StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Ender wrote:The massed Imperial fleet with the Byss reserves drove the rebels out of the core and then attacked several key worlds IE Mon Calmari. The loss of this key territory and massive retreats cause numerous sectors to go rogue and either marginally align with the Empire, such as Balmora, and the others to turn into "fortress worlds". With the Galaxy gun, the defenses those fortress worlds had errected were rendered useless, causing most to capitulate. The Republic also chose to consolidate its fleets leaving most worlds undefended. In this manner they could launch offensive strikes still, fitting with the comment about them still having the upper hand. It works when you remember the Imperial Civil War was even more devestating then any other time during the Galactic Civil War. When the Galaxy Gun takes out Byss, hte huge reserve fleet in orbit around it was wiped out as well. Then the Empire reverted back into Warlordism once more. The Warlord fleets, signifigantly weakened, where beaten back by the concentrated Republic fleets, so the Imperial Remnant was back inot that slice while the Warlords tookup most of the outer rim and the republic had retaken the Core and Colonies and what not. And most of the worlds are still independent, which fits with what we see in HoT series and BFC.

That's a pretty good synopsis.

How do you figure that the republic's ships are much more powerful?

consequences wrote:How do you figure that the republic's ships are much more powerful?

I count up the number of guns and fill in the weapons yield with determined numbers like those in the STvsSW forum stickies, and add up for a total volley of guns.

By and large the heavier ships of the NR are more powerful then those of the Empire. I can post the list if you like, but I know there are some errors. For example I rated the Capital grade torps too low, and used 6 MT for the heavy capital laser cannons and 8KT for the standard ones, and are yet to sit down and recalculate.

The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

WTF are you talking about?
Where have we seen a "Nebula-class", ever?

There is a Republic Star Destroyer, at 1250km, while it is cheaper, it's not as independant as an ISD, which can go 6 years without needing any re-supply, compared to the 6 months of an NRSD.

It's not more powerfull than an ISD2 either, but is 20% more powerfull than the Mk. 1 ISD, I believe an ISD2 would still be able to take on two NRSD's by that estimate, but I'm biased towards my favorite ship.

The ISD2 rules joo!

His Divine Shadow wrote:

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

WTF are you talking about?
Where have we seen a "Nebula-class", ever?

There is a Republic Star Destroyer, at 1250km, while it is cheaper, it's not as independant as an ISD, which can go 6 years without needing any re-supply, compared to the 6 months of an NRSD.

It's not more powerfull than an ISD2 either, but is 20% more powerfull than the Mk. 1 ISD, I believe an ISD2 would still be able to take on two NRSD's by that estimate, but I'm biased towards my favorite ship.

The ISD2 rules joo!

WoTC and the Essential Chronology retconned the "Republic-class" (retarded name anyway IMHO) into the "Nebula-class."

Illuminatus Primus wrote:

His Divine Shadow wrote:

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

WTF are you talking about?
Where have we seen a "Nebula-class", ever?

There is a Republic Star Destroyer, at 1250km, while it is cheaper, it's not as independant as an ISD, which can go 6 years without needing any re-supply, compared to the 6 months of an NRSD.

It's not more powerfull than an ISD2 either, but is 20% more powerfull than the Mk. 1 ISD, I believe an ISD2 would still be able to take on two NRSD's by that estimate, but I'm biased towards my favorite ship.

The ISD2 rules joo!

WoTC and the Essential Chronology retconned the "Republic-class" (retarded name anyway IMHO) into the "Nebula-class."

No, they renamed the "nebula class" the "Defender class". The Republic class is still out there.

Actually Republic-Class works, sounds good too.
If it was republican-class, then we would have a Imperial-class analogy.

Still, they retconned it. Whether we like either name is just personal opinion.

His Divine Shadow wrote: WTF are you talking about?
Where have we seen a "Nebula-class", ever?

BFC. It is the sister design to the Endurance class Carrier

There is a Republic Star Destroyer, at 1250km, while it is cheaper, it's not as independant as an ISD, which can go 6 years without needing any re-supply, compared to the 6 months of an NRSD.

It's not more powerfull than an ISD2 either, but is 20% more powerfull than the Mk. 1 ISD, I believe an ISD2 would still be able to take on two NRSD's by that estimate, but I'm biased towards my favorite ship.

The ISD2 rules joo!

Actually, it is, using the canon numbers for an ISD 2.
A Republic carries 40 HTL Batteries, 40 HTL Cannons, 20 Ion Cannons, 10 Tractor Beams, And optional Interdiction capabilities sans bumps in the NJO era.
240 HTLs

And ISD2 carries 64 HTL Cannons, 50 MTL Cannons, 50 LTL Cannons, Unknown Ion Cannons, 10 Tractor beams
Good loadout, but not as good.

