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if there will be a use we´ll be able to vote out the shit heads in brussels.

MKSheppard wrote: The difference is, you can vote out the shitheads in berlin...you cannot
vote out the shitheads in Brussels....

Salm already said it. One of the major points of discussion right now is how to increase the democracy within the E.U without giving to much voting power to the largest countries. Eventually, the model will resemble that of a federal state, with both the votes of each state and the state population being a factor in the election results.

The present situation is provisory. Still, it's not utterly undemocratic, since the comission is chosen by our elected leaders. And they don't hold the power they will eventually have once the E.U becomes more federal.

salm wrote:
sure, they´re not going to be pleased. but what are they going to do about it? they want to enter the EU as well. and they´re getting closer to get their chance. they´ve abolished the death penalty (only in times of peace though) which has been a big step. but they´re still in thin ice. they´re not going to completely fuck their chances up by anexing tc.

You underestimate the Turks; they would not abandon a nation of their fellows to the far from tender mercies of the Greeks (I suspect the result would be genocide) simply for economic security. The precepts of Atatürk are still the firmament of the Turkish Republic.

Muad'Dib wrote: extreemism of any kind is wrong, but the extreem left facists of europe are startign to make ole Adolf look amiable

Umm, excuse me? Extreme left fascists?
Fascists are extreme right. For a modern day fascist, look at W. Bush or Sharon. Extreme left is communist.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote: You underestimate the Turks; they would not abandon a nation of their fellows to the far from tender mercies of the Greeks (I suspect the result would be genocide) simply for economic security. The precepts of Atatürk are still the firmament of the Turkish Republic.

Firstly, they're not their fellows. They are cypriots. There are talks about uniting the island, which is desired by both parties. And where would the situation change from the actual?

The greek side is by far the richest and is much more strongly connected to the E.U than the turkish side.
The turks are the only ones who recognize the turkish side independence and that won't change.
The E.U would not invade the turkish side. The economic situation wouldn't change.

So, what's the reasons for the discontent?

The turks feel left aside everytime a country joins the E.U. If it's unfair or not it's a topic for another thread. And this particular country entry touches them in a nerve. But is that reason enough to be subjected to enormous sanctions and lose their opportunity to enter the E.U ?

Ted wrote: For a modern day fascist, look at W. Bush or Sharon.

Facism is an ideology where all power is centralized in the state. It is not a generic term for the extreme right wing. Shrubby is not a fascist as he believes in centralizing power in largescale business rather than in the state. Shrubby would be more accurately described as an authoritarian plutocrat.

Sharon is just a racist.