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Starglider wrote:There is plenty of scope for debate in exactly what utility should be assigned to, but certainly there are defensible cases when killing some humans (civilians or otherwise) to prevent the death of even more is justified.

And who cares, since in strategic policy this interest is specifically waived when it interferes with the interests of the nation-state in particular? You know that, and I know that. Its a red herring.

So radio and, I presume, cell phone transmissions affect demons? I wonder if this is useful, e.g., using the EF-111 and other electronic warfare systems to deter demon attacks by having them pump out enough radio energy to cause pain. (Compare this to the Long Range Acoustic Device (LRAD) and its function as a non-lethal weapon.)

Also, can the demons intercept radio transmissions from those used by the military? I shudder to think what advantages this would give Hell's forces. Or will encryption render them unintelligible to demons?

Sidewinder wrote:So radio and, I presume, cell phone transmissions affect demons?

Yep. BTW demon telepathy appears to use conventional frequency modulation...

Also, can the demons intercept radio transmissions from those used by the military? I shudder to think what advantages this would give Hell's forces. Or will encryption render them unintelligible to demons?

Lakeenah can't even understand GSM digital cellphone signals, never mind frequency-hopping military ones. In any case I don't think the demon's tounges ability extends to cracking encryption. That said, the comms situation for the giant human army has to be an absolute nightmare of incompatible systems from many different countries and time periods. Broadcasting in the clear is the quick and easy lowest common denominator, and it would not surprise me if the demons managed to pick up a few transmissions. Not that it will do them much good.

RAF Boulmer and RAF Scampton are responsible for controlling the airspace over the UK. I'm not sure if the radar at RAF Fylingdales can track low level targets anyway.
Does sound like the time to saturate the area with air surveillance though.

Wouldn't it be hilarious if, while Euryale is transmitting coordinates, some death metal music comes on and the portal ends up missing by miles? After that incident, "Satan's music" will be immensely disliked by the demons. Irony, no?

Also, having THE Julius Caesar lead PLFH would be badass.

Sidewinder wrote:So radio and, I presume, cell phone transmissions affect demons? I wonder if this is useful, e.g., using the EF-111 and other electronic warfare systems to deter demon attacks by having them pump out enough radio energy to cause pain. (Compare this to the Long Range Acoustic Device (LRAD) and its function as a non-lethal weapon.)

It would really piss Satan off when his army returns at full strength while admitting that they couldn't even get close to the humans due to the pain.

Also, can the demons intercept radio transmissions from those used by the military? I shudder to think what advantages this would give Hell's forces. Or will encryption render them unintelligible to demons?

I don't think the demons can even handle unencrypted digital transmissions, let alone encrypted ones.

Eulogy wrote:Also, having THE Julius Caesar lead PLFH would be badass.

Pity he wouldn't know enough about modern weaponry to be useful.

Chant it with me now... "Ceasar..."

bilateralrope wrote:
Pity he wouldn't know enough about modern weaponry to be useful.

That's not true. Plenty of native African tribal leaders were able to run highly successful insurgencies against colonial powers in the 19th century. Remember that most of the liberated humans ultimately will be unarmed with modern weapons. We just can't get enough guns to them fast enough. Caesar has done counterinsurgency before (extensively) with iron-age weapons, and he'd be certain to know how to lead a bunch of humans armed with tridents from the other side of that equation.

Yes! I knew there was a good reason for me to log on before going to work! Thanks for the new chapter!

Excellent addition, Stuart! I'm practically slavering to see the next installment.

BTW, the "Cleaned Up" version has been updated.

NecronLord wrote:Chant it with me now... "Ceasar..."

Caesar ... Caesar ... Caesar ... CAESAR ... CAESAR ... CAESAR!!!!

I smell much cremation on the wind. Humanity will NOT be pleased, and they will want blood. Will the Shep option be exercised? Stay tuned for the next installment of ARMAGEDON????

(Like crack, man! Or cake! You must eat the cake!)

You do realize what this means? Caesar wasn't very tactful before he died. He'll be absolutely intolerable once he reads a history book.

Think about all the other egotistical historical figures like Alexander the Great. I'm sure they'll be absolutely insufferable once they learn how posterity holds them in such high esteem.

Zim wrote:Think about all the other egotistical historical figures like Alexander the Great. I'm sure they'll be absolutely insufferable once they learn how posterity holds them in such high esteem.

Dude, Alexander believed he was a living god. He was absolutely insufferable while he was still alive.

Starglider wrote:Lakeenah can't even understand GSM digital cellphone signals, never mind frequency-hopping military ones. In any case I don't think the demon's tounges ability extends to cracking encryption.