Of course, if you use the WEG ISD2, then it is more powerful with 50 HTL Battaries, 50 HTL Cannons, 20 Ion Cannons, and 10 Tractorbeams for 300 HTLs

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Still, they retconned it. Whether we like either name is just personal opinion.

They did not retcon it.

Ship: Republic class Star Destroyer
Class: Dreadnaught
Length: 1,250 meters
Crew: 8,168
Troops: 3,200
Cargo: 11,000 tons
Supplies: 2 years
FTL Drive: Hyper drive x2, Backup Hyper drive x10
N-Space Drive: unknown amount of Ion Engines
Power: Unknown
Hull: Unknown amount of Durasteel and Quadanium steel armor plating
Shielding: Particle and Energy (Threshold: unknown; Total: unknown)
Weapons:
40 Heavy Turbolaser Batteries
40 Heavy Turbolaser Cannons
20 Heavy Ion Cannons
Other:
10 Tractor beams
Gravity Well generators (No bumps, concealed within hull. Optional)
Fighters:
72 Starfighters

Faction:
New Republic


Ship: Nebula class Star Destroyer
Class: Battleship
Length: 1,040 meters
Crew: 7,039
Troops: 1,600
Cargo: 15,000 tons
Supplies: 6 years
FTL Drive: Hyper drive x1, Backup Hyper drive x10
N-Space Drive: Ion Engines
Power: Unknown
Hull: Unknown amount of Durasteel and Quadanium steel armor plating
Shielding: Particle and Energy (Threshold: unknown; Total: unknown)
Weapons:
40 Heavy Turbolaser Cannons
40 Medium Turbolaser Cannons
20 Heavy Ion Cannons
8 Concussion Missile Tubes (capital grade, unknown Magazine)
Other:
8 Tractor beams
Fighters:
60 starfighters

Faction:
New Republic


Different ships. The Republic is bigger and stronger. Both were published in CTD, and has been published in EU novels as seperate ships, so there was zero "retconning"

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Still, they retconned it. Whether we like either name is just personal opinion.

Fucking gay though, ST name ripoff....

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

I've seen bits for an ISD mark 3, but I don't know where the stats come from., It could be fan cooked.

Actually, it is, using the canon numbers for an ISD 2.

I stomp on that assertion, ISD2 is the ruler of the capships.
The mere idea that the cheap knockoff of the ISD can be anywhere near it is abhorrent and evil.
Besides you're just looking at numbers here.

A Republic carries 40 HTL Batteries, 40 HTL Cannons, 20 Ion Cannons, 10 Tractor Beams, And optional Interdiction capabilities sans bumps in the NJO era.
240 HTLs

And the 40HTL's are weaker than the ISD2's HTL's and it's still a fact that it's 20% more powerfull than the first ISD1, so it's not more powerfull than the ISD2, therefore it's weapons are weaker but more numerous.
WEG stats agree with that, they are less powerfull than on the ISD2.

Not only that, you do not know what kind of HTL turrets they are, for all weknow they are the double-barrled ones not the 8 barreled ones.

Anyway official information still says it's 20% more powerfull than an ISD1, nearly all of which are probably upgraded to ISD2 status by now.

And ISD2 carries 64 HTL Cannons, 50 MTL Cannons, 50 LTL Cannons, Unknown Ion Cannons, 10 Tractor beams
Good loadout, but not as good.

Of course, if you use the WEG ISD2, then it is more powerful with 50 HTL Battaries, 50 HTL Cannons, 20 Ion Cannons, and 10 Tractorbeams for 300 HTLs

I see the problem, you assume that the WEG 50 HTL cannons is somehow translated into 50MTL's.
It isn't.

Your numbers are also wrong, it would be 8 cannons per turret, not 6.

The actual loadout of the ISD2 would be:
64 HTL cannons(in 8 turrets)
50 HTL cannons(they're still HTL's)
20 Ion cannons
10 Tractor beams

It probably has an uknown number of laser-cannons(LTL's) too, I dunno where you got 50LTL's for your figures but an ISD1 is supposed to have 120 laser cannons(ref. SWICS).


In conclusion that cheap knockoff ship can go burn in a sun for trying to steal glory away from the ISD2

Ender wrote:Different ships. The Republic is bigger and stronger. Both were published in CTD, and has been published in EU novels as seperate ships, so there was zero "retconning"

And neither takes the crown away from the ISD

Ender wrote:

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

I've seen bits for an ISD mark 3, but I don't know where the stats come from., It could be fan cooked.

The ISD III was invented by WEG.

