Adam Warlock making an ass out of himself

[Connor MacLeod]

Its people like Adam Warlock and outofstep that make the REAL fivers look bad. Folks like Phalanx are the real fivers. He has my respect because he actually DEBATES, yet will actually LISTEN. (This is why I get along so well with Connor! )

Pffffft. Nu-uh, I'm just as rabid and stupid as they are. Don't give me your respect, I don't deserve it or want it.

Adam and outofstep may or may not be right on the issues, but quit clowning on them. They're still my fellow Fivers and I gotta back 'em up, even when they mess up, because no one's perfect. If I don't have their back when they make a mistake, how can I expect anyone else to back me up when I make one? At the end of the day, Adam and outofstep could be wrong, and they might not be as smart, but they're decent people who'd probably buy you a beer if you met.

So Warlock being a nice guy is an excuse for his deliberate and blatantly dishonest debating practices, his misuse and outright twisting of facts, and his hypocrisy? We should just forget all that because he's a nice guy?

Or are you saying Warlock hasn't been dishonest and just made mistakes?

[Connor MacLeod]

While this is a possibility, it is very much true they have said horrifically stupid things. If you support these stupid things, you too will be mocked. Sorry, didn't you read the sign at the top of the page?

So? We've all said or done stupid things before, but I doubt any of us would appreciate being clowned on for it. Some good-natured ribbing would be fine, but there's no need for contempt. You wanna change someone's mind? Be civil with 'em and teach 'em. You don't see good teachers going around belittling students that get the wrong answer.

Where'd I say I supported their views on Babylon 5?

You think all Fivers follow the "party line", that we're some kind of hive mind, no reasonable people among us to find, we've all left sanity far far behind?

I guess you do, don't you?

Well here I am... bring your mockery. Laugh it up, you all should be thanking me, I'm gonna provide you with someone new, to make fun of, to ridicule.

You're ignoring the reasons WHY we are mocking Warlock (and to an extent most SB Fivers as well.) A number of Fivers are deliberately dishonest and manipulative people whose only interest is in being right at any cost. They misuse facts, they twist words in semantics debates, they make false claims....

Would oyu defend Adarx in the "Culture vs Triad" argument, evne though its been proven he made false claims? Do you Deny Warlock has deliberately made false claims based on bad science and inappropriate methods? Is it fair to others to have to put up with that when they should have a right to expect someone to debate them fairly?

This is more than just ribbing and jokes, these are deliberate and blatant insults to logic and to proper debating and analysis. If someone has shown they refuse to play fairly, I see no reason to continue granting them respect, because they are being disrespectful of me.

All you are going to achieve is making yourself look bad by insisting that they are not accountable for these sorts of practices.

[SirNitram]

Pffffft. Nu-uh, I'm just as rabid and stupid as they are. Don't give me your respect, I don't deserve it or want it.

Adam and outofstep may or may not be right on the issues, but quit clowning on them. They're still my fellow Fivers and I gotta back 'em up, even when they mess up, because no one's perfect. If I don't have their back when they make a mistake, how can I expect anyone else to back me up when I make one? At the end of the day, Adam and outofstep could be wrong, and they might not be as smart, but they're decent people who'd probably buy you a beer if you met.

While this is a possibility, it is very much true they have said horrifically stupid things. If you support these stupid things, you too will be mocked. Sorry, didn't you read the sign at the top of the page?

I wonder, which is worse? A nice and stupid person, or a mean and smart person?

I'd rather be honest and considered an asshole than be a lying prick. Then again, my cultural values are warped by years of rejection.

[[BL]Phalanx]

So Warlock being a nice guy is an excuse for his deliberate and blatantly dishonest debating practices, his misuse and outright twisting of facts, and his hypocrisy? We should just forget all that because he's a nice guy?

Or are you saying Warlock hasn't been dishonest and just made mistakes?

