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nygma619 wrote:What I don't get is why didn't gunray send these things down with them and have THEM guard the queen, since they were the only formidable thing against the jedi's. He knew the Jedi were down there, did he just think they were gonna smoke weed while they were down on the planet? Hell no, the queen would've been their priority.

I assume you are referring to the scene where Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan jailbreak the Queen. Probably because Droidekas are terribly suited towards escort duty. They are extremely effective assuming that they are not required to move at normal walking speed. In their ball mode they are extremely fast, however they are limited by the fact that they are unable to attack enemies. In their deployed mode, they are extremely slow, not able to keep pace with walking humans. Neither of those modes would be effective in this mission. Droidekas are at their greatest effectiveness if used in a similar manner to a police SWAT team, only being used in certain high risk situations and as a response if resistance is encountered beyond what standard battle droids are capable of. In addition, Theed was crawling with battle droids and tanks, it is likely that the TF leaders were merely overconfident as they are businessmen not soldiers. If you notice, the Jedi are sneaking around buildings being very careful to avoid battle droids they only attacked the Queen's droid guards after the droids had passed into an alley where the eight guards were alone.

Also Jedi is both singular and plural and why do you have an apostrophe on "Jedi's" ? It reminds me of the bartender on Nar Shaddaa in Jedi Outcast. "Never trust a bartender with bad grammar."

Because the Trade Federation are cheap. At the time, they only had so many of them. Look at the next two movies. They had far more resources and they were throwing them around like candy. They also don't all appear to have shields in TPM. Jar Jar took one out down on Naboo, and none of the others they had down there seemed to use their shields.

Not true we see those things in the palace later battling padme and company. And even if they are lousy escorts you can at least keep them around the droids as well.

Ah, the age old question, why aren't there enough tanks around when you need them. Why isn't there more guided munitions, or another Carrier Fleet to cover area X. I'm sure if the TF could make an army out of nothing but shielded walking machine-gun nests, they would. But since they went for the simpler B1's it shows they can't.

Let's remember that not all shields are the same.. they could behave differently. As far sa the LEth universal energy cage.. I was pretty sure it had some funky energy absorbing an retransmission mechanism that basically was akin to the Viper battle droid shield system (basically it sucks the energy in and throws it back at the enemy in some way), as well as having forcefields for immobilinzg, stun effects, etc.

There were also those force field shackles that held Obi-Wan immobilized. Of course that could be somethign to do with contact (perhaps they inflict damage or pain in such a way that distracts one's ability to connect to the Force, or requires a Jedi to use it purely defensively or something..)

Anyhow, even aside from the shield issues, the whole "magnetized wall" bit might actually just point to droidekas being able to counter TK attacks with repulsors or tractor beams and related tech. They may even have some tensor fields and such to help compensate for attemps to constrict or crush them.

Another posisbility is that it may be a line of sight issue. a good many Jedi powers require a peculiar sort of line of sight (you have to "see" them in order to act in some way.) at least in any means of precision, and it may be that the shielding limits their ability to "target" a droideka. It is a rather spindly target for the most part, after all.

TheHammer wrote:Firstly, there is an element of risk in anything they attempted. Second, I'd argue that getting to the bridge WAS Their primary objective, and escape was a fallback. They capture Gunray, and the war is over before it starts. Also doesn't change the fact that the use of the force should have allowed them to deal with the two destroyer droids relatively quickly.

They would still need more time to cut the doors, and that's assuming Gunray is even on the bridge... and not, say, guarded by a dozen more droidekas.

Remember the sequence of events. The Jedi are sent to investigate a blockade, and hopefully settle it in a way acceptable to the Republic. They are not sent to wage war on the Trade Federation. When they are betrayed and attacked, their first duty is to get that information back to the Jedi Order and the Republic, not to go looking for trouble. Their ability to survive and escape is more important than trying to end the war "before it starts." Strictly speaking, they don't even know the Trade Federation plans to invade Naboo; they have no evidence that the blockade fleet is preparing to invade.

The Jedi never really state what their plan is in attacking the bridge, but whatever it is, it must have been an improvised fallback plan: trying to force Nute Gunray to negotiate at saberpoint or the like. If they can accomplish this it's a great way to get them safe passage and resolve the whole issue. But if they can't, if there is a serious risk that the ship's security forces will attack them in overwhelming strength before they can cut through those big, heavy, armored blast doors... they should fall back and try to find a way to get off the ship.