Oooh, I anticipate what such contacts will look like.

By the way, "Hallam"? I got the FM part, but...

Isn't Stuart Mackey a New Zealander, or did I miss something major (no real surprise if I did)?

Still good to see the RAAF turning up and getting ready to add their bit to the fireworks.

Edward Yee wrote:By the way, "Hallam"? I got the FM part, but...

http://www.hallamfm.co.uk/

fnord wrote:Isn't Stuart Mackey a New Zealander, or did I miss something major (no real surprise if I did)?

Still good to see the RAAF turning up and getting ready to add their bit to the fireworks.

Stuart Mackey is indeed a drunken kiwi, but it's all ANZAC in the end. Was good to see RAAF big birds in action, although I had thought that squadrons were usually refered to as 'flights', i.e 75 flight(Murderous Maruading Magpies, a Hornet group with a rich history).

"Isn't Stuart Mackey a New Zealander, or did I miss something major (no real surprise if I did)? "

I thought he was. As a denizen of Sydney ( the second biggest NZ city! ) the lingo didn't work.

Stuart, Kiwis don't speak ocker or strine. Though that might not be immediately apparent to those outside our little orb. Ask Shane.

"Still good to see the RAAF turning up and getting ready to add their bit to the fireworks."

Yeah, it is too rare that we drop ordinance on enemy targets.

"Zim wrote:
Think about all the other egotistical historical figures like Alexander the Great. I'm sure they'll be absolutely insufferable once they learn how posterity holds them in such high esteem.

Dude, Alexander believed he was a living god. He was absolutely insufferable while he was still alive."

There will be any number of such people, generals, rulers, sages etc. If need be we can treat him and the others as historical icons, and leave them in the hands of Unis etc. Alexander's hubris would be spiked by people treating him as an interesting person but just another person, though one requiring meds.

"Wouldn't it be hilarious if, while Euryale is transmitting coordinates, some death metal music comes on and the portal ends up missing by miles? After that incident, "Satan's music" will be immensely disliked by the demons. Irony, no? "

Or most heavy metal/hard rock music.

Jonathan

Ave Ceasar !

Now we have to look for Titus Pullo and Lucius Vorenus - or better, give him a present: the conspirators

*tch* Caesar!? He's not that special, Caesar didn't lead charges straight into the teeth of the enemy, he never single-handedly (plus two shield bearers) took on the garrison of a fortress, and the only wounds he sustained were on the steps of the Senate. I want some Megas Alexandros!

Darth Wong wrote:It's interesting how he would not view the complete annihilation of an entire nation as some awful Machiavellian thing he does to ensure the survival of his own nation by maintaining a severe deterrent despite the personal shame and horror of such an act, but rather, as something he would "happily" or casually do.

He's not even managing that. The complete annihilation of a nation, "down to the last kitten" as he puts it, is utterly unnecessary to ensure the survival of one's own. Unless we were dealing with a race of supermen who exhale nerve gas and shit anti-matter, in which case it might be justified. His statements are nothing more than advocating violence merely for the sake of violence.

Darth Wong wrote:Alexander believed he was a living god. He was absolutely insufferable while he was still alive.

He probably had to eat some humble pie when he arrived in Hell. Likely Alex is a bit more tolerable now days, though not much.

deleted doublepost

Fyrwulf wrote: And then I'd send Marines in to kill everything down to the last kitten.

Heh , I remember that from Weber/Flints Crown of Slaves.

Declan

Stuart wrote:

Stuart Mackey wrote:Mass murder might be a better term, perhaps.

I'd argue that one isn't appropriate either. When doing nuclear targeteering we never - repeat never - deliberately targeted the civil population. We targeted specific objectives whose destruction would fulfill the target plan we were trying to achieve. snip

One of the reasons why I wrote TBO was to try and get people to think about what nuclear destruction actually meant for the people on the receiving end. It's not pretty, not pretty at all. Definately not an option one should use except as a last resort.

That's why I mentioned above the necessity of doctrine and the necessity of survival. A doctrine may necessitate an action or weapons, but one doctrine does not fit all circumstances, nor should it. It does not follow that just because you can, therefore you should.
The necessity of survival, they die or we die, would allow for such methods, unpalatable as they maybe.

Edward Yee wrote:By the way, "Hallam"? I got the FM part, but...

In joke for notherners. Hallam FM is notorious for two things; buying up just about everything in Sheffield so they can rename it after themselves (e.g. the 'Hallam FM Arena' and the 'Hallam FM Kop (a football stand)') or plaster their logo on it, and repeating their jingle after every single song. They've actually backed off a little over the last few years but they're still pretty bad.