Dishonesty is when you believe one thing but support another. I remember once when I did a calc involving the 500 GT bomb in "A Day in the Strife"... someone had told me that the distance involved was 1000 kilometers, so I used that. Turned out that the number was wrong, and that the actual distance was 4000 kilometers. Now sure, I misrepresented canon data, but if that kind of mistake is considered dishonest, then I'm just as dishonest as Warlock is. Condemn me.

[SirNitram]

While this is a possibility, it is very much true they have said horrifically stupid things. If you support these stupid things, you too will be mocked. Sorry, didn't you read the sign at the top of the page?

So? We've all said or done stupid things before, but I doubt any of us would appreciate being clowned on for it. Some good-natured ribbing would be fine, but there's no need for contempt. You wanna change someone's mind? Be civil with 'em and teach 'em. You don't see good teachers going around belittling students that get the wrong answer.

Where'd I say I supported their views on Babylon 5?

You think all Fivers follow the "party line", that we're some kind of hive mind, no reasonable people among us to find, we've all left sanity far far behind?

I guess you do, don't you?

Well here I am... bring your mockery. Laugh it up, you all should be thanking me, I'm gonna provide you with someone new, to make fun of, to ridicule.

1) Persecution complex. Wah wah wah. I really don't care. If you don't want to be accused of the same bullshit that the other Rabid Fivers pull, don't support them. There are logical Fivers, support them.

2) You were 'backing them up'. This means you supported their views and their actions. Their actions include being lying, dishonest pricks.

3) Accusals of generalizations. Gee, where'd I say all Fivers are rabid lying pricks?

4) 'We've all done something stupid!' Well, Adam Warlock and his ilk are purposefully dishonest. So fuck them, and if you support that BS, fuck you too.

[[BL]Phalanx]

You're ignoring the reasons WHY we are mocking Warlock (and to an extent most SB Fivers as well.) A number of Fivers are deliberately dishonest and manipulative people whose only interest is in being right at any cost. They misuse facts, they twist words in semantics debates, they make false claims....

Would oyu defend Adarx in the "Culture vs Triad" argument, evne though its been proven he made false claims? Do you Deny Warlock has deliberately made false claims based on bad science and inappropriate methods? Is it fair to others to have to put up with that when they should have a right to expect someone to debate them fairly?

This is more than just ribbing and jokes, these are deliberate and blatant insults to logic and to proper debating and analysis. If someone has shown they refuse to play fairly, I see no reason to continue granting them respect, because they are being disrespectful of me.

All you are going to achieve is making yourself look bad by insisting that they are not accountable for these sorts of practices.

For alot of people, they don't take these debates as seriously as others. They aren't going to pop a tape into a VCR or crack open a book to double-check everything. So they remember incorrectly... it happens. Doesn't mean they're deliberately lying. If you consider that deliberately lying, I'm a dirty liar too, for using that 1,000 kilometer figure instead of the correct 4,000 kilometer one.

See? I told you I wasn't any different...

[[BL]Phalanx]

1) Persecution complex. Wah wah wah. I really don't care. If you don't want to be accused of the same bullshit that the other Rabid Fivers pull, don't support them. There are logical Fivers, support them.

2) You were 'backing them up'. This means you supported their views and their actions. Their actions include being lying, dishonest pricks.

3) Accusals of generalizations. Gee, where'd I say all Fivers are rabid lying pricks?

4) 'We've all done something stupid!' Well, Adam Warlock and his ilk are purposefully dishonest. So fuck them, and if you support that BS, fuck you too.

1.) Logical Fivers? Heh, surely an oxymoron...

2.) Backing someone up doesn't necessarily mean supporting their views and actions. I remember once in high school, my buddy Dang and I were hanging out at lunch, walking by the basketball courts. A basketball was knocked out into our path, and Dang kicked it off instead of picking it up and tossing it back to the players. What he did was wrong, but when it looked like the other guys were gonna fight him, I was still there to defend him. Right, wrong... in the end there's only loyalty.

3.) I sure get that impression around here. I felt obligated to fit that impression.

4.) Come here and try it.

[SirNitram]

1) Persecution complex. Wah wah wah. I really don't care. If you don't want to be accused of the same bullshit that the other Rabid Fivers pull, don't support them. There are logical Fivers, support them.