Oh, and I agree with His Divine Shadow. Neither the Nebula nor the Republic-class (Victory III, really) matches the ISD II.

nightmare wrote:Oh, and I agree with His Divine Shadow. Neither the Nebula nor the Republic-class (Victory III, really) matches the ISD II.

Ofcourse you do, people who disagree with me tend to dissapear, why, I have no idea *innocent look*

nightmare wrote:

Ender wrote:

Grand Admiral Jello wrote:The New Republic's Nebula class Star Destroyer has the shielding and weaponry of an Imperial-II Star Destroyer, at a fraction of the cost and size.

However, it is safe to assume that the Empire stuck with the design of the Imperial Star Destroyer and simply upgraded it to keep up with technology.

I've seen bits for an ISD mark 3, but I don't know where the stats come from., It could be fan cooked.

The ISD III was invented by WEG.

Alright, do you know where I can find the official stats for it then? That stuff I posted earlier is from my private stash that I am amassing in hopes of doing my own site some day

What kind of site?

His Divine Shadow wrote:

Ender wrote:Different ships. The Republic is bigger and stronger. Both were published in CTD, and has been published in EU novels as seperate ships, so there was zero "retconning"

And neither takes the crown away from the ISD

...

They both out gun an ISD 1 by a signifigant amount, and the Republic has more then 3x the HTLs of an ISD2. They are both suppossed to have better accel and agility, and shields equal to if not better. The ISDs have an edge in troops carried and an ISD2 is faster in hyperspace then the Republic, but not an ISD1. A Nebula is as fast or faster then both. The ISDs can remain deployed without resupply longer then the Republic, but when are you going to have to go more then 2 years without more supplies? THey Impstars carry more fighters then the Nebula, but late model Republic starfighters are better then their standard Imperial counterparts. Finally, the newer Republics can act as their own Interdictors.

By and large I'd say the newer SDs take the crown.

His Divine Shadow wrote:What kind of site?

A database of ships from different series. One of the biggest pains in the ass for me back on SB was trying to figure out the capabilities of each side so I could argue. I could never find many sites that gave everything like that, and some series don't have anything similar at all (IE Honorverse).

Right now I am at 122 wars ships, 27 B5 ships, and 30 Trek Ships

I'm way behind on Trek because I was initially only going to do warships, which they have few of, but then decided to go for all of them

...

Cheap knockoff ships, they can blow me.

They both out gun an ISD 1 by a signifigant amount, and the Republic has more then 3x the HTLs of an ISD2.

Thats a BIG unknown, with an even bigger ASSUMPTION.
First off the weapons are individually weaker, secondly we do not know how many cannons on a single turret.
The ISD2 has 114 Heavy turbolaser cannons, 64 do 10D damage, the other 50 do 7D damage
Thats a total of 1140D for the ISD2

The RSD in contrast has only 8D for it's heaviest turrets and 6D for it's other 40 cannons.
If they have the likely 2 cannon turrets I expect them to ave thats 120 HTL cannons with a total damage rating of 880D

The ISD2 still outguns it.

They are both suppossed to have better accel and agility, and shields equal to if not better.

Proof?

A Nebula is as fast or faster then both.

Proof?

but late model Republic starfighters are better then their standard Imperial counterparts.

Late model imperial strfighters are either TIE defenders or Skipray blastboats, both of which hold their own to the newest XJ X-wings.

Finally, the newer Republics can act as their own Interdictors.

So what?
The advances in

By and large I'd say the newer SDs take the crown

No, they can burn in space instead for thinking they could challenge the Imperial Star Destroyer, it's heresy to even think of toppling the ship that is Star Wars, esp. with a smaller non-imperial vessel.

You know, I am more and more suspicious to the 40 HTL turrets figure every time I see it.

I mean we know the 50HTL turrets for the ISD2 was dieted down to 8 turrets and 64 cannons instead, and the ISD2 by the stats of the creators, however stupid they are, intended to make the RSD weaker than the ISD2, as in knowing it's place.

So I think that in light of that, we should rework the 40 turrets like the ISD2 was reworked, because such an increase without substansially weaker weapons makes no sense, on a smaller ship nevertheless.

And official info still says it's 20% more powerfull than the ISD1, but not as powerfull as the ISD2, thats official fact people.

Also, someone suggested that NR vessels are more powerfull, I dunno where they got that, but it's wrong.

I've read official texts speaking that two MC80's could take on an ISD and so on.
Even so, we can look at the firepower stats:
48 Turbolaser Batteries

As usual, these are probably the standard double-barreled version, thats in all 80HTL's
This should be plenty enough to take on an ISD, but it's spread out over a larger surface that allows them to bring less weapons to bear than an ISD.
They have stronger shields, but Imperials have more punch

This seems to be the formula followed throughout the EU.