Cutting those doors took time; their only hope was to get through before the security droids could rally to the bridge in sufficient strength to overpower them. The arrival of the first fast-moving destroyer droids suggests that this plan was about to fail; if two of them could show up now, a dozen more could easily be there a minute from now. Or a whole platoon of normal battledroids, or something else aside from the B1 and droideka types we'd already seen.

Sure, in a cage match two Jedi could beat two destroyer droids. But in the context of their mission, on a battleship full of robot troops, under those conditions, retreat made far more sense than picking a fight with what was doubtless just the lead wave of a nearly endless attack of security droids.

Connor MacLeod wrote:Another posisbility is that it may be a line of sight issue. a good many Jedi powers require a peculiar sort of line of sight (you have to "see" them in order to act in some way.) at least in any means of precision, and it may be that the shielding limits their ability to "target" a droideka. It is a rather spindly target for the most part, after all.

If this is the case then how does one explain the Miraluka, who can only see through the Force? There is also Obi-Wan's statement, "Your eyes can decisive you, don't trust them." It seems that Jedi can manipulate object that they cannot see directly, however it would likely require more concentration in that you would presumably have to visualize the object in front of you, although in the case of the Miraluka they would probably have adapted to that problem.

Different Jedi have different abilities. For instance Corran Horn has almost no telekinetic abilities to speak off but excels at energy absorption/dissipation. It could be that Visas Marr and her ilk focus more on sensory abilities because of their natural handicap.

The Force is a vast array of powers and it is only natural no one can master all aspects of it to same degree. For most Jedi non line of sight telekinesis may be simply an unattainable or unnecessary goal.

Simon_Jester wrote: The Jedi never really state what their plan is in attacking the bridge, but whatever it is, it must have been an improvised fallback plan: trying to force Nute Gunray to negotiate at saberpoint or the like. If they can accomplish this it's a great way to get them safe passage and resolve the whole issue. But if they can't, if there is a serious risk that the ship's security forces will attack them in overwhelming strength before they can cut through those big, heavy, armored blast doors... they should fall back and try to find a way to get off the ship.

Does anyone still has the novel TPM? I seem to recall that Qui gon blurbed that they couldn't get to the Federation leadership.
Presumably, this means that upon being attacked, the Jedi attempted to blast their way in through force.

PainRack wrote:

Simon_Jester wrote: The Jedi never really state what their plan is in attacking the bridge, but whatever it is, it must have been an improvised fallback plan: trying to force Nute Gunray to negotiate at saberpoint or the like. If they can accomplish this it's a great way to get them safe passage and resolve the whole issue. But if they can't, if there is a serious risk that the ship's security forces will attack them in overwhelming strength before they can cut through those big, heavy, armored blast doors... they should fall back and try to find a way to get off the ship.

Does anyone still has the novel TPM? I seem to recall that Qui gon blurbed that they couldn't get to the Federation leadership.
Presumably, this means that upon being attacked, the Jedi attempted to blast their way in through force.

The action in question takes place from pages 33-35 (with the gas attack on p33). Qui-Gon doesn't say anything from just before the gas attack up until this point:

The Phantom Menace Novelisation, page 35 wrote:Qui-Gon was hammering at the blast door with every ounce of strength he possessed, determined to break through to the treacherous Neimoidians, when his instincts warned him of danger from another quarter.
"Obi-Wan!" he shouted to his companion, who wheeled toward him at once. "Destroyer droids!"
The younger Jedi nodded, smiling. "Offhand, I'd say this mission is past the negotiation stage."
In the hallway in the area just beyond the area in which the Jedi fought, ten destroyer droids rolled into view. They resembled gleaming metal wheelsas they rounded a corner, smooth and silent in their approach. One by one they began to unfold, releasing tripods of spidery legs and stunted arms into which tripods had been built. Crooked spines unlimbered, and the droids rose to a standing position, armored heads cocked forward. They were wicked-looking and deadly, and they were built for one purpose only.
Skittering around the final corner to the bridge entry, they triggered their laser guns, filling the open area with a deadly crossfire. When the lasers went still, the destroyer droids advanced, searching for their prey.
But the anteway was empty, and the Jedi Knights were gone.

Besides trying to get to the bridge to have a chat with the 'treacherous Neimoidians', no particular plan was implied. Mind, if there'd been ten Droidekas in the movie, the OP's question might not have come up. Two Droidekas is enough for me to declare brown trousers time, ten would be enough to justify foetal position...