2) You were 'backing them up'. This means you supported their views and their actions. Their actions include being lying, dishonest pricks.

3) Accusals of generalizations. Gee, where'd I say all Fivers are rabid lying pricks?

4) 'We've all done something stupid!' Well, Adam Warlock and his ilk are purposefully dishonest. So fuck them, and if you support that BS, fuck you too.

1.) Logical Fivers? Heh, surely an oxymoron...

THEY EXIST! I'M NOT CRAZY!

2.) Backing someone up doesn't necessarily mean supporting their views and actions. I remember once in high school, my buddy Dang and I were hanging out at lunch, walking by the basketball courts. A basketball was knocked out into our path, and Dang kicked it off instead of picking it up and tossing it back to the players. What he did was wrong, but when it looked like the other guys were gonna fight him, I was still there to defend him. Right, wrong... in the end there's only loyalty.

Pardon me, I have to laugh at this sophistic peice of bullshit.

3.) I sure get that impression around here. I felt obligated to fit that impression.

Then you are helping damn all logical Fivers to the pit with their fanatical cousins.

4.) Come here and try it.

[Darth Wong]

I wonder if BLPhalanx plans to contribute anything to this board besides his attacks on its members.

First, he comes here and before anyone can say a word, pre-emptively accuses us all of being about to descend upon him like rabid wolves simply because he's a "Fiver". At no point does he attempt to provide evidence of this knee-jerk "attack the Fiver" mentality or his implicit claim that we judge a person by his allegiance rather than the content of his posts.

Then, he whines that we don't treat dishonest pricks like Adam Warlock with the respect they deserve, and says he will stick up for them because they're his friends.

Then, he turns around and accuses us all of unfairly assuming that Fivers all stick together (hmmm ... see previous point).

Makes you wonder why he bothered coming here. I get the distinct feeling he came here for the sole purpose of insulting us, since he doesn't appear to be making any other points.

[[BL]Phalanx]

THEY EXIST! I'M NOT CRAZY!

LOL.

Pardon me, I have to laugh at this sophistic peice of bullshit.

I told you guys I'd make you laugh.

Then you are helping damn all logical Fivers to the pit with their fanatical cousins.

That's exactly what I'm doing. Is it working?

Heheh

[[BL]Phalanx]

I wonder if BLPhalanx plans to contribute anything to this board besides his attacks on its members.

You actually cared enough to wonder about my plans? I'm touched...

First, he comes here and before anyone can say a word, pre-emptively accuses us all of being about to descend upon him like rabid wolves simply because he's a "Fiver". At no point does he attempt to provide evidence of this knee-jerk "attack the Fiver" mentality or his implicit claim that we judge a person by his allegiance rather than the content of his posts.

Nope. I knew you guys wouldn't, but if you can generalize about Fivers I can generalize about you. If you're gonna slag my buddies, I want you to slag me too. A guy's gotta share his friends' fates.

Then, he whines that we don't treat dishonest pricks like Adam Warlock with the respect they deserve, and says he will stick up for them because they're his friends.

Dishonest? Perhaps. Misinformed or unintelligent? Perhaps. But a prick? Nope. And that's why I'm sticking up for him.

Then, he turns around and accuses us all of unfairly assuming that Fivers all stick together (hmmm ... see previous point).

If you don't assume so, maybe you should. Hell, just look at me! LOL...

Makes you wonder why he bothered coming here. I get the distinct feeling he came here for the sole purpose of insulting us, since he doesn't appear to be making any other points.

Go with that feeling.

[SirNitram]

Ah, so he is a trolling moron. Ban the worthless bitch.

[Darth Wong]

He's trying to get us to start flaming him so he can go back to SB.com and say "see, they did exactly what I told you they'd do. They attacked me just for being a Fiver."

[Stormbringer]

Ah, so he is a trolling moron. Ban the worthless bitch.

Indeed, he's a trolling idiot. Apparently all he's done is come to troll and lower the collective intelligence.



[BL]Phalanx, unless you post something worthwhile and intelligent go away!

