonic cruise missiles armed with 250-megaton warheads if such is desired.

However the defender has a strong interest in limiting damage to the world. If the attacker makes rampant use of orbital bombardment then they lose that interest and can use their high yield advantage to wipe the invading army out to the man. I really hope people will think about the consequences of such bombardments before they conduct them, its pretty clear many of you where not in STGOD 1.

AA guns/missiles are not perfect- against a lone SPAAG, I would expect a wing of fighters to take few or no casualties before delivering their payload.

You don’t honestly expect to be able to send 72 aircraft against one company do you? You might want to take a look at the disparity between armored vehicles and aircraft in say the Soviet Group of Forces in Germany. Hint, it had over ten times the armor compared to aircraft.

Know what you're going to be able to send against a company in reality? Perhaps one plane periodically. The majority of your atmospheric force has this little problem in the form of the swarm of dropships pouring troops down onto your world and all the defenses and aircraft they're bringing.

[Stormbringer]

It is quite possible to arm warships with antiplanet weapons which don't cause widespread destruction.

To a degree. But a ship's high power weapons are still going to cause collateral damage. You'll actually need ground forces to do something more than take scorched balls of rock.

And at the point you start deploying specialized weapons from your ships you're just spending resources that would be better served by just having the right equipment on the ground.

[Thirdfain]

Stormbringer- looking at your ship list, I noticed that your escorts include 600 warships nearly a kilometer in length, after you explicetly stated, at the beginning of the STGOD, that the 1000 escorts were to include corvettes, frigates, and a few destroyers and light cruisers. I would ask that you ramp down your numbers a little, or else provoke the other STGOD members into drastically increasing the scaling of their fleets.

[Stormbringer]

Stormbringer- looking at your ship list, I noticed that your escorts include 600 warships nearly a kilometer in length, after you explicetly stated, at the beginning of the STGOD, that the 1000 escorts were to include corvettes, frigates, and a few destroyers and light cruisers. I would ask that you ramp down your numbers a little, or else provoke the other STGOD members into drastically increasing the scaling of their fleets.

Can you please provide the quote? I don't recall ever saying anything like that? The closest I found was a quote by Sea Skimmer saying escorts shouldn't just be smaller versions of your capital ships.

Mine aren't. The firepower is lower than capital ships, most by a fair amount.

[Alyrium Denryle]

True enough. I would reccommend that Alryium uses genetic modification to make his soldiers- a strain of larger, stronger warriors, better suited for combat on the scale which empires like the TSC or the Shadow Empire can wage.

I have considered this one...I think a warrior cast/modified volunteers may come in handy.

They will be too heavy to glide, but that can be compensated for.

OOB updated

[Thirdfain]

Can you please provide the quote? I don't recall ever saying anything like that? The closest I found was a quote by Sea Skimmer saying escorts shouldn't just be smaller versions of your capital ships.

Mine aren't. The firepower is lower than capital ships, most by a fair amount.

I'll go look for it- admitadly, it's only a faint memory, and may not be tue at all.

Never the less, the majority of your escort vessels have more than a full third of the firepower of the largest vessels. I don't like that at all, and frankly, I don't want to have to go and turn all my frigates and destroyers into heavy cruisers and light cruisers. It doesn't make sense to have a fleet in which your smallest vessel is about a quarter the size of your largest, and most are larger.

[Darksider]

I finally updated my OOB. (Instead of putting figures for each weapon i got a little lazy and put down total weapon output.)

Questions???

Comments????

Death threats???

(It's on pg. 11)

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Department information has been updated. See State Ministry of Trade for trade information.

I just noticed: Your escorts are Cruiser-sized vessels, which are four times the size of most other escorts in the field. I hope that you reflect this in the number of Cruisers you field.... In other words, I would ask that you either scale down the size of your escort vessel considerably, or only field a much smaller fleet.

I've added the rest of my escort vessels and I've also taken this into account and updated the Kamenev accordingly.