[Durandal]

Phalanx, you're missing the point. If Warlock is simply incompetent, it doesn't change the fact that he hasn't made a single, noticeable effort to correct that incompetence, and he continues to insist upon debating in fields where he has absolutely no knowledge beyond a few buzzwords and terms.

However, at this point, it's blatantly obvious that he's nothing more than a dishonest charlatan who throws fancy-sounding terms around to make his utterly ludicrous claims sound more plausible. See his latest feat in jaw-dropping stupidity involving baysean probobalistic rules. He simply throws the term out there when anyone inclined to do a Google search on the term will quickly realize that it has absolutely nothing to do with the point he's trying to make.

He's also made numerous claims that he has a Ph.D. (what fucking joke of an educational institution would admit to giving such a dumbfuck a Ph.D., I don't know), and according to Mike, he was claiming to be a certified engineer in Canada back on Brian Young's message boards. He hasn't earned a shred of respect from me, and your "He's a fellow Fiver" bullshit doesn't excuse any of his dishonesty or incompetence. Admit that he's a dishonest twat and move on.

[[BL]Phalanx]

He's trying to get us to start flaming him so he can go back to SB.com and say "see, they did exactly what I told you they'd do. They attacked me just for being a Fiver."

Not at all. Go to SB and run a search. I've made no such claims.

[[BL]Phalanx]

Phalanx, you're missing the point. If Warlock is simply incompetent, it doesn't change the fact that he hasn't made a single, noticeable effort to correct that incompetence, and he continues to insist upon debating in fields where he has absolutely no knowledge beyond a few buzzwords and terms.

However, at this point, it's blatantly obvious that he's nothing more than a dishonest charlatan who throws fancy-sounding terms around to make his utterly ludicrous claims sound more plausible. See his latest feat in jaw-dropping stupidity involving baysean probobalistic rules. He simply throws the term out there when anyone inclined to do a Google search on the term will quickly realize that it has absolutely nothing to do with the point he's trying to make.

He's also made numerous claims that he has a Ph.D. (what fucking joke of an educational institution would admit to giving such a dumbfuck a Ph.D., I don't know), and according to Mike, he was claiming to be a certified engineer in Canada back on Brian Young's message boards. He hasn't earned a shred of respect from me, and your "He's a fellow Fiver" bullshit doesn't excuse any of his dishonesty or incompetence. Admit that he's a dishonest twat and move on.

*sigh*

Alright, honor is satisfied. I've defended him as best I could. Frankly, I've often disagreed strongly with his views on B5. But I still had to stick up for him.

Moving on then....

[Darth Wong]

Alright, honor is satisfied. I've defended him as best I could. Frankly, I've often disagreed strongly with his views on B5. But I still had to stick up for him.

There is no honour in partisanship, Phalanx. That's what politicians do.

Moving on then....

Does that mean you intend to start posting something useful, besides attacking us all for unfairly criticizing Warlock even though you have failed to produce any evidence of our criticisms lacking merit?

PS. You said earlier that he may be dishonest, but he's not a prick. I hate to break this to you, but dishonesty is a bad character trait. It is impossible to be a habitual liar and a nice guy at the same time. One contradicts the other.

[[BL]Phalanx]

There is no honour in partisanship, Phalanx. That's what politicians do.

I was looking at it more as him being a "comrade".

Does that mean you intend to start posting something useful, besides attacking us all for unfairly criticizing Warlock even though you have failed to produce any evidence of our criticisms lacking merit?

PS. You said earlier that he may be dishonest, but he's not a prick. I hate to break this to you, but dishonesty is a bad character trait. It is impossible to be a habitual liar and a nice guy at the same time. One contradicts the other.

He certainly wasn't hostile to me whenever I disagreed with him. He never flamed me or called me a "traitorous Fiver". Whatever else you might think of him, he's not *nasty* to people.

I just don't want to betray that kindness he showed me.

[Master of Ossus]

Neutron capture only causes fission in nuclei that are unstable to begin with. That's why depleted uranium is useless for nuclear bombs; the most unstable radioisotope has been refined out of it.

In other words, Warlock is so mind-bogglingly stupid that he assumes any and all heavy metals are weapons-grade fissionable materials with highly unstable nuclei, so any object made of heavy metals will spontaneously fission when hit with a neutron beam (no wonder he tries to dismiss everything I say without explanation; his knowledge is obviously a miniscule fraction of what he claims it to be).

Mind you, that is but a fraction of the immensely cretinous stupidity in Warlock's argument. Neutron radiation has a powerful heating effect, since neutrons are much more likely to miss an atom or scatter off it (thus transferring energy) than to be captured by its nucleus. Therefore, a sufficiently intense neutron beam would simpy blow a hole through a starship's hull. To describe nuclear fission as the primary damage mechanism is a bit like saying that a bullet through the head will kill you through lead poisoning.

But of course, recognizing the primary damage mechanism would inevitably lead to the question of power levels, and Warlock wants to avoid that at all costs, hence his inane attempt to bastardize nuclear physics into a quasi-magical damage mechanism in which correlation between weapon power and damage is unnecessary.

LMAO! Perhaps his mind is made of weapons grade fissionable material. It would be dense, and unstable enough to fit the bill quite nicely.

[Master of Ossus]

Its people like Adam Warlock and outofstep that make the REAL fivers look bad. Folks like Phalanx are the real fivers. He has my respect because he actually DEBATES, yet will actually LISTEN. (This is why I get along so well with Connor! )

Pffffft. Nu-uh, I'm just as rabid and stupid as they are. Don't give me your respect, I don't deserve it or want it.

Adam and outofstep may or may not be right on the issues, but quit clowning on them. They're still my fellow Fivers and I gotta back 'em up, even when they mess up, because no one's perfect. If I don't have their back when they make a mistake, how can I expect anyone else to back me up when I make one? At the end of the day, Adam and outofstep could be wrong, and they might not be as smart, but they're decent people who'd probably buy you a beer if you met.

You shouldn't back up other Fivers just because they're Fivers. You should support ideas that are potentially valid. That's what I do with SW and B5, my two favorite sci-fi universes.

[Master of Ossus]

He's trying to get us to start flaming him so he can go back to SB.com and say "see, they did exactly what I told you they'd do. They attacked me just for being a Fiver."

Not at all. Go to SB and run a search. I've made no such claims.

That's not even what DW said. He was clearly using the future tense. If we flame you, then you'll go back to SB and claim we treated you unfairly. You're as bad as Adam Warlock!

[Steve]

Such is how SB has ended up, a multitude of people bound by the sides they are generally seen as supporting, and carrying more for friendships and comradeship over the aspects of the debate.

Hence why Phalanx, an altogether fair and intelligent person who is known for being conservative in his calcs, will stick up for his "comrades", even if it's a losing proposition.

It's actually quite interesting, and I suppose I can respect him for sticking up for his friends, although I think Phalanx should realize why they're being criticized and that they potentially deserve it.

[Master of Ossus]

Such is how SB has ended up, a multitude of people bound by the sides they are generally seen as supporting, and carrying more for friendships and comradeship over the aspects of the debate.

Hence why Phalanx, an altogether fair and intelligent person who is known for being conservative in his calcs, will stick up for his "comrades", even if it's a losing proposition.

It's actually quite interesting, and I suppose I can respect him for sticking up for his friends, although I think Phalanx should realize why they're being criticized and that they potentially deserve it.

I generally like to consider myself a loyal person, but I'm not going to stick my neck out to prevent a friend from losing as badly as he ordinarily would. Maybe if people like Phalanx here would just let them lose, then SB.com would be a better site for it. Maybe people like Adam would stop posting crap and start researching before they posted, then.

[Darth Wong]

The sense of fellowship emboldens people like Warlock. That's how he could post various asinine arguments such as "neutron beams will make an ISD's hull undergo nuclear fission" or "Minbari neutron beams are teraton range because they're green" or "Bayesian probability theory means that I can use circular logic with impunity" with a straight face.