[Raxmei]

I finally updated my OOB. (Instead of putting figures for each weapon i got a little lazy and put down total weapon output.)

Questions???

Comments????

Death threats???

(It's on pg. 11)

Your shields recharge too fast. That should be readily apparent by comparing your firepower to your shield power. Most ship stats posted so far have shields charge at 5 MT/s, and the highest I've seen is 7. If you divide your charge rate by 5 that should be about right.

[Darksider]

I finally updated my OOB. (Instead of putting figures for each weapon i got a little lazy and put down total weapon output.)

Questions???

Comments????

Death threats???

(It's on pg. 11)

Your shields recharge too fast. That should be readily apparent by comparing your firepower to your shield power. Most ship stats posted so far have shields charge at 5 MT/s, and the highest I've seen is 7. If you divide your charge rate by 5 that should be about right.

what about firepower???

To high, to low or just right?????

[Sea Skimmer]

Can you please provide the quote? I don't recall ever saying anything like that? The closest I found was a quote by Sea Skimmer saying escorts shouldn't just be smaller versions of your capital ships.

Mine aren't. The firepower is lower than capital ships, most by a fair amount.

I did say that. Your smallest ship is in fact at the upper range of what an escort should be. We discussed this previously. I will say again, the vast majority of escorts should be several hundred meters long. A few cruisers, which act as flotilla leader or raiders are all right but there numbers should be in the two digit range.

[Thirdfain]

Your escorts are a little too powerful (1 gt sheilding on a frigate, with over a third of a Dradnought's firepower)

but you have far fewer than other do- even with your 25% fleet reduction, you only have 400 escorts. My advice? crank your ships down a bit (200 odd megaton/minute output on your smallest escorts, .5-.7 gig shielding) and field a greater number.

[Stormbringer]

I did say that. Your smallest ship is in fact at the upper range of what an escort should be. We discussed this previously. I will say again, the vast majority of escorts should be several hundred meters long. A few cruisers, which act as flotilla leader or raiders are all right but there numbers should be in the two digit range.

And exactly what should the firepower be for an escort? We never defined that and I'm just sort of winging it.

And the size are part of the design philosphy. They are a long slender vessels rather than blocky ships.

[Sea Skimmer]

And exactly what should the firepower be for an escort? We never defined that and I'm just sort of winging it.

And the size are part of the design philosphy. They are a long slender vessels rather than blocky ships.

You need to at least provide the other dimensions of the ship, and a block coefficient would also be good.

[Stormbringer]

And exactly what should the firepower be for an escort? We never defined that and I'm just sort of winging it.

And the size are part of the design philosphy. They are a long slender vessels rather than blocky ships.

You need to at least provide the other dimensions of the ship, and a block coefficient would also be good.

I know. And I intend to once I get to working on it more. And what's a block coefficient?

[Sea Skimmer]

I know. And I intend to once I get to working on it more. And what's a block coefficient?

I think you still need to tone it way down with destroyers and frigates, not heavy and light cruisers.

As for a block coefficient, it is how you determine a vessels displacement for its hullform. A coefficient of 1.00 would be a rectangular vessel; one of .6 would give you something like the hull of a WW2 battleship. Though our hulls would look different since they would be symmetrical. To get your finnal displacement, you take the displacement of the vessels dimensions multiplied together and then multiply that by the coefficient. Thus a 100x50x50 vessel with a .5 block coefficient would displace 125,000 cubic meters, or 125,000 tons, a ton of water is almost exactly one cubic meter. More then close enough for what we are doing.

I'd hope to avoid this sort of detail, I thought everyone would go with fairly symetrical ovids for hulls. But if you want an irregular, and stupid if you ask me, hull then it’s a wise move. A long slender hull would have a low coefficient.

[Stormbringer]

I think you still need to tone it way down with destroyers and frigates, not heavy and light cruisers.

I'll do that.